FM meetings : Peace momentum stalls

[Bhim]

If speaking the truth is diplomatically low then be it.

There is no Border. Its still LoC and till the time its LoC no one needs any excuse to cross over from one part of Kashmir to other part of his country called Kashmir.'


As far as Mumbai raam kahani is concerned well there is no evidence against Hafiz Saeed neither could be proven in the court of law

Its not only Mumbai Ram Kahani, but also Delhi, Kashmir and a long list of it. Its with full evidence, where fortunately many perpetrators have been caught, interviewed, shown to world and their home logistics confirmed to places in Pakistan, still you say Proof Proof Proof.
Is this not denial of existence of culprits amongst your society?
Is our FM wrong in saying to take action against them?
Will this be not good for you too?
Or do you still consider these elements as angels of peace?

Or do you just want to now state that yes there is TTP for just Pakistan and AQ for just Afghanistan, but no one else on our soil?
Then Madam I see the troubles of your country being far from over.


Lastly I don't understand why you people are so overtly concerned with our kashmir or its people, why not worry about your domestic problems? You were at one time fully dedicated to the concerns of Palestinians also, but it lead you to nowhere. Fortunately for Israel it does not share a border with you.

 

[Hutchroy]

On that token, as the Pakistani Foreign Minister pointed out, the trial of the alleged 'masterminds' is proceeding, and India cannot impose 'deadlines' on the Pakistani judicial process, and neither can the GoP (which is fighting its own battles with the courts, rather unsuccessfully).

From the GoP's perspective, the Pakistani public is not going to look at any peace process sans dialog on the major conflicts and disputes between the two nations as 'meaningful'. Since the GoP cannot impose its will on the courts, the judicial process will take as long as it takes, and at the end of it India loses her excuse of 'complete the trial of the accused', and will either have to find another excuse to avoid dialog, or get down to discussing Kashmir, Siachen and the other issues. Since dialog on those issues is essential, from the Pakistani perspective, it might as well start now, since those issues will have to come on the table sooner or later.

As things stand at this moment, the longer Pakistan takes to address India's concern the more difficulties the Indian Government Political Leadership - at this moment the Congress and it allies - will face to have a dialogue with Pakistan without a so called "Punishment of the Terrorists" by the Pakistani Government. The more Terrorism India suffers, which may be attributed to Pakistani based "Non-State" Terrorists, the harder position the Indian Government will take vis-à-vis its relations with India.

It is the Government of Pakistan that needs to normalize India at least for the 100 to 150 Thousand Pakistanis who want "India Visit" Visas annually.

Yes the Indian Sikhs and Hindus (I don't think any of the Christians would be affected) also have places of Pilgrimage in Pakistan but they have no relatives in Pakistan for whom they would crave to meet.

As such Pakistan needs to normalize its relations with India (of course within its own interests) and have a long lasting Peace so that Pakistanis can get the benefits of Indian Education and Health Care Facilities and possibly other facilities too including more liberalized Visits to India.

Just my tuppence!

 

[Awesome]

It's high time Pakistan treated India the same way India treats Pakistan. As an enemy. Pakistani government's current strategy to achieve peace if being perceived as a weakness by the enemy.

Peace cannot be asked for. It has to be laid down as an option and both sides need to willingly take it. There is no willingness from India and you can't "convince" them.

 

[Trisonics]

Isn't this expected? India did have a dossier that had evidence against ISI's involvement in 26/11..what did Krishna expect? ..Seems like India never learns..this what has happened every time!!! Its kinda funny that he was accused of talking to people in India.....silly gimmick to divert the main issue and kudos to Pakistan, the Indian media forgot all about the real issues and Krishna on the phone was the main headline!!!!!

 

[mjnaushad]

Isn't this expected? India did have a dossier that had evidence against ISI's involvement in 26/11..what did Krishna expect? ..Seems like India never learns..this what has happened every time!!! Its kinda funny that he was accused of talking to people in India.....silly gimmick to divert the main issue and kudos to Pakistan, the Indian media forgot all about the real issues and Krishna on the phone was the main headline!!!!!

What evidence is that ISI involved.? No agency shows itself to Pawns...ISI is not a fool that it will say i am ISI and i want you to do this. There can be one thing that RAW impersonate as ISI to defame it and tell everybody i am ISI and carry out terrorist activities in its own country. Murder its own citizen........And then send dossier of involvement of ISI.

 

[Trisonics]

What evidence is that ISI involved.? No agency shows itself to Pawns...ISI is not a fool that it will say i am ISI and i want you to do this. There can be one thing that RAW impersonate as ISI to defame it and tell everybody i am ISI and carry out terrorist activities in its own country. Murder its own citizen........And then send dossier of involvement of ISI.

" Pakistani-American terrorist David Headley has told his interrogators that the Pakistani intelligence agency had paid Rs 25 lakh to LeT to purchase a boat which terrorists used to travel from Karachi. "

ISI funded LeT to buy boat for 26/11: Headley - India News - IBNLive

Seems like Quershi did not have an answer and decided to cry over krishna using his phone!

I know you guys don't buy Indian media but if his confessions or statements were recorded and presented to Pakistan ...I think you guys would be more than embarrassed.....lets wait for what was given as evidence and how Pakistan will react

 

[mjnaushad]

" Pakistani-American terrorist David Headley has told his interrogators that the Pakistani intelligence agency had paid Rs 25 lakh to LeT to purchase a boat which terrorists used to travel from Karachi. "

ISI funded LeT to buy boat for 26/11: Headley - India News - IBNLive

Seems like Quershi did not have an answer and decided to cry over krishna using his phone!

I know you guys don't buy Indian media but if his confessions or statements were recorded and presented to Pakistan ...I think you guys would be more than embarrassed.....lets wait for what was given as evidence and how Pakistan will react

As I said no agency reveal itself...Its surely RAW murdering its own people....

Anyway i have to sleep now.....Stay safe from RAW supported terrorist impersonating as ISI agents.

Bye.

 

[Jackdaws]

I beg to diffr.

I think that the Government of India and its Ministers, Political Leaders etc. have realised that the Indian Public - who vote them into office - are not going to be mollified until there is a "proper" punishment of the Pakistani Terrorists, I agree that they are "Non-State Actors", before India can move ahead to normalise its relations with Pakistan.

The Indian Leadership is thus unable to fulfil Pakistani Leadership's Demands.

As such let us wait and see which way “the ball bounces”.

Bingo. I hate the Shiv Senas of the world. However, if Manmohan Singh's govt. agrees to overtures till Bombay's perpetrators are booked, they have definitely lost my vote. I will vote for some random Independent candidate.

 

[Fireurimagination]

It's high time Pakistan treated India the same way India treats Pakistan. As an enemy. Pakistani government's current strategy to achieve peace if being perceived as a weakness by the enemy.

Peace cannot be asked for. It has to be laid down as an option and both sides need to willingly take it. There is no willingness from India and you can't "convince" them.

So you want to say since 1947 Pakistan has been treating India as a friend and Kargil, Mumbai 26/11, Mumbai 6th June train blast, Pune, Varanasi, Delhi, Parliament attack, Kashmir, Jaipur and countless more where all gifts by a friend

With this bunch of gifts, what willingness you want from India? What India is asking for, credible action taken on terrorists/murderers in cold blood of Indians? Is that too much to ask for, if yes, sure hell with peace, keep bringing your terrorist scums. India should have a list at RAW's office (People killed in India because of Pakistan/People killed in Pakistan because of India) and make sure that the list is balanced

 

[mikkix]

indians can easily made fools by raw and stupid indian politicians....
slums really need conspiratorial education..

 

[Bhim]

Was Qureshi directed to be hawkish by ISI?

Islamabad/New Delhi: A day after the talks between India and Pakistan, a hawkish Pakistan Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi threw diplomacy to winds and accused India of not being serious in taking forward the peace talks. This formally indicated that the peace talks had indeed collapsed.

India’s Home Secretary a terrorist? So says Pak Foreign Secreatry

What surprised diplomatic circles in Delhi was that Qureshi threw the rule books of diplomacy to the bin when he openly accused Krishna of taking directions from New Delhi when he (Qureshi) had gone out to attend to a call.

Former foreign minister of India Yashwant Singh called this the highest breach of diplomacy. Others said the Qureshi had hit Krishna below the belt by making personal accusations.

Sources in Delhi said that Qureshi was probably forced to remove his diplomatic gloves and take a hawkish position by the ISI and the Army as he had conceded crucial grounds to Krishna over Kashmir and Baluchistan in Thursday night's press conference.

Qureshi took a more hard stand on Kashmir too stating that Pakistan had a right to show interest in the affairs of J&K.

He said Jammu and Kashmir was core to Pakistan and the recent developments there could not be neglected.

Addressing a press conference in Islamabad on Friday, Qureshi accused India of being selective about the issues on the table. Pakistan was flexible, ready for all discussions and wanted a composite dialogue, he said and added: "There can be no conditions when two countries engage in a dialogue."
India had some core issues to discuss, but so did Pakistan and India had to understand that. "India cannot say we can discuss Sir Creek, but not Siachen", he said.

Meanwhile in New Delhi, the official machinery finally kicked into action on Friday over the controversial remark of Qureshi when he equated rabble-rouser and mastermind of 26/11 Mumbai attack Hafiz Saeed to India's Home Secretary G K Pillai.

On the issue of "hate speeches" by Jamaat-ud-Dawa chief Hafiz Mohammad Saeed, Qureshi said both sides needed to refrain from negative speeches. But in the same breath, he said "on the eve of this dialogue, tell me to what extent" did the Indian Home Secretary's remarks help -- a reference to G K Pillai's remarks at the Idea Exchange programme of The Indian Express this week, in which he blamed the ISI for "controlling and coordinating" the 26/11 terror attacks "from the beginning till the end".

In a way, he equated Saeed's recent anti-India speech in Lahore wherein he called for waging a war against India to the remarks of Pillai.

And then he said his Indian counterpart S M Krishna agreed on this.

Qureshi and Krishna were addressing a news conference in Islamabad on Thursday night after talks between the two nations.
Surprisingly, Krishna did not rebut Qureshi's remarks on Pillai.

The BJP on Friday fumed at Krishna's silence and regretted that the Home Secretary was not "defended" when he was "openly castigated" by Qureshi.

The Congress on its part described as ridiculous any attempt by Pakistan to equate Pillai's remarks with Jamaat-ud-Dawah(JuD) chief Hafiz Saeed's anti-India hate speeches.

"The Foreign Minister of Pakistan chose to attack India's Home Secretary. I regret he was not defended there by India's Foreign Minister," BJP spokesman Ravi Shankar Prasad said, a day after Qureshi's unexpected attack on Pillai at a joint news conference with Krishna after their talks in Islamabad.

Congress spokesman Abhishek Singhvi said, "The Home Secretary was simply making a statement of fact about what India's stand has been, It is only India's stand. I don't think there is any basis for comparison of statements by Hafiz Saeed or Salahuddin with the Home Secretary. That would be ridiculous."

Singhvi also noted that Krishna has not confirmed Qureshi's remarks that both the ministers were of the opinion that Pillai's comments on ISI's role in 26/11 were "uncalled" for.

Prasad while offering his preliminary comments on the outcome of the Indo-Pak talks said Qureshi was making an issue out of Pillai's statement which was nothing but a statement of LeT operative and Pakistani-American David Headley about the role of ISI in Mumbai attack. Headley has confessed to his involvement in 26/11 and is currently in FBI custody in Chicago in the US.

"They have no reply or content but they are comparing it (Pillai's remarks) with Hafiz Saeed without taking any action," Prasad said.

Qureshi's criticism was noteworthy as it was in response to a question on the anti-Indian rhetoric of Saeed and he cited Pillai's comments as a counter. Krishna's silence when Pillai was attacked by the Pakistani minister has raised eyebrows.

Pillai had early this week blamed Pakistan's powerful Inter Services Intelligence(ISI) agency for "controlling and coordinating" the Mumbai terror attacks in 2008 "from the beginning to the end".

Source: India Syndicate and IANS

 

[Bhim]

indians can easily made fools by raw and stupid indian politicians....
slums really need conspiratorial education..

What were you trying to say?
I am sure if it was a derogatory remark towards us then you owe us an apology.

 

[Bhim]

As I said no agency reveal itself...Its surely RAW murdering its own people....

Anyway i have to sleep now.....Stay safe from RAW supported terrorist impersonating as ISI agents.

Bye.

Haahaaa, Pakada gaya to RAW, nahi to mushkil se Ajmal ko Pakistani maana, aur jo baki mar gaye woh sab Indian..
some people never learn, still denial of reality.

Anyway tell this to your closest buddy in WOT, the USA.

 

[DGMO]

what makes u say that we made some kinda compromise??? this also falls under the category of making baseless allegations..

Both parties have their constituencies to whom they will have to effectively report back to, detailing what successes they've had. I'm sure India went into the meeting with certain requests / demands / assurances call them what you will, and didn't see the movement it quite hoped for. The positivity was lacking afterwards from the Indian side.

India needs this from us as it's hurting over 26/11, it's hurting over Hafiz Saeed's freedom, and it wants assurances, which in turn build trust to address the larger issues. Does it have a dependent partner? A willing partner? I'm playing devil's advocate, but you need to see this perspective.

I want Kashmir solved as much as the next man, but until the basic element of trust isn't there, and steps aren't taken by both sides to narrow the divide, talks will continue to prove futile.

I don't only want radicals dealt with for the sake of peace with India, but also for our own well-being and prosperous future.

 

[Jackdaws]

Both sides can shout their lungs out for all I care. David Headley is a wild card like Goran Ivanesevic was at the 2001 Wimbledon. He has upset the natural order of things. Now that India has veritable proof from him - they can't ignore it at all. After so much intrigue Pakistan finally accepted Kasab was Pakistani with a sizeable number of Pakistanis believing that he was kidnapped from Nepal or is a RAW agent! So Pakistan will not accept that ISI conducted 26/11. The whole "non state actors" bit is probably true. I don't think Zardari and co. sanctioned 26/11 - but isn't ISI a state within a state?