Shiekh Rasheed Interview with Sami Ibrahim | May 3 2022

[Verve]

they have visibility to the true power-potential of the Pakistani state in con

I understand your need to spread the counter narrative as I doubt the establishment has been so badly humiliated and shocked like this before.

So what have your know it all the best strategists establishment friends told you about the future? Any prophecies to share? Considering the majority is Brelvi and that would make majority Generals to be of the sect, there's little hope ..

Btw, 80k killed and 120b narrative was started by an ex COAS. This can not be attributed to IK.

 

[blain2]

I understand your need to spread the counter narrative as I doubt the establishment has been so badly humiliated and shocked like this before.

So what have your know it all the best strategists establishment friends told you about the future? Any prophecies to share? Considering the majority is Brelvi and that would make majority Generals to be of the sect, there's little hope ..

For me the establishment is Pakistan so its humiliation is Pakistan's humiliation and unlike some, I don't gloat over it.

Second, I am at least trying to put a counter-narrative in front of people. Most here are busy blindly toeing the PTI narrative as if all of it is the word of the Almighty.

Had that been the case, there would not have been so many U-turns during PTI's governance. So give credence to the fact that not everything spouted by PTI and its members is gospel. This includes a ton of misinformation, claims, accusations, and abuse being thrown around with abandon by some.

 

[VCheng]

Second, I am at least trying to put a counter-narrative in front of people. Most here are busy blindly toeing the PTI narrative as if all of it is the word of the Almighty.

That would be great, were it not for the conscious absence of such a needed counter-narrative when this setup was being installed to replace the previous one, making the effort selective and therefore ineffective now.

 

[Apollon]

China has a larger economy than all of EU

And?


World Economy has 3 big players.


EU, China and USA.


If you side with Russia you break with EU and USA.


To get you some numbers:.

The EU is Pakistan's second most important trading partner, accounting for 14.3% of Pakistan's total trade in 2020 and absorbing 28% of Pakistan's total exports.


Russia is not even in top ten of your trading partners.


You knoe what this means? Your army is smart and follows your intetests. You dont want get completly wiped out economicly.


China is your largest trade partner with 16%.



Followed by EU with 13%.

Russia is not even listed

 

[dbc]

View attachment 840783

fake tweet check https://twitter.com/rebeccagrantdc?lang=en

 

[SQ8]

I would humbly suggest, we should have our own thoughts instead of regurgitating the oft-repeated claims by IK. We should also give a pause to these "khuddari" proclamations because for those we can go to public rallies.

Second, the generals come from within us. They are not an alien species. They see and know things in the geo-political-security space that most in Pakistan are not privy to. That leads to a certain thought process because they have visibility to the true power-potential of the Pakistani state in contrast to what most common Pakistanis believe.

I like IK over the other chors but he has been less than honest on many occasions but many here are not willing to accept.

Nobody allows the slaughter of own people and your assertion to the same clearly indicates a proclivity to believe the IK/PTI narrative.

The basic issue is that 80K people died because we were in a vice. We had supported the Taliban takeover of Afghanistan. They were our partners. When 9/11 came, the US asked us to not support them given they were hosting AQ. We stopped supporting them because the world had turned against the Taliban. Their supporters turned their guns on the rest of Pakistanis.

More importantly, do you think the US would have just left Pakistan alone for saying "this is not our war" when the Taliban were our partners in Afghanistan? IK says this all the time "I would have told the West this is not our war" without ever answering what the US/West's response to that answer would have been. Like Musharraf, he would have gotten a plain, curt "you are either with us or against us" and he would have done the exact same as Musharraf! No ifs and buts about it.

Now he can posture and say a lot of things but since he was not in that situation, talk is cheap. Most in the know in the security circles are of the opinion that "this was our war" not because we wanted it, rather our alignment with Taliban resulted in this being thrust upon us. Pakistan could have said "this is not our war" if we were not the benefactors of the Taliban. But we were and the Americans knew that.

Lastly, the ones who visited 80,000 casualties on us were our own people. The drone strikes talked about ad-nauseum probably resulted in less than 5K casualties. The remaining vast majority came from suicide bombings and attacks on our people and security forces by our own gunmen/suicide bombers from FATA and Afghanistan.

I will just state that because of coming from within us(the choice to join the army or take the CS exam or study at GIK was theirs.. didn’t change their dna nor family/society around them) they also suffer the disease of Pakistani elitism. Hence the idea projected that our military leadership cannot be flawed is flawed to the core. They are humans, institutional values go so far if the society itself has an inherent rot within it.

 

[Olympus81]

Bajwa buckling under pressure also came with 1 pre condition. Limit it’s relationship with China.

So is Pakistan going to roll back on CPEC gradually. And then firmly throw itself into the US/EU camp and that will be the end of it.

What has that achieved? We’ll be getting crumbs while India will be propped as a counterweight to China. Would Pakistan’s future be rosy in that scenario? If the past is something to go by, Pakistan’s overly reliance on the US has achieved very little for Pakistan.

Again, Imran Khan wants good relations with China, Russia and continue maintaining good relations with US/EU. The world of foreign policy is neither black or white. Pakistan needs to be confident in it’s diplomacy to manage it’s interest vis a vis maintaining good relations with everyone. This is exactly why the military should not be handling foreign policy to begin with. It’s a domain exclusively for the foreign ministry.

 

[Zowais]

Second, the generals come from within us. They are not an alien species. They see and know things in the geo-political-security space that most in Pakistan are not privy to. That leads to a certain thought process because they have visibility to the true power-potential of the Pakistani state in contrast to what most common Pakistanis believe.

Second lieutenants come from us. But once they are generals(one star or above), unfortunately, they never come back to us. That's what makes them pretty much alien and sets their preferences not allined with us. If not all most of those who once mattered.

More importantly, do you think the US would have just left Pakistan alone for saying "this is not our war" when the Taliban were our partners in Afghanistan? IK says this all the time "I would have told the West this is not our war" without ever answering what the US/West's response to that answer would have been. Like Musharraf, he would have gotten a plain, curt "you are either with us or against us" and he would have done the exact same as Musharraf! No ifs and buts about it.

No. US should have changed the regime in Pakistan as they did (as it suited their agenda). Question is how leadership in our institutions would have reacted to it. Unfortunately their reaction was pathetic.

And yes, that was not our war to begin with. Just because US wanted us to fight it, should we lie to ourselves it was our war?

Had musharraf told them its not our war, may be their response would have been a regime change, as it couldn't be any worse to a nuclear power. Remember we suffered huge economic losses, besides losing our independence. Imagine we are trying to convince ourselves we are totally helpless. That's what this war on terror did to us, robbed us off our will to struggle.

In summary, we can't stand on our feet unless we decide to do so. Choice is always ours. Nobody saying let's go to war with US. Let's Just do what suits us.

 

[Tomcats]

Replacing Imran with the most Pro-Chinese party (given recent history), yeah big brain play for trying to get on the US side..

The amount of irony coming from all this is amusing though, take for example blasmephy, funnily enough Imran Khan was very vocal w.r.t the west taking action against 'blasmephous' content. Now his party is being labelled blasmephous and PTI is trying to show the same western states how 'diabolical' the current government is..

Also you would think that PTI would stand firm and take an 'absolutely not' stance against the US as some members have so passionately mentioned buuut instead you got them doing this..

https://twitter.com/x/status/1521775662465527809

https://twitter.com/x/status/1521601432444674051

Listen, the tldr of what i am trying to say is this, PTI is a political party at the end of the day just like PPP and PMLN. They use scummy tactics and PTI is not immune from doing so too. So instead of hypocritically doing the same cult following things other parties are lambasted for, critically analyze things. You'll be able to understand things with better clarity.

 

[Zowais]

Bajwa buckling under pressure also came with 1 pre condition. Limit it’s relationship with China.

So is Pakistan going to roll back on CPEC gradually. And then firmly throw itself into the US/EU camp and that will be the end of it.

Going away from china and into western camp is not the end. We will be stripped off our nukes (once majority of us beleive beggers can't be choosers), made to accept indian hedgemony in region, get used against chinese (for american interests) and become nobody, if current ruling setup continues.

 

[Ghazwa-e-Hind]

For me the establishment is Pakistan so its humiliation is Pakistan's humiliation and unlike some, I don't gloat over it.

Second, I am at least trying to put a counter-narrative in front of people. Most here are busy blindly toeing the PTI narrative as if all of it is the word of the Almighty.

Had that been the case, there would not have been so many U-turns during PTI's governance. So give credence to the fact that not everything spouted by PTI and its members is gospel. This includes a ton of misinformation, claims, accusations, and abuse being thrown around with abandon by some.

Words of The Almighty:

"And never will the Jews and the Christians approve of you until you follow their religion. Say, "Indeed, the guidance of Allāh is the [only] guidance." If you were to follow their desires after what has come to you of knowledge, you would have against Allāh no protector or helper." Surah Al-Baqarah 2:120

O believers! Take neither Jews nor Christians as guardians—they are guardians of each other.1 Whoever does so will be counted as one of them. Surely Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people. Surah Al-Maidah 5:51

 

[JX-1]

if IK comes back to power,

For the next years it will be Shahbaz and Bilawal in power. It looks like IK is done for right now. If he didn't make facebook uncle pro-Afghan Taliban statements maybe he could have stayed.

Now PTI has gone full anti Amreeka, the only hope of it coming back is the public's anger. Army does not want a repeat of 71 nor do Americans want compromised nukes, so a bloody revolution ain't happening.

 

[Olympus81]

Going away from china and into western camp is not the end. We will be stripped off our nukes (once majority of us beleive beggers can't be choosers), made to accept indian hedgemony in region, get used against chinese (for american interests) and become nobody, if current ruling setup continues.

Exactly. Once Pakistan is forced into this course correction led by Bajwa, the next step would be psychological conditioning. That would entail instilling hopelessness, defeatist mentality.

Reducing Pakistan into a vassal state, throw a few bread crumbs when the scream gets a louder, and then the nukes.

 

[SIPRA]

Exactly. Once Pakistan is forced into this course correction led by Bajwa, the next step would be psychological conditioning. That would entail instilling hopelessness, defeatist mentality.

Reducing Pakistan into a vassal state, throw a few bread crumbs when the scream gets a louder, and then the nukes.

Yes. That is precisely the fate, which this Bajwa & Co. and Criminal Political Mafia are envisaging for Pakistan. Bajwa is laying the foundation.

 

[Mrc]

This is a defeatist mentality and must be routed out .

They cannot win any wars or economy can propser when you have generals who will cover to a super power