Vietnam's plea puts South Block in a predicament

[KS]

Vietnam's request for military assistance from India, primarily in the naval field, has put South Block in a quandary, said official sources.

On the one hand, India would like to pay back Vietnam for its assistance in consistently bolstering its case at multilateral fora such as the Association of South East Asian Nations (Asean), and on the other, it would not want to irk China as the plea has come shortly after exchanges between Beijing and New Delhi over Oil & Natural Gas Commission Videsh (ONGC Videsh) prospecting for oil and gas in a portion of South China Sea claimed by both China and Vietnam.

Vietnam President Troun Tan Sang made the request in four fields — submarine training, conversion training for its pilots to fly Sukhoi-30, modernisation of a strategic port and transfer of medium-sized warships.

In fact, the sources said, the Vietnam President overlooked protocol to meet senior Indian officials and ensured the timing of their commercial flight was revised to accommodate the unscheduled meeting. Vietnam had asked India to transfer Brahmos cruise missiles and offer its small civil nuclear plants for selection.

India would be comfortable with providing conversion training for Sukhois as it has completed a similar exercise with Malaysia, another South-East Asian country. Meeting the other three demands needed considerable deliberation, said the sources, as India was not keen to put a spanner in ties with China with which it is shortly slated to sign an agreement to douse tensions by taking care of eye-ball-to-eyeball confrontations between military patrols in certain pockets of the line of actual control (LAC).

In particular, India will have to think hard about Vietnam's request to transfer 1,000 to 1,500 tonne vessels to sanitise Vietnam's long coast line and upgrade the Nha Trang port, located near the critical Cam Ranh Bay, especially after the alleged warning by the Chinese navy to an Indian warship that had left this port after a visit in July.

According to the report submitted by the Navy, INS Airavat left the place quickly after a caller, identifying himself as the “Chinese Navy,” warned that “you are entering Chinese waters.” The Navy has claimed that its men on the warship did not spot any aircraft or ship from where the call had come. It also claimed not to have worked out the coordinates from where the call originated. Indian diplomats said the incident was a “non-event.”

Diplomats here said India would have to factor in two factors — though it had the right to develop ties in its near neighbourhood, it should not be done in a manner that derailed ties with China, especially at a time when the Special Representatives on the border issue were due to meet and Beijing's support was required for entry into the Nuclear Suppliers' Group.

The Hindu : News / National : Vietnam's plea puts South Block in a predicament

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The Hindu upto its Chinese worship, as always.

This is an excellent opportunity to help our partner Vietnam develop its self defence capabilities to defend itself against all forms of external threats after all the Chinese do the same in our backyard.

 

[luckyyy]

Vietnam had asked India to transfer Brahmos cruise missiles !!!

 

[angeldemon_007]

The Hindu upto its Chinese worship, as always.

This is an excellent opportunity to help our partner Vietnam develop its self defence capabilities to defend itself against all forms of external threats after all the Chinese do the same in our backyard.

Thats a very stupid idea (no offense buddy). Even US takes every steps carefully when it comes to China. We should follow the last line of the article.

Vietnam had asked India to transfer Brahmos cruise missiles !!!

I am always against the export of Brahmos. Its a powerful and dangerous missile. No-one has any defence against this. The best thing for India is to first develop a defence against our own missile and then think about its export or just cancel it. We should also wait till we get hypersonic version. In future if the situation still remain the same and if Vietnam still insist on Brahmos purchase we should sell them quietly through Russia.

submarine training, conversion training for its pilots to fly Sukhoi-30, modernisation of a strategic port and transfer of medium-sized warships.

We can do Submarine training in India without telling anyone if China has objection on this one. Training on Su30 can be done and so the modernization of a strategic port just as a tit for tat on Gwadar port. As far as warship transfer is concerned we can do two things : first we can just quietly pay russia to build OPV and corvettes for Vietnam like sometimes US does or we can take an agressive route and tell China to stop building warship for Pakistan or we will help Vietnam, this could only cause tension but if we sign a huge deal for like 10-12 vessels then it might put China into thinking and might turn the game in our favor after this as i said we can always pay russia to build warship for Vietnam.

 

[Alchemy]

I am always against the export of Brahmos. Its a powerful and dangerous missile. No-one has any defence against this. The best thing for India is to first develop a defence against our own missile and then think about its export or just cancel it. We should also wait till we get hypersonic version. In future if the situation still remain the same and if Vietnam still insist on Brahmos purchase we should sell them quietly through Russia.

Brahmos from India or Russia is a must for Vietnam in its effort of self defence and deterrent, and more over Brahmos is a commercial production and is up for sale to friendly countries ... Vietnam sure is a friendly country to both India and Russia and its range is below the MTCR guidelines .So it is absolutely legal to sell it to Vietnam !!!

 

[KS]

Thats a very stupid idea (no offense buddy). Even US takes every steps carefully when it comes to China. We should follow the last line of the article.

This is our problem,typical Indian problem. We think too much about what others will think of us and finally end up doing nothing.

Like it or not China is steadily building alliiances all around us from Pakistan to Sri Lanka to BD to Nepa; and Myanmar. They have even gone ahead and placed a division in P0K. They need to know that this is a game that two can play.

Mao's words hold true for China - Power flows only from the barrel of the gun and the Chinese know only that.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Mao's words hold true for China - Power flows only from the barrel of the gun and the Chinese know only that.

That's true. That's why we spent the past 30 years building nothing but guns.

OK I was being sarcastic. Mao's ideas are mostly outdated, but it's true that this particular quote still does hold a lot of value.

We need to ensure our own security before our economy can truly prosper, otherwise we will just experience a repeat of the colonial era.

 

[indiatester]

Thats a very stupid idea (no offense buddy). Even US takes every steps carefully when it comes to China. We should follow the last line of the article.

Carefully yes, but we should use our pieces too. China is a very powerful adversary. It would only be in our interest to strengthen our friends.

 

[WHF]

What else can be expected from this @$$ **** Gov and pussie fake sardar.
History will not forgive u if u desert friends who need ur help, These Neo seculars are the jaichands of modern india.

 

[ramu]

Thats a very stupid idea (no offense buddy). Even US takes every steps carefully when it comes to China. We should follow the last line of the article.


I am always against the export of Brahmos. Its a powerful and dangerous missile. No-one has any defence against this. The best thing for India is to first develop a defence against our own missile and then think about its export or just cancel it. We should also wait till we get hypersonic version. In future if the situation still remain the same and if Vietnam still insist on Brahmos purchase we should sell them quietly through Russia.


We can do Submarine training in India without telling anyone if China has objection on this one. Training on Su30 can be done and so the modernization of a strategic port just as a tit for tat on Gwadar port. As far as warship transfer is concerned we can do two things : first we can just quietly pay russia to build OPV and corvettes for Vietnam like sometimes US does or we can take an agressive route and tell China to stop building warship for Pakistan or we will help Vietnam, this could only cause tension but if we sign a huge deal for like 10-12 vessels then it might put China into thinking and might turn the game in our favor after this as i said we can always pay russia to build warship for Vietnam.

Does China factor in India's concerns while arming Pakistan. Judge for yourself.

 

[KS]

That's true. That's why we spent the past 30 years building nothing but guns.

OK I was being sarcastic. Mao's ideas are mostly outdated, but it's true that this particular quote still does hold a lot of value.

We need to ensure our own security before our economy can truly prosper, otherwise we will just experience a repeat of the colonial era.

The bigger your gun the lesser the chance you will actually use it.

India must proceed to help Vietnam which has requested India's help in shoring up its defences against all threats.

The relative peace on the Indo-Chinese border is not due to any friendship but because each nation knows that a war with the other will set them so bad. That is what we need. A lack of incentive to go to war.

 

[ramu]

The bigger your gun the lesser the chance you will actually use it.

India must proceed to help Vietnam which has requested India's help in shoring up its defences against all threats.

The relative peace on the Indo-Chinese border is not due to any friendship but because each nation knows that a war with the other will set them so bad. That is what we need. A lack of incentive to go to war.

Completely agree...

Why should we not help Vietnam if we are making money by selling arms and providing service / training. Not just for the money but as a tit for tat protocol to China arming Pakistan.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

The bigger your gun the lesser the chance you will actually use it.

India must proceed to help Vietnam which has requested India's help in shoring up its defences against all threats.

Good luck sir.

China's response will most likely be to stop India from joining the UNSC as a permanent member. But then we all know they were looking for a reason to do that anyway. So no real loss for you.

The relative peace on the Indo-Chinese border is not due to any friendship but because each nation knows that a war with the other will set them so bad. That is what we need. A lack of incentive to go to war.

It's also because the Indian government has not tried to repeat their Forward Policy again.

You'll need to build up your capabilities a lot, if you want to be able to do that and not face a fight. An authoritarian government cannot be seen to lose face in front of their people, we even went to war with the USA + 16 of their allies back in 1950, when we were at the weakest point in our history. (And even back then we managed to push them completely out of North Korea).

 

[KS]

Good luck sir.

China's response will most likely be to stop India from joining the UNSC as a permanent member. But then we all know they were looking for a reason to do that anyway. So no real loss for you.

I for one is not a big fan of the UNSC membership. Ofcourse if it comes to our doors no one will object, but honestly UNSC is not the powerful institution it once used to be to covet its membership so much. The UN is fast losing its relevance and a variety of strategic alliances gaining ground.

In my honest opinion losing a chance to build a broad framework of democratic countries in Asia comprising of India, Vietnam, Japan, SK to ensure a multipolar Asia is a bigger loss than UNSC seat. Because that is an idea which cant be denied when its time comes.

It's also because the Indian government has not tried to repeat their Forward Policy again.

You'll need to build up your capabilities a lot, if you want to be able to do that and not face a fight. An authoritarian government cannot be seen to lose face in front of their people, we even went to war with the USA + 16 of their allies back in 1950, when we were at the weakest point in our history. (And even back then we managed to push them completely out of North Korea).

And we will never invade a country. That is not our philosophy as exemplified by history. But cant say the same for others.

And when it comes to china, in case of a full fledged war a nuke option is not ruled out. BTW history tell us that in 1962 even when we were outnumbered 9 to 1 we managed to inflict 50% of the casualties you guys inflicted on us..ie., percapita we killed more chinese than you. If that was the case when our Army was not even a proper Army..do that math yourself when you are facing an Army that has been sharpened through decades of fighting all forms of war.

Just putting things in perspective. Nothing else.

 

[pmukherjee]

Good luck sir.

China's response will most likely be to stop India from joining the UNSC as a permanent member. But then we all know they were looking for a reason to do that anyway. So no real loss for you.



It's also because the Indian government has not tried to repeat their Forward Policy again.

You'll need to build up your capabilities a lot, if you want to be able to do that and not face a fight. An authoritarian government cannot be seen to lose face in front of their people, we even went to war with the USA + 16 of their allies back in 1950, when we were at the weakest point in our history. (And even back then we managed to push them completely out of North Korea).

Excellent post. My views exactly.
This is the kind of post that I associated with you some months ago. Clear headed, blunt but realistic, insightful and in not the usual ignorant chest thumping juvenile style one sees on this forum. A while back there I had stopped reading your posts as they were no different from the standard juvenile internet warrior posts. I hope you stick to the high standards of posting one saw when you joined this forum. Cardsharp has maintained his standards. Why not you?

 

[Veeru]

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The Hindu upto its Chinese worship, as always.

This is an excellent opportunity to help our partner Vietnam develop its self defence capabilities to defend itself against all forms of external threats after all the Chinese do the same in our backyard.

Hindu and NDTV both are frontrunner of communist media.