Egyptian Armed Forces

[The SC]

Korea has also just completed its new AESA radar and is ready to mass produce it for its new K-FX stealth fighter.

South Korea unveils new fighter jet radar designed for air dominance.

https://defence-blog.com/news/south...ter-jet-radar-designed-for-air-dominance.html

That is a very good step for SK..
It is unfortunate that the US did not want to sell them all the components to make their K-FX a true stealth fighter plane..so they can sell them the F-35..
K-FX is considered a 4+++ generation now.. till they make the missing components on their own ..like they have done with tank engines and transmission and now with this AESA radar..

 

[Mamajama]

I was reading on twitter and found there was a SAM command center at edex. Interesting.

 

[Gomig-21]

That is a very good step for SK..
It is unfortunate that the US did not want to sell them all the components to make their K-FX a true stealth fighter plane..so they can sell them the F-35..

True. I try to look at things like this in as nuetral a position as possible and while I agree completely with your POV, I still can't blame the US for their greedy way of thinking because they have the lead and the heads up on everyone, really, and so why shoot themselves in the leg? After all, it's nothing but business as usual. But you're right and with the orange baboon in office, as much as he loves SK or that the US has been SK's savior since 1950 including sacrificing many American souls to defend SK from the north, it was more about stopping the spread of communism and China really than an honest belief of defending a country from an invading entity, the US has given a lot to Korea and so I give them a pass on this one.

K-FX is considered a 4+++ generation now.. till they make the missing components on their own ..like they have done with tank engines and transmission and now with this AESA radar..

Whenever this topic arises, I can never help but think what the hell is stopping us from building a full fighter from start to finish? If we built 3 different variants of one back in the 50's & 60's, why would it even be a challenge to build one now? With much more technology and industrial capabilities than back then, you would think something like this......

.........would easily have its counter part today. Why on earth couldn't we build its sister of today? All the metallurgy and composite material are easily fabricated in Egypt from titanium to almost every single type of composite used in aircraft technology today.

All the computer technology and the avionics can is easily done in Egypt. Of course the radar in several forms can be 100% Egyptian without a doubt.

The only thing that would take a while would be the most difficult thing in any aircraft and that is the engine, of course. But the other option is simply to buy a few RD-93s from Russian which I'm sure wouldn't mind selling them to us just like they use in the JF-17 and we're off to the races. This is something that should've also been done during that horse's behind Mubarak's time. But now Sisi could easily appoint the right personnel to start and finish this program in an allotted time and on budget.

 

[Mamajama]

Whenever this topic arises, I can never help but think what the hell is stopping us from building a full fighter from start to finish? If we built 3 different variants of one back in the 50's & 60's, why would it even be a challenge to build one now? With much more technology and industrial capabilities than back then, you would think something like this......

.........would easily have its counter part today. Why on earth couldn't we build its sister of today? All the metallurgy and composite material are easily fabricated in Egypt from titanium to almost every single type of composite used in aircraft technology today.

All the computer technology and the avionics can is easily done in Egypt. Of course the radar in several forms can be 100% Egyptian without a doubt.

The only thing that would take a while would be the most difficult thing in any aircraft and that is the engine, of course. But the other option is simply to buy a few RD-93s from Russian which I'm sure wouldn't mind selling them to us just like they use in the JF-17 and we're off to the races. This is something that should've also been done during that horse's behind Mubarak's time. But now Sisi could easily appoint the right personnel to start and finish this program in an allotted time and on budget.

Now it depends on what type of fighter you want, a fifth gen or a fourth gen? It is impossible for egypt alone to develop a fifth gen fighter and there is no point in developing a 4th generation so late in the game. I do think Egypt could have the best success make a LIFT with combat capabilities like the FA-50 though and use it for training and export.

And you must consider partners as well, there are uae companies that could be in this project as well such as Strata for example which produced composite parts for Airbus and Boeing.



https://www.arabianbusiness.com/tra...is-capable-of-building-full-aircraft-says-ceo

 

[Gomig-21]

Now it depends on what type of fighter you want, a fifth gen or a fourth gen? It is impossible for egypt alone to develop a fifth gen fighter and there is no point in developing a 4th generation so late in the game.

Because there is not point in developing a 4th gen aircraft at this point, then the answer is quite obvious, wouldn't you think so? Nothing wrong with partners, of course, but a prototype needs to be produced to start the process just like everyone else who's attempting to develop a 5th gen fighter is or has done. That can easily be done by an all-Egyptian team of aeronautical engineers including a detailed description of all the functioning systems that would need to be produced along with the airframe.

And you must consider partners as well, there are uae companies that could be in this project as well such as Strata for example which produced composite parts for Airbus and Boeing.

While I think partnering up with the UAE or Saudiya is perfectly fine, even anyone else with the caliber and ability to contribute positively, but building a trainer? I wouldn't go that route, simply because there are way too many options for trainers out there (including in Egypt itself) and cheaper 4th gen aircraft as well. So anything in that level is not something that should be sought after IMO.

 

[Mamajama]

Because there is not point in developing a 4th gen aircraft at this point, then the answer is quite obvious, wouldn't you think so? Nothing wrong with partners, of course, but a prototype needs to be produced to start the process just like everyone else who's attempting to develop a 5th gen fighter is or has done. That can easily be done by an all-Egyptian team of aeronautical engineers including a detailed description of all the functioning systems that would need to be produced along with the airframe

So you wouldnt have a problem with collabarating with the Chinese or others to develop a fifth gen fighter if they give ToT?

 

[The SC]

True. I try to look at things like this in as nuetral a position as possible and while I agree completely with your POV, I still can't blame the US for their greedy way of thinking because they have the lead and the heads up on everyone, really, and so why shoot themselves in the leg? After all, it's nothing but business as usual. But you're right and with the orange baboon in office, as much as he loves SK or that the US has been SK's savior since 1950 including sacrificing many American souls to defend SK from the north, it was more about stopping the spread of communism and China really than an honest belief of defending a country from an invading entity, the US has given a lot to Korea and so I give them a pass on this one.



Whenever this topic arises, I can never help but think what the hell is stopping us from building a full fighter from start to finish? If we built 3 different variants of one back in the 50's & 60's, why would it even be a challenge to build one now? With much more technology and industrial capabilities than back then, you would think something like this......

.........would easily have its counter part today. Why on earth couldn't we build its sister of today? All the metallurgy and composite material are easily fabricated in Egypt from titanium to almost every single type of composite used in aircraft technology today.

All the computer technology and the avionics can is easily done in Egypt. Of course the radar in several forms can be 100% Egyptian without a doubt.

The only thing that would take a while would be the most difficult thing in any aircraft and that is the engine, of course. But the other option is simply to buy a few RD-93s from Russian which I'm sure wouldn't mind selling them to us just like they use in the JF-17 and we're off to the races. This is something that should've also been done during that horse's behind Mubarak's time. But now Sisi could easily appoint the right personnel to start and finish this program in an allotted time and on budget.

You know Bro that it goes the same for Russia as for the US.. it is business first.. so if you don't buy from them first they won't give you much.. but now that Egypt has bought the Mig-35 and promised to double the number if a particular missile come with it.., The engines might be possible..and even more, since Egypt has helped in financing new components of the Mig-35..

Even for Helwan.. the soviets proposed the Mig-21 in big numbers at that time and it was much less expensive than producing Egypt's own fighter plane..So for now it is just and still a question of economic feasibility..and if it is worth it or not! although for most of us who see it as a must we can't know the internals of what is going on about that.. maybe there are projects on the table and preparations waiting for the ripe time..

 

[BordoEnes]

True. I try to look at things like this in as nuetral a position as possible and while I agree completely with your POV, I still can't blame the US for their greedy way of thinking because they have the lead and the heads up on everyone, really, and so why shoot themselves in the leg? After all, it's nothing but business as usual. But you're right and with the orange baboon in office, as much as he loves SK or that the US has been SK's savior since 1950 including sacrificing many American souls to defend SK from the north, it was more about stopping the spread of communism and China really than an honest belief of defending a country from an invading entity, the US has given a lot to Korea and so I give them a pass on this one.



Whenever this topic arises, I can never help but think what the hell is stopping us from building a full fighter from start to finish? If we built 3 different variants of one back in the 50's & 60's, why would it even be a challenge to build one now? With much more technology and industrial capabilities than back then, you would think something like this......

.........would easily have its counter part today. Why on earth couldn't we build its sister of today? All the metallurgy and composite material are easily fabricated in Egypt from titanium to almost every single type of composite used in aircraft technology today.

All the computer technology and the avionics can is easily done in Egypt. Of course the radar in several forms can be 100% Egyptian without a doubt.

The only thing that would take a while would be the most difficult thing in any aircraft and that is the engine, of course. But the other option is simply to buy a few RD-93s from Russian which I'm sure wouldn't mind selling them to us just like they use in the JF-17 and we're off to the races. This is something that should've also been done during that horse's behind Mubarak's time. But now Sisi could easily appoint the right personnel to start and finish this program in an allotted time and on budget.

Do you even have the companies with the neccesary technology and know how do develop systems and subsystems from the ground up? Or else you are basically building a fighter consists mostly of foreign compenents that are bought of the shelve. A lot of nation can technicaly make fighter Jets, but to actually make on that is advanced and highly competitive or even worth the effort is another. Pakistan made the JF-17 with significant Chinese help, but that the JF-17 is capable of taking on a bulk of the Indian Air Force. If Egypt made something similar it would be useless against the Israeli Air Force because their fighter jets are highly capable.

They also require significant funding and infrastructure to even conceptualise one, let alone develop and build one. For example Turkey litteraly made an entire building complex who is solely dedicated to develop and focus on TFX/MMU fighter jet. Not to mention the massive workforce needed not only in engineers, but designers, technicians, artists, managers, organisers and etc etc. Best you just join ours hehehe.

 

[Mamajama]

They also require significant funding and infrastructure to even conceptualise one, let alone develop and build one. For example Turkey litteraly made an entire building complex who is solely dedicated to develop and focus on TFX/MMU fighter jet. Not to mention the massive workforce needed not only in engineers, but designers, technicians, artists, managers, organisers and etc etc. Best you just join ours hehehe.

I think they would rather join Chinese or Russian program lmao.

 

[ARCH٤R]

Do you even have the companies with the neccesary technology and know how do develop systems and subsystems from the ground up? Or else you are basically building a fighter consists mostly of foreign compenents that are bought of the shelve. A lot of nation can technicaly make fighter Jets, but to actually make on that is advanced and highly competitive or even worth the effort is another. Pakistan made the JF-17 with significant Chinese help, but that the JF-17 is capable of taking on a bulk of the Indian Air Force. If Egypt made something similar it would be useless against the Israeli Air Force because their fighter jets are highly capable.

They also require significant funding and infrastructure to even conceptualise one, let alone develop and build one. For example Turkey litteraly made an entire building complex who is solely dedicated to develop and focus on TFX/MMU fighter jet. Not to mention the massive workforce needed not only in engineers, but designers, technicians, artists, managers, organisers and etc etc. Best you just join ours hehehe.

We’d need to use Egyptians abroad who work for Boeing and other aviation industries as well as have the newly opening universities in Egypt contribute to the project (like Coventry). In terms of facilities funding won’t be a major problem in 2-3 years time but it’s how you build it in terms of equipment and so on. Who to co-operate with? I find the French and the Emiratis good partners, maybe even Israeli private firms since they have good relations with the UAE. However a project would need more years of good economic growth like the 2018-2019 increase, I’d mark 2026. For now Egypt should think about upgrading the F-16 fleet to a Block 70 standard, it all depends on the negotiation skills of Egypt. I might sound funny but I also mean signing early contracts for upgrades before Democrats sit in the White House.
Right @Gomig-21 ? Egypt trusts no Democrat..

 

[The SC]

Do you even have the companies with the neccesary technology and know how do develop systems and subsystems from the ground up? Or else you are basically building a fighter consists mostly of foreign compenents that are bought of the shelve. A lot of nation can technicaly make fighter Jets, but to actually make on that is advanced and highly competitive or even worth the effort is another. Pakistan made the JF-17 with significant Chinese help, but that the JF-17 is capable of taking on a bulk of the Indian Air Force. If Egypt made something similar it would be useless against the Israeli Air Force because their fighter jets are highly capable.

They also require significant funding and infrastructure to even conceptualise one, let alone develop and build one. For example Turkey litteraly made an entire building complex who is solely dedicated to develop and focus on TFX/MMU fighter jet. Not to mention the massive workforce needed not only in engineers, but designers, technicians, artists, managers, organisers and etc etc. Best you just join ours hehehe.

Egypt had all that 60 years ago.. It can improve on it if it sees the economical worthiness of such a project or not!

The Helwan HA-300 interceptor

Including the engine

https://againstallodds.fandom.com/wiki/Helwan_HA-300

 

[The SC]

You know, that is a great question. Never thought about it because I think all our minds have been stuck on the first step alone, first. And that's if even stealth-shaped aircraft can be picked up on radar to begin with. So while concentrating on that technological step, we haven't given any thought to the next step which is what you just mentioned. Now that you raised the important question, we'll have to look into it and find out if it's only picking up the target but then what? How do you lock onto it and what mode are you in when you're actually battling the stealth feature while trying to guide either an A2A or a G2A missile.



Mmmmm.....very interesting! Now that you mentioned that particular type of surface to air missile system, it makes all the sense in the world that Egypt went out and bought it! I'm sure you know that Egypt acquire the German IRIST-T-SL system and with the Russian super radars -- particularly the Resonance-SE -- once a stealthy aircraft is detected, the radar is probably commanded to signal specifically the IRIS-T missiles. It makes all the sense in the world. At first we were like wait, they bought the Kub, the Tor, S-300, and they have a whole slew of other preceding systems like the Pechora, Avenger even the Patriot (we think the latter is set up in Cairo and certain valuable areas that have been worked out with the US) and other systems and right after they bought a bunch of the S-300VM batteries, they went out and bought the IRIS-T SL and we were like "wuuut?" Now that you mentioned its effectiveness to target and track stealthy aircraft, it makes sense why they got it.

Usually they distinguish SAM systems by batteries, but the IRIS-T SL was by systems and according to Wiki, Egypt bought 7 systems which include the guided missile truck and the multi-mission radar.

That's great. I have been reading a little bit about how the X-band radar is becoming the one that's best suited for picking up stealthy targets and it's clearly that way in that picture chart. IIRC, Russians have been touting the X-band radars as the new type they'll be building for their upcoming radars.

Unique AESA technology proposed

July 18th, 2017

http://www.rusaviainsider.com/unique-aesa-technology-proposed/http://www.rusaviainsider.com/unique-aesa-technology-proposed/

 

[HD Seeker-5000]

True. I try to look at things like this in as nuetral a position as possible and while I agree completely with your POV, I still can't blame the US for their greedy way of thinking because they have the lead and the heads up on everyone, really, and so why shoot themselves in the leg? After all, it's nothing but business as usual. But you're right and with the orange baboon in office, as much as he loves SK or that the US has been SK's savior since 1950 including sacrificing many American souls to defend SK from the north, it was more about stopping the spread of communism and China really than an honest belief of defending a country from an invading entity, the US has given a lot to Korea and so I give them a pass on this one.



Whenever this topic arises, I can never help but think what the hell is stopping us from building a full fighter from start to finish? If we built 3 different variants of one back in the 50's & 60's, why would it even be a challenge to build one now? With much more technology and industrial capabilities than back then, you would think something like this......

.........would easily have its counter part today. Why on earth couldn't we build its sister of today? All the metallurgy and composite material are easily fabricated in Egypt from titanium to almost every single type of composite used in aircraft technology today.

All the computer technology and the avionics can is easily done in Egypt. Of course the radar in several forms can be 100% Egyptian without a doubt.

The only thing that would take a while would be the most difficult thing in any aircraft and that is the engine, of course. But the other option is simply to buy a few RD-93s from Russian which I'm sure wouldn't mind selling them to us just like they use in the JF-17 and we're off to the races. This is something that should've also been done during that horse's behind Mubarak's time. But now Sisi could easily appoint the right personnel to start and finish this program in an allotted time and on budget.

Engaging into a project like would probably be 10 times more difficult for Egypt today with the current generation of fighters out there to today. Even the United States that's an economic power house in the world today has not been able to develop and produce the F-35 on it own and had to partner with 6 other countries on the program to be able to get it done.

 

[HD Seeker-5000]

I wonder what would happen as well if Egypt attempts to posses a dedicated nuclear weapons program where it could and manufacture a nuclear bomb, just like how Israel, India and Pakistan did.

 

[BordoEnes]

Egypt had all that 60 years ago.. It can improve on it if it sees the economical worthiness of such a project or not!

The Helwan HA-300 interceptor

Including the engine

https://againstallodds.fandom.com/wiki/Helwan_HA-300

Yeah Turkey made airplanes at one point to. The difference is ofcourse the costs and sheer amount of advanced technology that is used in today's planes is far to big to make an accurate comparison. You would quite litteraly need dosens of companies along with hundreds of contracts to be assigned to even create the basic subsystems or suite for the airplane. That alone is gonna cost a lot of time and money. Then ofcourse you have the engine and design, not to mention radar and armaments.

If Egypt wants to take steps into the field of aviation, its best you start with small steps first before taking massive leaps. Basic trainers or advanced trainer jets always have a market, and they arent as expensive and time consuming to make. Plus with Egyptian Air Force's recent acquisition of fighter jets, no doubt there is a need for more of these trainer aircrafts.