Terrorists in saffron by Swami Agnivesh

[Cherub786]

Communal pogroms aren't the most pressing issue, traditional gender roles and niqab are.

Lmao. No wonder Muslims are in this situation. A case of misplaced priorities if there ever was one

Some 200 million Muslims in India, you expect me to believe communal pogroms are affecting even 1% of the Muslim community? 36 Muslims were killed in the Delhi riots (15 Hindus were killed), and around 200 to 300 were injured.

 

[Cliftonite]

Some 200 million Muslims in India, you expect me to believe communal pogroms are affecting even 1% of the Muslim community? 36 Muslims were killed in the Delhi riots (15 Hindus were killed), and around 200 to 300 were injured.

And what will donning the black abaya and niqab do for Muslim women instead of secluding them and pushing them away from progressing? I'd wager saving one Muslim from lynching is a better use of time than stuffing one Muslimah into a black chador.

 

[Cherub786]

And what will donning the black abaya and niqab do for Muslim women instead of secluding them and pushing them away from progressing? I'd wager saving one Muslim from lynching is a better use of time than stuffing one Muslimah into a black chador.

Well it comes down to what exactly are our primary interests as a community - a community that is defined by Religion above all. It surely can't be simply economic issues.

I agree that Muslims suffer widespread discrimination in employment, housing and education. Owaisi is doing much to address these issues. Hyderabad is the best place in India to be Muslim right now.

But I believe the greatest threat to Muslims in India is cultural and social. If Muslims lose their identity, if our girls no longer observe veil, if Muslims no longer have any attachment to the Mosque and the Ulama, if they too like the Hindus make their lives revolve around music, cinema and pop culture entertainment, then it will be far worse in the long run for our community's cohesion and survival.

If you don't think our religious, social and cultural issues matter then Muslims might as well all convert back to Hinduism and the communal problem will more or less be solved that way more effectively

 

[Baibars_1260]

How can someone like Rana Ayyub be our leader? A woman wearing sleeveless and short skirts? God forbid. Even the Hindus will laugh at us.

Believe me, the "Hindus" only laugh at the pyjama, skull cap bearded Indian Muslims. They would love to see all Muslims that way. The proof is right here on this forum where their IT trolls easily floor the religious arguments but are whipped silly by liberal secular Muslims talking well informed logic.

یہ مسلماں ہیں جنہیں دیکھ کے شرمائیں یہود

انکے جیسے مسلمان؟

یا انکے جیسے؟

Believe me the RSS Hindu would much rather have the Mullah.

No, the answer is to stick with a respectable Muslim man, someone who is educated but simultaneously grounded in our identity, culture and Faith. That's the only kind of leader the Muslims will respect and follow. In fact, many of these feminist Muslim girls will work against our interests. They will want to put an end to Muslim Personal Law. They will speak out against pardah and traditional gender roles. Communal pogroms are bad but they aren't our only issue, no is it the most pressing issue.

I give up with you.
Would Indian Muslim girls like to be like this Turkish girl?

or like this riot hit Indian Muslim girl

[/QUOTE]

 

[Cliftonite]

Well it comes down to what exactly are our primary interests as a community - a community that is defined by Religion above all. It surely can't be simply economic issues.

I agree that Muslims suffer widespread discrimination in employment, housing and education. Owaisi is doing much to address these issues. Hyderabad is the best place in India to be Muslim right now.

But I believe the greatest threat to Muslims in India is cultural and social. If Muslims lose their identity, if our girls no longer observe veil, if Muslims no longer have any attachment to the Mosque and the Ulama, if they too like the Hindus make their lives revolve around music, cinema and pop culture entertainment, then it will be far worse in the long run for our community's cohesion and survival.

If you don't think our religious, social and cultural issues matter then Muslims might as well all convert back to Hinduism and the communal problem will more or less be solved that way more effectively

We can maintain our identity without being regressive. Like Jews do. I identify as a Muslim. I don't need a skull cap or rotary to validate my identity. Rigidity and orthodoxy has been the weakness of South Asia's Muslims.

 

[Baibars_1260]

We can maintain our identity without being regressive. Like Jews do. I identify as a Muslim. I don't need a skull cap or rotary to validate my identity. Rigidity and orthodoxy has been the weakness of South Asia's Muslims.

Exactly!
There is reason why Rana Ayyub was hounded out after her expose convicted several murderers in the communal Gujarat pogrom of 2002. The RSS sees educated Muslims as a threat. They have seen what one liberal Muslim like Jinnah could do so they vowed to never let it happen again.
They don't want someone like Rana anymore , than they wanted Fatima Jinnah decades back. The mullahs cursed Fatima Jinnah for her dress as well.
Sleeveless, short hair, no burka.

 

[Cherub786]

We can maintain our identity without being regressive. Like Jews do. I identify as a Muslim. I don't need a skull cap or rotary to validate my identity. Rigidity and orthodoxy has been the weakness of South Asia's Muslims.

Jews are losing their identity due to intermarriage. You want Muslims to be just another ethnic group?
How is wearing a skull cap or using a rosary regressive?

 

[Cherub786]

Believe me, the "Hindus" only laugh at the pyjama, skull cap bearded Indian Muslims. They would love to see all Muslims that way. The proof is right here on this forum where their IT trolls easily floor the religious arguments but are whipped silly by liberal secular Muslims talking well informed logic.

Believe me the RSS Hindu would much rather have the Mullah.

Then why does the Hindu bigot refer to all Muslims, secular or otherwise, as "mulla" and "kathmulla". Those are derogatory terms for all Muslims in India, regardless of their level of religious observance.

In fact, I would venture to say that the Hindus are socially more at ease with the secular lifestyle type Muslim then the religiously observant Muslim. The criticism against Muslims by Hindutva types is that Muslims are "backward" and too religious. They send their kids to madrassahs, they live in ghettos and slums, their ladies are in burqas, they don't celebrate Holi or Divali, they blare the Adhan from loudspeakers five times a day, and even this criticism I couldn't believe "Muslims wear Arabic scents (attar) which is offensive" "Muslims put surma in their eyes" "Muslims says abba and ammi and not papa and maan jee"

Modi says he is the liberator of Muslim women on the triple talaq issue. Guess who backs him? Secularist and feminist Muslims.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Exactly!
There is reason why Rana Ayyub was hounded out after her expose convicted several murderers in the communal Gujarat pogrom of 2002. The RSS sees educated Muslims as a threat. They have seen what one liberal Muslim like Jinnah could do so they vowed to never let it happen again.
They don't want someone like Rana anymore , than they wanted Fatima Jinnah decades back. The mullahs cursed Fatima Jinnah for her dress as well.
Sleeveless, short hair, no burka.

View attachment 702042

Totally agree with this.

Hindustan breeds very specific types of Muslims in India to suit specific agendas. Owaisi types are predictable and therefore malleable. Their followers are predictablea and therefore malleable. They can be deceived by being allowed to busy themselves in minutiae of waqf board politics and peripheral technicalities of scholarly religious jurisprudence, all while sanghees quietly snatch their actual identities off them. Owaisi mocks Pakistan because he thinks Indian Muslims are freer to practice Islam because they get their scholarly boards and Hajj grants - when in reality they are no more than a museum exhibit, carefully curated by the real masters of Hindustan. The FIRST REQUIREMENT OF THE PRACTICE OF ISLAM should not be the establishment of sharia boards, but rather to rid the land of basic sanghee-type oppression. In this way, the carrot continues to be dangled by sanghees, and some foolish stubborn people keep snatching at it.

 

[letsrock]

I mentioned many times Islam is very attractive as religion. But some insist Islam is a constume(beard.skullcaps), language (urdu) and gender norms. The second category of people are not interested in Islam they are interesting in controlling Muslims and keeping them in what they think is "respectable" line.

 

[masterchief_mirza]

Believe me, the "Hindus" only laugh at the pyjama, skull cap bearded Indian Muslims. They would love to see all Muslims that way. The proof is right here on this forum where their IT trolls easily floor the religious arguments but are whipped silly by liberal secular Muslims talking well informed logic.



انکے جیسے مسلمان؟

View attachment 702028
یا انکے جیسے؟

View attachment 702026

Believe me the RSS Hindu would much rather have the Mullah.

I give up with you.
Would Indian Muslim girls like to be like this Turkish girl?

View attachment 702031
or like this riot hit Indian Muslim girl

View attachment 702032

[/QUOTE]
Some days I disagree vehemently with your posts. Today is like the polar opposite of those days.

 

[Cliftonite]

Jews are losing their identity due to intermarriage. You want Muslims to be just another ethnic group?
How is wearing a skull cap or using a rosary regressive?

Yet despite all that 9 million Jews outweight 300 million Muslims in the Middle East. Who cares about rigid old identities? Fckall with them.

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

Ambedkar was an imbecile, I don't know why Muslims in India praise him, especially our dear leader Owaisi. He was typical, at the end of the day he hated Muslims more than he hated his upper caste oppressors.

Lol. He hated all religions. He saw them as symbol of oppression. The reason for his conversion to Buddhism is political so as to give a way for his followers. He hated the Hinduism followed by Hindus then. His comment on Islam came when he decided to change religion and decided to research each and every religion and was surprised how Islam and Christianity was not so forward afterall from his pov. He is a great scholar and local petty minds like us can't understand him. Owaisi praises him cos using Ambedkar pisses off Brahmins. Nothing else.

 

[letsrock]

Lol. He hated all religions. He saw them as symbol of oppression. The reason for his conversion to Buddhism is political so as to give a way for his followers. He hated the Hinduism followed by Hindus then. His comment on Islam came when he decided to change religion and decided to research each and every religion and was surprised how Islam and Christianity was not so forward afterall from his pov. He is a great scholar and local petty minds like us can't understand him. Owaisi praises him cos using Ambedkar pisses off Brahmins. Nothing else.

Yes i agree. There is something weird about these so called "pakistani" posters and demonization of ambedkar. Ambedkar never hated islam like hindutvawadis. WHen he was tempted to convert to islam he studied it and did not like it and chose budhism - lets not forget there is plenty of casteism within indian muslims too . Thats not the same as hate. You may not marry a girl you considered - that doesnt mean you hate the girl and want her dead.

 

[Cherub786]

Lol. He hated all religions. He saw them as symbol of oppression. The reason for his conversion to Buddhism is political so as to give a way for his followers. He hated the Hinduism followed by Hindus then. His comment on Islam came when he decided to change religion and decided to research each and every religion and was surprised how Islam and Christianity was not so forward afterall from his pov. He is a great scholar and local petty minds like us can't understand him. Owaisi praises him cos using Ambedkar pisses off Brahmins. Nothing else.

I prefer the orthodox Brahmin with his choti and caste supremacist ideology to the Hindutvawadi. In the history of Muslim rule of India, our rulers usually tried to appease the Brahmins and did not attempt any radical social transformation of Indian society. The Hindutvawadi's outreach to the Dalits is a threat to us Muslims. As long as there is caste tensions in India we benefit, when Dalits become accepted even cherished part of the Hindu community we are vulnerable