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The US is giving Vietnam $18 million for patrol boats to counter China

Dude first of all let me clarify few things before I answer your comment. China has always helped us as the history is evident of that. And people who help us we never turn our backs towards them neither we help their enemies against them. For decades we have been warned by the US to discontinue our Military relationships with China, but we have never accepted any pressure whatsoever from US and its allays. And since we have been receiving a constant help from China we in return have always respected them, helped them when they needed and offered them our shores. Chinese have had sacrificed a lot to get their independence and so as we and so as Vietnamese. But, Chinese and Pakistanis knows that who were the murderers of their forefathers but I suppose you Vietnam people have forgotten everything. Infect you have become so ungrateful that now you will turn against Chinese who helped you and feed you during your bad days. Without their help you would have been under complete influence of US just like Japan is. But I believe you do not have any idea neither you will ever understand the dignity and pride. As it is clearly rectified from your statements that you have no dignity at all and that you have forgiven your elders and Country men blood just for the sake of few millions or billions.

And in the end let me tell you something. People who lost their loved ones in Vietnam War if they read your comments they would chop your hands off for good. At least I know Vietnam People this much that they do not forgive their enemies.
first and foremost You fail to understand the basic thing: TODAY matters than YESTERDAY.

I wonder why you write and concentrate too much on our relation to the US. her war and atrocity in Vietnam. in reality, the US is just one in the long list of our enemies in the past. No of our enemies were peaceful toward Vietnam. if we stop our relation to all our enemies, we would have stopped our relationship to half of the countries in the world. Do you think that would help us?

as for China, we are ungrateful? No, you shouldn't make the mistake and believe to Chinese propaganda. since ancient times, china´s aim was and is to exterminate Vietnam independence and existence. their help and assistance was limited and half hearted, happened during the cold war and ended when they noticed we did not follow the path they wanted. both Vietnam and China fought against a common enemy. and at all You should remember the destructions and deaths Chinese brought to Vietnam outweigh their help and assistance.
 
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Me think the US are trying to enlarge its Asian market:

U.S. Defense Firms Falter in Asia
Some weapons systems are too costly, complex for emerging markets; competition rises
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An F/A-18 Super Hornet prepared to land at a U.S. Naval air base in Atsugi, Japan, last year. Boeing currently is marketing the jets in Malaysia. Photo: KEN ISHII/GETTY IMAGES
By
Trefor Moss
May 31, 2015 4:41 p.m. ET

SINGAPORE—Surging military spending across Asia has made it the world’s second-biggest region for such spending over the past decade, but U.S. companies, the biggest sellers of military equipment, are struggling to take full advantage of that growth, even as revenues back home stagnate.

Demand in Asia for defense equipment—and calls for greater U.S. military involvement—have grown as China’s display of military might in the South China Sea intensifies regional tensions.

Total global spending on defense in 2014 was $1.719 trillion, of which Asia and Oceania contributed $423 billion, or 25%, behind only North America’s $596 billion, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute. The figures are calculated using a 2011 base dollar value.

The total for Asia was over $30 billion more than Europe, which it leapfrogged for the No. 2 spot compared with the previous 10-year period, and up 62% over the past decade. China—a closed market for U.S. defense companies because of a long-standing arms embargo—accounted for $208 billion of the Asia and Oceania total, spurring its neighbors to boost their spending. Asia and Oceania bought 48% of the weaponry that U.S. companies exported during that period, up from 39% in 2009.

But capitalizing on that boom has proved difficult for U.S. defense companies, which are struggling to dominate Asia’s important emerging markets as they once did. Many of their weapons systems are too expensive and unnecessarily sophisticated for those customers. There is also more competition from upstarts and established European competitors better able to meet Asia’s defense needs.

Some of the Asian manufacturers are big exporters, such as Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering Co. of South Korea. But many others are small compared with U.S. giants such as Boeing Co. Indonesian state-run aerospace company PT Dirgantara said it has sold a maritime-patrol aircraft, which its executives said was the least expensive on the market, to eight countries so far, including South Korea, which bought four of the Indonesian planes for $92 million. Singapore Technologies Engineering Ltd. recently sold an amphibious warship to Thailand in an order valued at $135 million.

By comparison, Boeing’s P-8A Poseidon surveillance aircraft costs about $220 million each. The company has sold eight of these planes to India for $2.1 billion.

In the 1970s, practically every air force in East Asia was stocked with U.S. warplanes such as the Northrop F-5, a small-budget jet built with exports in mind.

Today, among the 10 states of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, only Singapore has new U.S. jets. None have modern U.S. warships. Once-reliable U.S. customers, such as Thailand, Indonesia and the Philippines, are turning to companies elsewhere for arms, in some cases rejecting U.S. alternatives.

This is partly because U.S. defense companies now develop big-ticket, cutting-edge products in response to the needs of their biggest customer, the U.S. military, but which many Asian countries don’t need, say some U.S. contractors active in Asia.

“We’re often perceived as a Cadillac option in the Asia-Pacific,” said Howard Berry, Boeing’s vice president for international sales of the F/A-18 Super Hornet, which the company is currently marketing in Malaysia.

The U.S. aerospace industry’s premium export product is the Lockheed Martin Corp. F-35 joint strike fighter, a stealth jet designed to pierce enemy defenses and stay undetected during operations. But the F-35 is too sophisticated for most Asian buyers, which generally just want a working military deterrent, and—at roughly $125 million a plane—the plane is unaffordable to most of them.

Big-spending nations such as Japan and South Korea are the only F-35 buyers in the region, with each paying more than $7 billion for about 40 jets apiece.

“They can’t turn on a dime and suddenly come up with foreign products,” said Richard Bitzinger of the S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies in Singapore.

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In sticking to their high-end strategy, the U.S. companies might be missing an opportunity to help secure their futures. Joe Katzman of U.S.-based KAT Consulting, criticized U.S. companies for “gold-plating” weapons systems to satisfy only top-end clients, while neglecting emerging markets seeking more accessible options.

“Abandoning the low end eliminates new value buyers,” said Mr. Katzman. He added that the practice cedes emerging markets to defense-industry rivals, who then capitalize 10 years down the line once those countries have fully ramped up their spending.

The U.S. companies could use a reliable growth source: The U.S. budgeted about $560 billion for defense in 2015, down from a peak of $721 billion four years earlier. During that time, revenues have stagnated at the big U.S. defense companies.

Munitions manufacturer Raytheon Co. , for example, reported revenue of $22.8 billion in 2014, down from $25.2 billion in 2010. Lockheed Martin booked net sales of $45.6 billion last year, the same as four years earlier.

The 10 Asean countries, meanwhile, are set to spend a total of about $40 billion this year—about the same as India—up from roughly $33 billion in 2010, and are set to spend $52 billion by 2020, according to IHS Jane’s, a defense-information company.

In some cases, U.S. companies don’t offer products in classes the Asian countries can buy. U.S. companies are missing out entirely on an Asian boom in submarines, for example, because they don’t build the diesel-fueled submarines Asian customers want. Instead they build nuclear submarines that appeal to global navies. European, South Korean and Russian submarine makers have all landed multibillion-dollar contracts for new boats in India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Vietnam in recent years.

To be sure, U.S. companies still capture a large share of global military spending: U.S. suppliers had 31% of the world market between 2010 and 2014, according to SIPRI. And they often supply technology that underlies complex systems sold by competitors.

Emerging aircraft manufacturer Korean Aerospace Industries Ltd., for example, recently secured orders from Indonesia and the Philippines for its new T-50 trainer/light fighter aircraft—but the plane was co-developed with Lockheed Martin, and includes U.S. equipment from companies such as Honeywell International Inc., Rockwell Collins Inc. and Raytheon.

“We see the emergence of Asian [airplane manufacturers] as an opportunity, not a threat,” said Mark Burgess, Honeywell’s senior director for Asia-Pacific defense and space systems, adding that his company considers only its European counterparts as genuine rivals.

Similarly, new warships being built by Australia and South Korea have Lockheed Martin’s Aegis Combat Management System at their core.

“It just doesn’t make sense for them to try to develop a complex, expensive system like that indigenously,” Mr. Bitzinger said.

Write to Trefor Moss at Trefor.Moss@wsj.com

U.S. Defense Firms Falter in Asia - WSJ
 
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Yea sure, logical rational minded people who would do potential military deals with those who killed tens of thousands of our American troops. Just keep turning the other cheek. Make deals with the devil in desperation.

Man, what type of logic are you using here? ? Seems you are allowing your emotions take over your rational judgement. That's not how geo politics works, if you have even a little idea about how countries go about to protect their interests, then you wouldn't be making such rash arguments. Yes the Vietcong /VCP backed by it's Chinese /Soviet allies killed thousands for America soldiers(about 60,000) and the U. S killed almost 4million Vietnamese /carpet bombed the country almost to extinction. However, time has past and things have changed, so has interests.

The Chinese were once 'iron brothers'/strong allies with the Soviets, then they split and the Chinese became allies with the U. S/West as their interests with the Soviets no longer converge. Now the Chinese are back again with the Russians as their interests now match. The U.S was once an arch enemy /rival to Japan (even more than the Chinese today) and the U S dropped two atomic bombs on Japan. But today they are now buddies of convenience. So that's how countries behave, interests are always paramount, there are no friends just interests . So emotions /feelings should always be cast aside and look at the bigger picture, if a country doesn't do this (maybe because of ideology /religion like some Middle Eastern countries) then it's in for a lot of trouble.
So I see no reason Vietnam shouldn't get cosy /closer with the U. s if their interests match each other, any country under this situation will do the same so Vietnam ought to do what it things it's in it's interests. People can keep on blabbing all they like, but that won't change anything. Vietnam needs U. S western support/cooperation.

Oh please, I visited Vietnam before with my Vietnamese father. He and my mom do not like the communist regime there
Fair enough, yes there are indeed many overseas Vietnamese (and even locals) who despise the VCP, just like there are many Chinese who also despise their CCP. However, until the people themselves decide enough is enough and take things into their own hands to topple the communist authoritarian corrupt one party regime. There is little anybody can do about it. I too think Vietnam will have been far better off had the VCP not won the war, since it would have saved Vietnam from all those lost decades of unnecessary wars, isolation and sanctions ,while it's neighbours matched on/moved ahead. same with China under the CCP instead of KMT.
 
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What does giving mean? Is it a loan? In that case, they give you money to be paid later on the condition of buying US-made stuff.

They should also give you some engineering stuff for your land reclamation projects. Otherwise, you will be outdone badly by China.
 
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the Chinese became allies with the U. S/West as their interests with the Soviets no longer converge.

And we could've still been ''allies'' if it hadn't been for the US to suddently give us the cold shoulder after an incident like Tiananmen. And yet, Clinton was having good laughs with a drunk Boris Yeltsin in 1995, even though this was the same guy who decided to shell the Russian Duma with tanks in 1993?
 
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You can see that situation all over the forum. Plenty of chinese bearing the US flag, but talking sh@it not stop about the US while supporting China. It seems to me that USA is a bit too loose when it comes to giving citizenship.
You are no American citizen. So you hold no credibility on this.
 
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You are no American citizen. So you hold no credibility on this.

Actually, I lived in USA for 25 years and yes, I'm not an american citizen, I was a green card holder and do you know why I didn't take American citizenship? Because I don't feel that I'm American, or American enough, I'm Spanish, that's my citizenship and its also the citizenship that I feel that I belong to and I would not trade it for convenience as most immigrants in USA do.

I've seen many like you in USA, you or your family go there as refugees or as economic immigrants, you take citizenship for convenience or maybe you were even born there, I don't know, but you don't honor that citizenship, but instead you give allegiance to another country that I don't think you even know much and actually talk in a way that betrays the country that gave you refuge. Why don't you do something based on principle for a change and move to China, renounce your US citizenship and take chinese citizenship. Of course you are not going to do that, its more convenient to keep it while at the same time talking sh#it about it right? And you talk about credibility?
 
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I think America shot themselves in the foot here. China can single handedly become its largest client in military arms technology. But their backward mentality ruined it for them, so now they have to work so much harder just to bag a few minor sales.

Look forward to seeing what kind of technology our South Asian neighbours end up getting with their hard earned cash.
 
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Actually, I lived in USA for 25 years and yes, I'm not an american citizen, I was a green card holder and do you know why I didn't take American citizenship? Because I don't feel that I'm American, or American enough, I'm Spanish, that's my citizenship and its also the citizenship that I feel that I belong to and I would not trade it for convenience as most immigrants in USA do.

I've seen many like you in USA, you or your family go there as refugees or as economic immigrants, you take citizenship for convenience or maybe you were even born there, I don't know, but you don't honor that citizenship, but instead you give allegiance to another country that I don't think you even know much and actually talk in a way that betrays the country that gave you refuge. Why don't you do something based on principle for a change and move to China, renounce your US citizenship and take chinese citizenship. Of course you are not going to do that, its more convenient to keep it while at the same time talking sh#it about it right? And you talk about credibility?
@Carlosa, I live in USA for 29 years all my life. More than you. And you are not in America now. You are in Vietnam. So I stand by my words questioning your credibility. And why do I have to keep emphasizing that distrusting Vietnam's ruling regime and objecting to Washington's confrontational approach against China in the South China Sea does NOT imply disloyalty to America. I guess in your world, there is no such thing as dissenting opinions and disagreements among its citizens in a democracy like in USA right? I am amazed at your twisted thinking coming from Europe.
 
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Old enemy, new friend.

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Small help of US to Vietnam 18 mill US$ for purchasing 6 hi speed patrol ships Dfiant.

damen-sea-axe-bow-stan-patrol-5009-metal-shark-165-defiant-1426697362900-21-0-337-620-crop-1426726907887.jpg
 
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165’ DEFIANT SPECIFICATIONS, DIMENSIONS, CAPACITIES, & EQUIPMENT:

HULL MATERIAL: Steel

WHEELHOUSE MATERIAL: Aluminium

LOA: 165’ / 50.02 m

BEAM: 31’ / 9.40 m

DEPTH AT SIDES: 14’ / 4.30 m

DRAFT: 11’ 6” / 3.50 m

TANK CAPACITIES

FUEL OIL: 16,669 Gallons / 63.10 m3

FRESH WATER: 7,027 Gallons / 26.60 m3

BILGE WATER 713 Gallons / 2.70 m3

LUB OIL /DIRTY OIL TANK: 476 Gallons / 1.80 m3

SEWAGE (GREY): 3,091 Gallons / 11.70 m3

SEWAGE (BLACK): 1,849 Gallons / 7.00 m3

PROPULSION SYSTEM

MAIN ENGINES: 4 x Caterpillar C32 TOTAL POWER: 4324 bkW (5800 bhp) 2000-2300 rpm

GEARBOXES: Reintjes WVS 730

PROPELLERS: Fixed pitch propellers

BOW THRUSTER: 2 x 100 bkW

AUXILIARY EQUIPMENT

MAIN GENERATOR SETS: 2 x Generator sets, 107 kVA ea

NETWORK: 230/400V – 50 Hz

FIRE FIGHTING (INTERNAL): Fixed Fi-Fi system in engine room (Novec)

FIRE FIGHTING (External) 120 m3 /h

BILGE WATER SEPERATOR: Facet, CPS-2.5 MK II

FUEL SEPERATOR: Westfalia OTC-2

ANCHOR: 2x 270 kg, High holding power, Pool – TW

ANCHOR: WINCH Electrical driven

HYDRAULIC CRANE: Heila HLM 3-2S

Specifications, capacities, and equipment may vary. Data shown here is representative of a typical vessel setup and is given for reference only.

you guys were humiliated and your women were raped and your children were burnt alive in Vietnam war by the US, yet you guys haven't learned a single lesson from it, and here you are helping your destroyer against your allay who helped your people and sheltered them from the rage of US butchers. I am quite confident you aren't truly a Vietnamese, if you were you wouldn't have been showing your teeth off after hearing such a news. Because the Vietnamese I know and had lived with, they hate US and they are always against its policies. Nations who do not learn from their past their future is always dark and much more disastrous than their past.
Though I do not disagree to what you are saying.

USA has to repay and rebuild Vietnam because they lost the war. So it is a wining moment for the Vietnamese's. They can build up their defence and then say they do not want to be enemy of Russia or China. They are a free country.
 
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What only 18 millions for patrol boat, you damn bastard smart USA. So at the end how much this 18 millions will profit US lol.
Vietnam has to pay back 18 millions plus interest plus maintenance parts and labor. You stupid Vietnam cannot do calculation. The US don't give it for you free.
 
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USA has to repay and rebuild Vietnam because they lost the war. So it is a wining moment for the Vietnamese's. They can build up their defence and then say they do not want to be enemy of Russia or China. They are a free country.

:tup:
 
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They will use it against the USA in future. Good luck with that.
 
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US will never entrust real reliable weapons to a communist regime. For a short time, maybe, but, in the long run, anticipate to be elevated into an Iraq that used to welcome US soldiers in joy (although they were later revealed to be paid to do so by the US mercenary company).
 
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