Whatever

[M. Sarmad]

Source again? This is not very convincing stuff.

According to one report, the first Caliph Abu Bakr burned his own notes of hadith (said to be some 500), after being very uneasy about these notes.[ Rahim, M. Abdur, The History of Hadith Compilation (in Bengali), p. 290, quoted by Jamilul Bashar, “Sangsker” (in Bengali, means Reformation), published by Young Muslim Society, New York, 2002, pp. 11.]


During the caliphate of Umer r.a, “the problem of hadith forgery was so serious that he prohibited hadith transmission altogether.”[ Brown, Daniel W., 1996 (paperback 1999), op. cit., p. 96.]

 

[Nilgiri]

So mobile version of defence. Pk updated a day ago..
And
The read threads dont grey out.. Anyone has an idea whats wrong??

Dunno if mods addressed this yet...but have you checked your bandwidth settings and if the webpage fully loads rather than stop at say 99% etc? Because I have noticed certain features here in the website (even on PC) do not load till the very end and thus will not be available if the page isnt 100% loaded.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Everything else you wrote? Hell yea

What exactly is it that you 'dispute'?
Tell me so that I may provide references/sources

 

[I.R.A]

• And Divine Will

You done it good now bro....

Yep I am done. You don't even know and realise who invented this divine will (Taqdeer) and for what purpose. You don't realise what this belief in Taqdeer has cost us Muslims ....... may be someday when you are mature enough not to use too many smileys and not feel insecure and have enough knowledge about the thing you are defending. May be then.

Aslam o alaikum please carry on with Sarmad.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Yep I am done. You don't even know and realise who invented this divine will (Taqdeer) and for what purpose. You don't realise what this belief in Taqdeer has cost us Muslims ....... may be someday when you are mature enough not to use too many smileys and not feel insecure and have enough knowledge about the thing you are defending. May be then.

Aslam o alaikum please carry on with Sarmad.

The history of resistance to Islamic traditionalists by Muslim rationalists can be traced back to the latter half of the first century of Hijra ... The "Qadariyah" were the first ones to challenge traditionalists' doctrine (which defended the wrong actions/deeds of Umayyad Caliphs terming it Taqdeer) during the Umayyad Rule ...


Two traditionalists at the forefront of "Anti Rationalist/Mu’tazila campaign" during the early Abbasid period were Ahmed Bin Hanbal and Ismail Bukhari ... !!!

The main reason behind compilation of Hadith Collections (going against the tradition maintained by the first eight generations of Muslims) was "codification of traditional Islam" to counter the rationalists' ideology, which was far more developed and logical ...

 

[Itachi]

You don't even know and realise who invented this divine will (Taqdeer) and for what purpose.

Yea, I'm a caveman who doesn't understand anything. Poor me

may be someday when you are mature enough not to use too many smileys

Hey man, stop hating on my smiley faces, ok?

Aslam o alaikum please carry on with Sarmad

Wa Alaikum Assallam Habibi

According to one report, the first Caliph Abu Bakr burned his own notes of hadith (said to be some 500), after being very uneasy about these notes.[ Rahim, M. Abdur, The History of Hadith Compilation (in Bengali), p. 290, quoted by Jamilul Bashar, “Sangsker” (in Bengali, means Reformation), published by Young Muslim Society, New York, 2002, pp. 11.]

Dude you're quoting a Awami league politician that fought against PA in the 1971 war...real credible dude

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayyad_Mosque What's this? Check it out.

I see you only believe in the Quran along with @I.R.A


[Mention] when Allah said, "O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, and I will judge between you concerning that in which you used to differ. (3:55)


And [for] their saying, "Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah ." And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain. (4:157)

Rather, Allah raised him to Himself. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise (4:158)

After the killing of Dajjal:

And there is none from the People of the Scripture but that he will surely believe in Jesus before his death. And on the Day of Resurrection he will be against them a witness. (4:159)

This should end the discussion @Pan-Islamic-Pakistan

Anti Rationalist/Mu’tazila campaign

the rationalists' ideology, which was far more developed and logical ...

Oh boy....we got a Bukhari hater over here. I'll continue on the Mu'tazila tomorrow. For now, look upon the above Quranic verses my friend.

 

[I.R.A]

The history of resistance to Islamic traditionalists by Muslim rationalists can be traced back to the latter half of the first century of Hijra ... The "Qadariyah" were the first ones to challenge traditionalists' doctrine (which defended the wrong actions/deeds of Umayyad Caliphs terming it Taqdeer) during the Umayyad Rule ...


Two traditionalists at the forefront of "Anti Rationalist/Mu’tazila campaign" during the early Abbasid period were Ahmed Bin Hanbal and Ismail Bukhari ... !!!

The main reason behind compilation of Hadith Collections (going against the tradition maintained by the first eight generations of Muslims) was "codification of traditional Islam" to counter the rationalists' ideology, which was far more developed and logical ...

ALLAH ko yehi manzoor hy chup kar kay baith jao ....... kissi zulm kissi na insafi kissi ziadti k khilaf awaz na uthao q kay yeh to tumhari taqdeer may likha hy bai.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Dude you're quoting a Awami league politician that fought against PA in the 1971 war...real credible dude

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayyad_Mosque What's this? Check it out.

Just posted simple links that you start reading...
There are many more to follow,

[Mention] when Allah said, "O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, and I will judge between you concerning that in which you used to differ. (3:55)


And [for] their saying, "Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah ." And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain. (4:157)

Rather, Allah raised him to Himself. And ever is Allah Exalted in Might and Wise (4:158)

After the killing of Dajjal:

And there is none from the People of the Scripture but that he will surely believe in Jesus before his death. And on the Day of Resurrection he will be against them a witness. (4:159)

Thoroughly discussed and summarily refuted here:

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...ld-you-follow-him.585692/page-9#post-11149825
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...ld-you-follow-him.585692/page-9#post-11149938
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-10#post-11150243
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-11#post-11150525

And here:
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-13#post-11151756

Oh boy....we got a Bukhari hater over here. I'll continue on the Mu'tazila tomorrow. For now, look upon the above Quranic verses my friend.

Lol at Bukhari hater

As for Mu'tazila, for starters:
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/two-...-into-reverse-gear.465871/page-6#post-9014800

Please read these posts through and then we will continue this discussion
Regards

 

[Itachi]

Thoroughly discussed and summarily refuted here:

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...ld-you-follow-him.585692/page-9#post-11149825
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...ld-you-follow-him.585692/page-9#post-11149938
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-10#post-11150243
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-11#post-11150525

And here:
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/if-a...d-you-follow-him.585692/page-13#post-11151756

I just read through all of them. It's your choice if now that you want to cherry pick Arabic words. The verses are there mentioning the ascension of Jesus, his return & the killing of Dajjal. Meaning that there will be a Dajjal (for him to be later killed by Isa R.A.).

It's up to you if you want to believe in it or not, I cannot force you to do anything.

I see that we hold two different pov's (point of views) & neither can convince the other. I bid you a good day.

 

[M. Sarmad]

I just read through all of them. It's your choice if now that you want to cherry pick Arabic words. The verses are there mentioning the ascension of Jesus, his return & the killing of Dajjal. Meaning that there will be a Dajjal (for him to be later killed by Isa R.A.).

It's up to you if you want to believe in it or not, I cannot force you to do anything.

I see that we hold two different pov's (point of views) & neither can convince the other. I bid you a good day.

You read through all of them in Just 4 minutes??

 

[Itachi]

You read through all of them in Just 4 minutes??

What can I say....I have read 400/500 pages books in one day. Your threads are simple once I skimmed over them.

It must feel good to be young.

Also, please don't kill yourself.

 

[M. Sarmad]

What can I say....I have read 400/500 pages books in one day. Your threads are simple once I skimmed over them.

It must feel good to be young.

As you grow older and mature, You sure will learn to understand and comprehend things in a better way.
Till then, mojan maro

 

[Itachi]

As you grow older and mature, You sure will learn to understand and comprehend things in a better way.
Till then, mojan maro

Are you saying that I can't be young and mature?

Last question, so do you believe in the return of Isa R.A. & the coming of Dajjal? I won't bother you after this.

 

[I.R.A]

He won't be able to handle it, bro
nor will the PDF management allow it
Idea drop ker do

He needs it bro. In fact he is asking for it.

Shaken? By the likes of you guys...never

Drop as much pearls of wisdom you want to. All will be displayed at my shop for the buyer to buy & inspect.

Okay just for the starters ....

What is the definition of Hadees? Hadees is sayings of Messenger Muhammad Peace be upon him only right?

 

[Itachi]

What is the definition of Hadees? Hadees is sayings of Messenger Muhammad Peace be upon him only right?

I feel like I'm jumping into a well laid trap....ok then, the answer is yes.

What's the worse that can happen?