Stone Age Soanian Culture (Ancient Pakistan II)

[UnitedPak]

And you are trying to claim back the same history which we got rid of.

You will say the BS and I would agree? You are wrong.

Pakistan was created because of religious differences. People in Aligarh and Meerut supported Pakistan because we are Muslims. We did not want to serve or come under that regime which is worshiping fire.
Stop changing the meaning of Pakistan!

So you joined two days ago just to start flaming people on this thread with your ignorant understanding of how heritage works?
Do you have the same message for all European Christians who are also following a middle eastern religion?

Pakistan movement was one aspect of our history. Granted it was a defining moment, but we did not "get rid" of anything prior to this. And under no circumstances did modern Indians become the inheritors of what you think "we got rid of".

 

[MSafir]

The above is meaningless conjecture. The REALITY is that us Pakistanis ARE the direct descendents of the IVC. Being a Muslim or not does not change that fact. In fact it succinctly explains our unique cultural and racial heritage

Stupid rant. Being a Muslim it definitely changes the fact and the fact is: the reason whole Muslims in the sub continent demanded Pakistan irrespective of their cultural background. What congestion do people in Hayderabad have with fire worshipers that the Nawab there supported the cause of Pakistan? He supported it only because he was Muslim, nothing else.

So you joined two days ago just to start flaming people on this thread with your ignorant understanding of how heritage works?

Listen you dude, derogatory language was used against me here I was called here Muahajir and was asked to go back. I am not even interested in this topic or what ruins say, least interested here. Though I respect it but its irrelevant to me. But if some one says that I should go back to Bihar or Utter Pradesh is something I am not going to accept.

One should hold himself from making such disgraceful remarks.

 

[Hamza913]

Get back on your banana boat Bihari.

Go back to Hindustan Mr Vedic.

Stupid rant. Being a Muslim it definitely changes the fact and the fact is: the reason whole Muslims in the sub continent demanded Pakistan irrespective of their cultural background. What congestion do people in Hayderabad have with fire worshipers that the Nawab there supported the cause of Pakistan? He supported it only because he was Muslim, nothing else.
Stop being ehsan faramosh.



Listen you dude, derogatory language was used against me here I was called here Muahajir and was asked to go back. I am not even interested in this topic or what ruins say, least interested here. Though I respect it but its irrelevant to me. But if some one says that I should go back to Bihar or Utter Pradesh is something I am not going to accept.

One should hold himself from making such disgraceful remarks.

Asalamu Alaikum

Ignore some of the chest thumping ethnic nationalists on this forum, almost every single Pakistani would consider you their brother, myself included. We are Muslim first and foremost, and alhamdulillah most Pakistanis still feel this way (but many of us need guidance on how to practise Islam).

Pakistan was made as a nation for Muslims in South Asia, based on the concept that we are simply too different to other communities in the region to coexist with them as a minority. Ethnicity did not play a significant role, otherwise Pakistan wouldn't be the multi-ethnic society that it is today.

In terms of history, we should view the history of Islam/Muslims in the region as OUR history, since these people would not only be our ancestors, but also the very reason our nation exists and more importantly the ones who acted in the name of Allah (The Most Gracious and The Most Merciful). After that, one is free to enjoy the history of their own ethnic group/tribal affiliation so long as it doesn't give him any arrogance and it doesn't involve praising people who fought against Islam/Muslims.

 

[MSafir]

Granted it was a defining moment, but we did not "get rid" of anything prior to this. And under no circumstances did modern Indians become the inheritors of what you think "we got rid of".

It was defining movement for Muslim and only Muslim having Islamic traditions otherwise people in hayderabad, Bengal, Bombay presidency would have not come together only to listen and get comments after 70 years about them being inferior or not from the land. People supported Pakistan not because some one in then British India was proud of his Hindu veda fire ancestry!!!

Go back to Hindustan Mr Vedic.



Asalamu Alaikum

Ignore some of the chest thumping ethnic nationalists on this forum, almost every single Pakistani would consider you their brother, myself included. We are Muslim first and foremost, and alhamdulillah most Pakistanis still feel this way (but many of us need guidance on how to practise Islam).

Pakistan was made as a nation for Muslims in South Asia, based on the concept that we are simply too different to other communities in the region to coexist with them as a minority. Ethnicity did not play a significant role, otherwise Pakistan wouldn't be the multi-ethnic society that it is today.

In terms of history, we should view the history of Islam/Muslims in the region as OUR history, since these people would not only be our ancestors, but also the very reason our nation exists and more importantly the ones who acted in the name of Allah (The Most Gracious and The Most Merciful). After that, one is free to enjoy the history of their own ethnic group/tribal affiliation so long as it doesn't give him any arrogance and it doesn't involve praising people who fought against Islam/Muslims.

Waliqum Salam

Sorry to end with that urdu liner, I take it back. I agree with you but these so called intellectuals come out suddenly from nowhere and forget the sacrifice of those millions on both sides during partition. Those people sacrificed or forced to sacrifice are today insulted on this forum. I have to be straight as this is what I felt. They did not sacrifice to claim or glorify some Vedas or sanskrit.

If in the end Muslims in the subcontinent had to define themselves as some Veda reader or Fire worshipper then there was no need to create Pakistan at all there are plenty in India and would have done it openly. And people who lived in interior Pakistan did not suffer at all, they got all the free nation to boast with.

Unfortunately this is the only reason why Indian call us people with problem with identity because no one knows why Pakistan was created. I have no problem with any one trying to tell about his history but if that person says I should go back to bihar and all then this is something beyond limits. We all know Pakistan remained a mixed ethnic group due to invasions and at this point of time it sheer stupidity to even talk about DNA. Even Monkeys have 99% DNA similar to Humans, so are we monkey? This is not how things go. We are what we follow that's it. I am pretty damn sure the guy who called me to go back is neither a Muslim nor any Hindu or veda follower who could read any Veda. he should change the way he talks.

Tc!

 

[UnitedPak]

@dsr478 @MSafir

Guys. You are really pushing your luck now. First of all this is a HISTORY subforum. Pick up a dictionary if you need to look up the word and I mean this in the most sincere way. History means, in the past. I question your commitment to Islam if something as basic as our actual past somehow shakes the foundation of your faith or makes you feel insecure about Islam.

This is another topic entirely and not relevant to a thread that begins with the word "Stoneage".

i.e Deal with your religious insecurities elsewhere.

 

[MSafir]

I question your commitment to Islam if something as basic as our actual past somehow shakes the foundation of your faith or makes you feel insecure about Islam.

It does not shake the religious belief what is shakes is the existence of Pakistan and ideology of two nation theory. The muslims in subcontinent ignored the whole stone age and pre medieval history during Pakistan movement and then created Pakistan by focusing on Islamic studies. One can study for the purpose of academics but fusing it with Pakistan's background would be contradictory. And then people like me will be asked to go back to bihar/utter pradesh, etc.

"Hindus and the Muslims belong to two different religions, philosophies, social customs and literature.... It is quite clear that Hindus and Muslims derive their inspiration from different sources of history. They have different epics, different heroes and different episodes.... To yoke together two such nations under a single state, one as a numerical minority and the other as a majority, must lead to growing discontent and final destruction of any fabric that may be so built up for the government of such a state." MA Jinnah 1940, Lahore

 

[Indus Priest King]

Funny how some

It does not shake the religious belief what is shakes is the existence of Pakistan and ideology of two nation theory. The muslims in subcontinent ignored the whole stone age and pre medieval history during Pakistan movement and then created Pakistan by focusing on Islamic studies. One can study for the purpose of academics but fusing it with Pakistan's background would be contradictory. And then people like me will be asked to go back to bihar/utter pradesh, etc.

"Hindus and the Muslims belong to two different religions, philosophies, social customs and literature.... It is quite clear that Hindus and Muslims derive their inspiration from different sources of history. They have different epics, different heroes and different episodes.... To yoke together two such nations under a single state, one as a numerical minority and the other as a majority, must lead to growing discontent and final destruction of any fabric that may be so built up for the government of such a state." MA Jinnah 1940, Lahore

Weren't you the one who denies Pakistan controls point 5353 in Kargil? Now you're desperately trying to say we shouldn't know our history?

Lol. Filthy Gangaldeshi.

If you knew anything about the Indus Valley...you'd know it was tolerant and welcoming to all people. If your ancestors supposedly migrated to Pakistan (the Indus Valley) they were coming to our land because the Ganges plain was a shithole...and still is.

 

[MSafir]

Weren't you the one who denies Pakistan controls point 5353 in Kargil? Now you're desperately trying to say we shouldn't know our history?

Lol. Filthy Gangaldeshi.

NO I WASN'T, I said Pakistan controls point 5353 on LOC and I also marked it on google maps. Don't behave like a retard now and twist my words. I know you are on weed. And behave properly don't you have manners how to talk?

If you knew anything about the Indus Valley...you'd know it was tolerant and welcoming to all people. If your ancestors supposedly migrated to Pakistan (the Indus Valley) they were coming to our land because the Ganges plain was a shithole...and still is

Are you on hallucinating drugs? When Pakistan was formed people also migrated to East Pakistan. What the hell are you on earth?

 

[UnitedPak]

The muslims in subcontinent ignored the whole stone age and pre medieval history during Pakistan movement and then created Pakistan by focusing on Islamic studies

Ignoring something doesn't make it go away. Indus history, i.e belonging to the land will always remain Pakistani history, as in belonging to the people of Pakistan. Pakistan movement, east Pakistan etc are modern events that do not impact the past. Your understanding of basic concepts is seriously underwhelming.

And it's obvious already that you are a false flagger, probably the same false flagger who was banned earlier.

 

[MSafir]

Pakistan movement, east Pakistan etc are modern events that do not impact the past. Your understanding of basic concepts is seriously underwhelming.

And it's obvious already that you are a false flagger, probably the same false flagger who was banned earlier.

Hey you need to behave okay don't talk rubbish unnecessarily.

I have quoted Qaid e Azam and he clearly says we have no relation of any sort of with any one else except from us being Islamic. This was the sole reason why Bengali Muslim and other Muslims from subcontinent segregated themselves and created Pakistan leaving their ground heritage behind.

You should be thankful to them rather behaving like a Nashukra.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

It was defining movement for Muslim and only Muslim having Islamic traditions otherwise people in hayderabad, Bengal, Bombay presidency would have not come together only to listen and get comments after 70 years about them being inferior or not from the land. People supported Pakistan not because some one in then British India was proud of his Hindu veda fire ancestry!!!


Waliqum Salam

Sorry to end with that urdu liner, I take it back. I agree with you but these so called intellectuals come out suddenly from nowhere and forget the sacrifice of those millions on both sides during partition. Those people sacrificed or forced to sacrifice are today insulted on this forum. I have to be straight as this is what I felt. They did not sacrifice to claim or glorify some Vedas or sanskrit.

If in the end Muslims in the subcontinent had to define themselves as some Veda reader or Fire worshipper then there was no need to create Pakistan at all there are plenty in India and would have done it openly. And people who lived in interior Pakistan did not suffer at all, they got all the free nation to boast with.

Unfortunately this is the only reason why Indian call us people with problem with identity because no one knows why Pakistan was created. I have no problem with any one trying to tell about his history but if that person says I should go back to bihar and all then this is something beyond limits. We all know Pakistan remained a mixed ethnic group due to invasions and at this point of time it sheer stupidity to even talk about DNA. Even Monkeys have 99% DNA similar to Humans, so are we monkey? This is not how things go. We are what we follow that's it. I am pretty damn sure the guy who called me to go back is neither a Muslim nor any Hindu or veda follower who could read any Veda. he should change the way he talks.

Tc!

The original idea of Pakistan was quite simple. I’m sure you know the acronym.

Only one guy you are speaking to here is a Non-Muslim. The rest of us are Muslims. Your faith is not being questioned so let’s relax.

I take great offense to your criticism of people of “interior Pakistan” as you call it. We are one nation and you are an important part of our nation as an Urdu speaker. We all sacrificed for this nation over the last 70 years.

Most of those people killed in partition violence were Punjabi and Kashmiri, most of those killed by terrorism on our borders were Pukhtoon, Urdu speakers left their homes, so we all suffered for Pakistan. Why create differences between us?

I am interested in our pre-Islamic history and gaining much from this discussion. I am comfortable as a Muslim living in a modern society who is educating himself about his ancestors’ beliefs and way of life. I fail to see how this is offensive to you.

 

[MSafir]

I take great offense to your criticism of people of “interior Pakistan” as you call it. We are one nation and you are an important part of our nation as an Urdu speaker. We all sacrificed for this nation over the last 70 years.

Most of those people killed in partition violence were Punjabi and Kashmiri, most of those killed by terrorism on our borders were Pukhtoon, Urdu speakers left their homes, so we all suffered for Pakistan. Why create differences between us?

You are entitled to take great offense and it's justified and when I resort to same on being asked to leave, that's unjustified? Am I creating the difference or your are creating? I just told the truth the only people who suffered from interior Pakistan were either those so called hindus veda readers and sikhs who left Pakistan or those Muslims who had relatives coming to Pakistan. What's wrong in this? The majority of violence took place at the border.

 

[UnitedPak]

Hey you need to behave okay don't talk rubbish unnecessarily.

I have quoted Qaid e Azam and he clearly says we have no relation of any sort of with any one else except from us being Islamic. This was the sole reason why Bengali Muslim and other Muslims from subcontinent segregated themselves and created Pakistan leaving their ground heritage behind.

You should be thankful to them rather behaving like a Nashukra.

Your knowledge of Qaid-e-Azam and the Pakistan movement has made it clear that you are a falseflagger.

Nowhere did Qaid-e-Azam say that Pakistan is abandoning its heritage. Yes we welcomed people in need and gained independence separate from a hindu majority India, but I will repeat, the Pakistan movement did not impact anything in the past. There was no time travel involved. You are conflating religious identity with ancestral origins. Both have their place. Generally speaking, religious people do not give non-Islamic history much attention but I have met very few people who deny it.

Muhajirs did not quite "leave their heritage behind", otherwise they wouldn't call themselves Muhajirs. And I am against anyone leaving their heritage behind. Everyone should know where they have come from.

 

[MSafir]

Yes we welcomed people in need and gained independence separate from a hindu majority India, but I will repeat, the Pakistan movement did not impact anything in the past.

Of course it did this is why Muslims in India's south region came out in open and adopted Islamic culture after Migration. It was always Islam first and its traditions as per Quran rather than local culture. This is why people created Pakistan. Otherwise they were not less Muslims sitting in Bengal or Bihar or Bombay or Assam.

You are not well versed in the history. Please get your facts correct.

 

[TMA]

It does not shake the religious belief what is shakes is the existence of Pakistan and ideology of two nation theory. The muslims in subcontinent ignored the whole stone age and pre medieval history during Pakistan movement and then created Pakistan by focusing on Islamic studies. One can study for the purpose of academics but fusing it with Pakistan's background would be contradictory. And then people like me will be asked to go back to bihar/utter pradesh, etc.

"Hindus and the Muslims belong to two different religions, philosophies, social customs and literature.... It is quite clear that Hindus and Muslims derive their inspiration from different sources of history. They have different epics, different heroes and different episodes.... To yoke together two such nations under a single state, one as a numerical minority and the other as a majority, must lead to growing discontent and final destruction of any fabric that may be so built up for the government of such a state." MA Jinnah 1940, Lahore

In my opinion this history can be additional to the two nation theory....even if our ancestors did not convert to Islam, coterminous Pakistan was still different....it was only the colonial entity known as British India which made "us" the same....

Go back to Hindustan Mr Vedic.



Asalamu Alaikum

Ignore some of the chest thumping ethnic nationalists on this forum, almost every single Pakistani would consider you their brother, myself included. We are Muslim first and foremost, and alhamdulillah most Pakistanis still feel this way (but many of us need guidance on how to practise Islam).

Pakistan was made as a nation for Muslims in South Asia, based on the concept that we are simply too different to other communities in the region to coexist with them as a minority. Ethnicity did not play a significant role, otherwise Pakistan wouldn't be the multi-ethnic society that it is today.

In terms of history, we should view the history of Islam/Muslims in the region as OUR history, since these people would not only be our ancestors, but also the very reason our nation exists and more importantly the ones who acted in the name of Allah (The Most Gracious and The Most Merciful). After that, one is free to enjoy the history of their own ethnic group/tribal affiliation so long as it doesn't give him any arrogance and it doesn't involve praising people who fought against Islam/Muslims.

By Hindustan do you mean the Land of the Indus or Bharat....?