Sikh and Hindu officers usher in a new era in Pakistani Army

[Flintlock]

Of course...

That's interesting.

So how did people vote? Universal suffrage?
What was the minimum age for voting?
How often did elections take place?
What institutions were setup to ensure that the elections were free and fair?
How were candidates deemed eligible to be elected?
Was there a judiciary to mediate incase disputes arose regarding the election results or allegations of cheating?

 

[Vinod2070]

very much.
Look if you can't get 100% it doesn't mean that you shouldn't for any thing at all. First 40 years were 100% then a decline came like democracy was taken oven by dictator ship and so on...

Dude, you are just fuzzing the issue.

Are you saying that in a 1400 year history only 40 years were the ideal Islamic rule!

Muslims had great power for a long period after that. Why couldn't they establish a single ideal Islamic state?

What makes you believe it can happen now if it did not happen for 1400 years? What has changed?

And I am not even discussing those 40 years for now.

 

[Comet]

I hope the mods don't mind this digression from the topic.

I would love to know umairp, what are the characteristics of an ideal islamic state.
Regarding its government, its laws, both criminal and personal, its attitude towards non-muslims and its education system.

Then we can compare your idea of an Islamic state with the Ottoman Empire, and see how close the resemblance is.

Its a huge Topic..

 

[Comet]

That's interesting.

So how did people vote? Universal suffrage?
What was the minimum age for voting?
How often did elections take place?
What institutions were setup to ensure that the elections were free and fair?
How were candidates deemed eligible to be elected?
Was there a judiciary to mediate incase disputes arose regarding the election results or allegations of cheating?

Where are you going. 1400 years ago any thing that was somewhat different that the ongoing mamlokiat was indeed democracy. There were no such rules back then. of course since there was no need.

 

[Flintlock]

Its a huge Topic..

Yes it is. Discussing the rules of an entire state is no mean task!

If you are serious about this Islamic state thing, you must know its details!

Incase you want to continue this line of discussion, feel free to open a thread in the theology section.

 

[Comet]

Dude, you are just fuzzing the issue.

Are you saying that in a 1400 year history only 40 years were the ideal Islamic rule!

Muslims had great power for a long period after that. Why couldn't they establish a single ideal Islamic state?

What makes you believe it can happen now if it did not happen for 1400 years? What has changed?

And I am not even discussing those 40 years for now.

As I said: If 100% is not achievable than atl east opt for 80% or 70%. The Leader wasn't elected the way he was suppose to but that doesn't mean every thing changes. We had zakat system we had judiciary and so on...

 

[Comet]

Yes it is. Discussing the rules of an entire state is no mean task!

If you are serious about this Islamic state thing, you must know its details!

Incase you want to continue this line of discussion, feel free to open a thread in the theology section.

sure I will

 

[Flintlock]

Where are you going. 1400 years ago any thing that was somewhat different that the ongoing mamlokiat was indeed democracy. There were no such rules back then. of course since there was no need.

I'm sorry, but you don't seem to understand what democracy is.

Democracy means that the leaders are elected.

So you have to know the details regarding who was allowed to vote, how often voting took place, who was eligible for election, what posts were open for election and how disputes were resolved!

If these basic details are not known to you, then how can you claim that there was democracy?

 

[Vinod2070]

As I said: If 100% is not achievable than atl east opt for 80% or 70%. The Leader wasn't elected the way he was suppose to but that doesn't mean every thing changes. We had zakat system we had judiciary and so on...

OK. So which was the last Islamic state which met 70%-80% of the ideals of the ideal Islamic state?

And pl. give a definitive answer this time.

And aren't the zakat system and the judiciary just tools to achieve a goal. We will see whether the goal was achieved in that 80% ideal state.

 

[Comet]

OK. So which was the last Islamic state which met 70%-80% of the ideals of the ideal Islamic state?

And pl. give a definitive answer this time.

The State. Well we don't have name for it. Its all the area held by the Muslims. One Center in Baghdad one in Spain.
Mughals didn't implemented it completely either but enough to have a separate identity.

 

[Comet]

I'm sorry, but you don't seem to understand what democracy is.

Democracy means that the leaders are elected.

So you have to know the details regarding who was allowed to vote, how often voting took place, who was eligible for election, what posts were open for election and how disputes were resolved!

If these basic details are not known to you, then how can you claim that there was democracy?

Democracy as you see in present has never always been like this. It has matured over time.
A Khaliphah is appointed for life time. Every one who has come of age is eligible to vote. The voting takes place in Masjids as it is the Center of Muslim Society. Every Muslim is eligible. With any discrimination of color or creed.

 

[Vinod2070]

The State. Well we don't have name for it. Its all the area held by the Muslims. One Center in Baghdad one in Spain.
Mughals didn't implemented it completely either but enough to have a separate identity.

So the three major Islamic states till a few 100 years back qualify to be called 70-80% ideal Islamic states.

The states would be:
Spain
The Turkish empire
The Moghal empire.

I hope I understood your posts correctly till now.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

On the Khalifa

Caliph - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

God's Caliph: Religious Authority in ... - Google Book Search

 

[Vinod2070]

Democracy as you see in present has never always been like this. It has matured over time.
A Khaliphah is appointed for life time. Every one who has come of age is eligible to vote. The voting takes place in Masjids as it is the Center of Muslim Society. Every Muslim is eligible. With any discrimination of color or creed.

That's interesting!

Wasn't it supposed to be perfect then?

How can mere human beings improve (or mature) a God given system which the ideal Islamic state is supposed to be?

 

[Comet]

So the three major Islamic states till a few 100 years back qualify to be called 70-80% Islamic states.

The states would be:
Spain
The Turkish empire
The Moghal empire.

I hope I understood your posts correctly till now.

Ya kind of