China's navy no longer so inferior to Japan's, experts say

[boke]

这个标题是讨论中国的海军力量增强，我想现实的看，中国的海军力量还比较弱，现在有人说增长迅速那是因为忽略了中国海军发展的低起点，比较薄弱的基础上发展，中国海军的强军之路还比较远。日本根据二战结束后的国际条约规定，已经完全的变质，作为亚洲发动侵略战争的策源地，一个不允许拥有军队的国家，居然偷偷摸摸改头换面的建立了一只在世界上都拥有强大战争能力的海空军，这本身就是对亚洲国家尤其是深受日本战争伤害的中国最大的威胁。日本的不少政客丝毫没有意识到自己是在绑架本国的国民继续另一场根本赢不了的游戏，当然了，他们不会自己上战场的！
看到回帖的日本网友有问看不看得懂日文，如果你们不是剽窃了那么多的中国文字，我还真看不懂你们用日文说了些什么，说实话，我很愤怒，你们从中国得到了那么多，从文化到物质利益，可是你们回报给中国的却是无尽的伤害和侮辱，并且你们的政客带领着无数的日本人还在继续这么干。是，中国虚弱的时候你们趁火打劫，丛林法则嘛，所以现在无论你们怎么想，中国的强大之路都无可阻挡！

 

[terranMarine]

Seriously, if the war outbreaks between the US and Russia, I would be scared as well, since no way that China could get away from this conflict and would be dragged into it for sure.

That's the fate we share as the 3 ultimate powers

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Give Japan Some brahmos to tilt the balance in favor of Japan.

First Japan can get anything it wants from USA and EU..

Second... Japan also has territorial disputes with Russia.. The Japs dont want it.. and i doubt russia will offer them a russian product.. brahmos = shorter ranged Yakhont...

Nuke this nuke that, you lot always talking about nuke. Although a lot of government leaders will constraint themselves into limited conventional war. Pakistan and India is the best examples, both of them possesses Nuclear warhead, yet both of them limited themselves into saber rattling conventional war. Me thing, any future Japan-China conflict will be limited in some limited yet decisive Naval conflict.

You dont see Pak threating war.. or stupid shit like "limited nuclear war" or "surgical strikes" and than stfu like a puppey..

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

That's the fate we share as the 3 ultimate powers

We are working so hard for decades just for coming on the top as today, and i don't want to lose everything just in the blink of an eye.

We need to win without firing a bullet, not by getting involved into a nuclear war.

 

[terranMarine]

We are working so hard for decades just for coming on the top as today, and i don't want to lose everything just in the blink of an eye.

We need to win without firing a bullet, not by getting involved into a nuclear war.

Life is full of unpredictable variables, lets hope WW3 will never happen (at least within our lifetime)

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

这个标题是讨论中国的海军力量增强，我想现实的看，中国的海军力量还比较弱，现在有人说增长迅速那是因为忽略了中国海军发展的低起点，比较薄弱的基础上发展，中国海军的强军之路还比较远。日本根据二战结束后的国际条约规定，已经完全的变质，作为亚洲发动侵略战争的策源地，一个不允许拥有军队的国家，居然偷偷摸摸改头换面的建立了一只在世界上都拥有强大战争能力的海空军，这本身就是对亚洲国家尤其是深受日本战争伤害的中国最大的威胁。日本的不少政客丝毫没有意识到自己是在绑架本国的国民继续另一场根本赢不了的游戏，当然了，他们不会自己上战场的！
看到回帖的日本网友有问看不看得懂日文，如果你们不是剽窃了那么多的中国文字，我还真看不懂你们用日文说了些什么，说实话，我很愤怒，你们从中国得到了那么多，从文化到物质利益，可是你们回报给中国的却是无尽的伤害和侮辱，并且你们的政客带领着无数的日本人还在继续这么干。是，中国虚弱的时候你们趁火打劫，丛林法则嘛，所以现在无论你们怎么想，中国的强大之路都无可阻挡！

淡定点，日本目前只不过是一个炮灰马前卒的角色，中国崛起的最大的障碍还是美国。

总的来说，中国的外部威胁是美国，而内部威胁是那些GZJY买办带路党。

Bro, you have to post in English next time, it is the forum rule.

 

[kankan326]

My opinoun:

- Without US help at all, Japan will lost the war with China. Because China can cut the oil route/ import export route disrupt sea lanes of all ships to and from Japan using subs. China has her own GPS system. China missiles are accurate. China has land base missiles that can attack Japan main island directly. Therefore Oil tanks/reservior and electric power plants and all building in Japan are at risk. While Japan may have the same ability to attack China main land, she lacks the ability to cut China oil import/export. Japan Chance become win 0 lose 100%. Japanese cities bombs, large number of japanese died. China also get her cities bombs. Casualty of Japan > China.

- With US help on intelligence but not war directly. Japan Chance with PLA navy is much better. However, China can still use submarines,DF21D to attack tankers coming to/from South China Sea. Japan pacific ocean side could be save for import export. Japan pacific ocean side could not be save for import export. This depends on whether Japan can destroy all PLA navy submarines or not. Pacific Ocean is very large. Therefore, submarines has better chance of survival in the mid of the ocean. I guess Japan Chance become win 30 lose 70%. Casualty of Japan > or = China

- With full US help,
US. will wait until Japan is exhausted, bombs, destroyed like the previous scenario ( very likely ) before play her hands. US will need to destroy China's mainland asset, like radars, Satellites command & controls, rockets launching platforms, etc. Space assets of both side will become the very very first among being attacked, Perhaps even before declare war. China will retaliate to US mainland by ICBM, Sub Launch Ballistic Missiles. If things develop to this position, no body know when the first Nuke will be used. But then finally Nuke exchange occurs. Now its a question of whose Nuke is stronger, and who can produce Nukes in war time. Anglo group will help US. It is very likely that China will lost, and the end of Chinese civilization/ Chinese as people on this plannet earth. Before China died, she will drag Japan together by Nuke all Japanese cities. Japan will also end/ wipe out from this plannet earth. US now very bad shape. Some of her population survive by migrate to Canada or Mexico but her ability to fight a single war will not survive.

Russia, India are the winners.
Now, with Anglo power weaken, Germany will be free and start building up armies. Why? Because Russia is now sole super power with her land untouched. Her strong neighbor China wiped out. Russia is very likely to take this chance to end Anglo dominance because there is only one strong country of Anglo left: England. Germany will have to think really hard whose side will be the best. Who ever win this battle between Russia/Germany/England/Canada will be the next superpower until WW4.

Dude, can you write a novel about this? I'd like to buy it.

 

[somsak]

War with Japan is an exposure of China military assets. By having war with Japan, US intelligence will be very happy.
US will want to gather all the signal signatures, military encryption, radar stations, how China use space assets, listen to all the traits left by ICBM. Such war will provide a good amount of deblis US can scrutiny from.

Current World power is like 3 Kingdoms. Any war between the other 2 left the one in peace the winner.

US- Russia war -> China win
US- China war ->Russia win
Chin- Russia war ->US win

Therefore, the way to win the war is to hold the longest peace. That does not mean avoid arm-race. Instead, arm-race, military hardware, intelligence gathering must be strong enough to stay in peace. Coz weakness invites war.

Dude, can you write a novel about this? I'd like to buy it.

I'm afraid of my safety hahaha. Blood money, once eat, also invite the blood thursty.
However, I can mimic the situation into another stars in long long time ago in the galaxy so far away....

 

[terranMarine]

@somsak Just write the essay here and kankan can read this exciting 'tom clancy' style war drama on his tablet

@xunzi @ChineseTiger1986
Will the U.S. Really Defend Japan? | The Diplomat

 

[Kyle Sun]

Nope, unless you wanna see them getting crashed by their own pile of debt.

Meanwhile, they can't build anything without the help from the US.

The problem is they can get 100% help from US under that situation.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

The problem is they can get 100% help from US under that situation.

If they are still dependent to the US, then the US will not arm them with nukes.

 

[Kyle Sun]

If they are still dependent to the US, then the US will not arm them with nukes.

I am not that optimistic.

20 or 10 years ago , do you believe Japan Gov can release the Japan army ?

 

[Akasa]

This post reflects a miscalculation that the JASDF [Japan Air Self Defense Force] would sit idly by. No, it will stand on alert, and will negate forces within its area of control.

China's Air Force [Peoples Liberation Army Air Force] is divided and appropriated to cover the full expanse of China's territory: this includes the:
1)Beijing Military Region
2) Chengdu Military Region
3) Guangzhou Military Region
4) Jinan Military Region
5) Lanzhou Military Region
6) Shenyang Military Region

Due to China's deployment of its forces particularly the Chengdu Military Region and the Lanzhou Military Region, to address security concerns to its West and to the south, India. What remains will have to fly long distances to even meet Japanese forces. This is highly unlikely.

Once again, your analysis hinges on the assumption that the PLA would not have any warning of an impending conflict with Japan, and hence would not take the appropriate measures to stockpile and mobilize in anticipation of such. The PLAAF has been observed to be willing to redeploy air units for long periods of time. In any event of a conflict, there would be no apparent issue regarding the redeployment of combat aircraft and munitions from bases in the Southwest and West to airfields along the eastern seaboard. Once their fighters and other military assets are deployed on their coastline, one can expect their flight time to be cut drastically. This was exemplified in the interception of JASDF aircraft in response to their violation of the ADIZ.

Thus, due to the geographic limitation that presents itself, the PLAAF's units that would most probably be able to engage acutely, would be from the Beijing Military Region, and the Jinan Military Region. These air units would most probably operate close to the shore , where it can easily return to base and refuel, meaning that Naval Assets of a Japan/ US Force will operate with impunity.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the limitation of fuel isn't exclusive to the PLAAF; JASDF and USN/AF aircraft would be plagued by the same problem.

Without a naval force, China is vulnerable to a naval blockade, and other asymmetric tactical scenarios that will favor the Japan - US Combined Force.

Unfortunately, due to the size of China's land mass and territorial issues with neighbors, most of its military assets cannot be massed to form a cohesive unit, as it would render large swathes of its territories in the west and south unprotected. This would be a strategic blunder.
Thus i must reiterate that the strategic achilles heel of China is its size, which prevents the massing of necessary units in time.


Thanks.

Your premise is that due to the peacetime dispersion of Chinese forces, the PLAN would not be able to gather then into a single unified front to deal with conflict. However, if the top brass has any suspicion of an upcoming war, there's no reason to expect that they won't pass a mobilization order and actually concentrate those forces. Ironically, the size of the country also works to its advantage; its dispersed assets and bases would force any enemy to be divided themselves, thus mitigating the effect of a combined opponent.

 

[xunzi]

@somsak Just write the essay here and kankan can read this exciting 'tom clancy' style war drama on his tablet

@xunzi @ChineseTiger1986
Will the U.S. Really Defend Japan? | The Diplomat

Like I always said, "word of encouragements" are for US's allies to hear but it doesn't have any meaning. The US, like any smart businessperson, will analyze the risk and the cost. If the cost is low, they will engage to defend Japan. If the cost is too high (high is when American lives are at risk), then they will say good luck to Japan.

 

[Derek Yeh]

a's geographical size. This

The US flew bombers through that AIDZ like it was swiss cheese. All China could do was watch. I don't know if I'd call that a moderate response. It would be a mistake to underestimate US will when our key allies are threatened.

Well, except those B-52 were unarmed if I am not mistaken. The Japanese clearly wanted the U.S to stay align with them both militarily and non-militarily. The fact that the U.S asked the civilian airline to comply when the Japanese did not really is a sign of telling. And ofc China watched, because it got what it was trying to achieved which was to drive an edge between the Americans and the Japanese.