shall the burqa be banned??

[flamer84]

Apparently @flamer doesnt think so as he calls all foreigners as foreigners be they 10th generation...as he mentioned clearly in a few of his posts till then...that his country and others shouldnt bring in their culture...clearly putting you not in the "our" area!

Yes,i consider the wearing of the burqa a foreign,medieval custom which has no place in Europe.I stand by that.Stop playing the racist card,it's been done to death and it's boring.

 

[liontk]

So we should start banning everything...I am sure I can find more articles on misuse of alcohol...heck why dont they ban that shit?

Or misuse of drugs...wait that is already banned but is getting allowed in some states in USA....

We already discourage alcohol from an early stage in our society starting from grade and we have made progress especially with cigarette prevention. They are not a direct security concern as they are not related to burqa and this is not the topic of this discussion. The burqa is someone concealing themselves from you and this is not fair to the rest of the population including in school.Like I said if people feel this is too much, they can always go away from Canada if we are not enlightened enough.

ahhaha, this discussion is making me crave some traditional Biryani with some chutney sauce smothered all over it .

 

[flamer84]

@flamer84
Toronto woman who lost fight to wear niqab in court ‘disillusioned’ after Crown drops sex assault case | National Post

Honestly this is what some fringe elements have tried to do in Canada but this will not work as our justice system requires cross examination to include the right for prosecutors to see your face. Has there been any precedence of this in your country? I

Nope,not yet.

@Akheilos .............I don't see what can't you understand.European societies have been built in a certain way and the burqa goes against our way,hence the appearance of "us" vs "them".As i continuosly point out and you refuse to understand-integration is a two way street.

 

[XenoEnsi-14]

Burka aka Abaya is a long figureless garment from shoulders to ankles for the females. The men equivalent is Thob.

Don't give me that AKA that only confuses the matter even more, I don't care what the male equivalent is only BURQA! If there is no clear definition then I can not vote. And any voting on this terminology is invalid.

Is the Burqa religious?
Is the Burqa tribal tradition?
Does the Burqa cover the whole body including face?

 

[Dubious]

No,it's our choice to uphold some elements in our life.Why can't you understand that this is not about hate towards muslims ?

Ok if that is the case ban every other clothing...make it fair!

You keep playing the discrimination card,you think it would be hard for me to admit i hate muslims if i really did ?

That is not my concern its your choice! I am not playing but showing the truth which is hypocrisy and skewdness!

It wouldn't cost me a thing,same for the rest of the Europeans,there wouldn't be muslims in Europe if that would be true.
Why can't you just make some conciliatory moves towards us,like dropping the burqa...

Ask them who wont cover up properly just coz its the new fashion....or them ladies who wear such high stilettos which cause health problems!

tolerance is a two way street.Don't get me started at some of the cheap shots like "western women like to be naked" thrown by some posters in here.This agressive behaviour and unwillingnes to compromise is bad for integration.

Tolerance is a 2 way street where none is given to Muslims....

Want to make a mosque, fine no athaan (5 times a day), no minarets but same doesnt apply to Churches...they get church tower and bell ringing everyday in fact some every hr! - 2 way street?

Want to practice your religion - fine no caps, no full dress code however nuns who are really practicing their religion dont have to abide to the clothes restrains and Jews can use their caps so can Sikhs!!

Do you not see the discrimination??

 

[liontk]

The decision to ban the burqa will most likely be uphold in a referendum...just as a side note if there would be a "kick muslims out of Europe " type of referendum it would fail miserably because contrary to popular myth Europe is a tolerant place.Just that tolerance has its limits.

Mon ami, I will not lie when I went to europe I had slight arrogance that muslims must be doing quite well as we were the model community in my personal opinion in states and Canada(our per capita is higher than the general population). However little did I know , our community down in Europe is not that successful sadly but I think in time they will be a great asset to Europe just like similar to Canada. I think the biggest mistakes that Europe made was taking too much immigrants as sadly europe does not have the immigrant culture that we have down here in north america ie.#american dream.

 

[Dubious]

Not wearing a Burqa doesn't equal being 'naked' otherwise the vast majority of the women would be naked whether in the Middle Ages or in the Modern World !

You brought up t-shirt as though they didnt already wear some form of clothing!

I can find nothing to suggest that that verse talks about a 'dress code' for women - It simply talks about covering up & that can be done by different women from different cultures in a different manner; we don't need to borrow from the Arabs what 'covering up' means & equate it with Islam.

IF it were the Arab's culture it wouldnt be in the Quran...QURAN is not to teach us their culture...Yes I was pointing at covering up...

Even a dupatta with a shalwar kameez is chaste enough !

For you while a bikini is chaste enough in the West!

I am 'for' banning the Burqa because its a security threat & it has nothing to do with Islam - A head-scarf gives your identity & does not constitute a security threat !

Maybe you dont understand I am not for banning the burqa coz it kills the very freedom that differentiates East from West!

 

[R2D2]

So many gays in Muslim countries and elsewhere in the world and the society is changing, so there should be a poll if men should wear pants with half their A%& showing or not. There may be benefit in this as they would concern them with each other just like gays wearing an earring in the west for signal. So in this way they will not recruit new members and the general population would be safer from their invitations.

Also someone said that whats the point in old women wearing burqa no one will stare at them. I would say that simiraly old men can also wear pants with half or full A** showing. No sensible
gay or woman will invite them because they are finished both ways. LOL

 

[flamer84]

Tolerance is a 2 way street where none is given to Muslims....
Want to make a mosque, fine no athaan (5 times a day), no minarets but same doesnt apply to Churches...they get church tower and bell ringing everyday in fact some every hr! - 2 way street?
Want to practice your religion - fine no caps, no full dress code however nuns who are really practicing their religion dont have to abide to the clothes restrains and Jews can use their caps so can Sikhs!!
Do you not see the discrimination??

No,because you're exagerating.There are plenty of mosques in Europe,minaret ban is only in tiny Switzeland and you can still have mosques and the ones that allready had minarets weren't destroyed.Many companies adapted to their muslim employees regarding praying hours,food choice,etc-so did schools,universities,etc.Muslims aren't hunted in the streets.Muslim politicians are part of the rulling class from the UK to Romania.....I can go on and on.Despite all of this you got the nerve to call us racists.It's shamefull.

Branding Europe as an opressive place for muslims is idiotic,disrespectull and simply a lie.All of that just because a tiny fringe of the muslim community wants to wear a beadsheet from the 9th century.

 

[Dubious]

And quite a few more than just one terrorist were caught fleeing while wearing a Burqa in Pakistan including a handful of women suicide bombers (or so the news said) who weren't checked because they were wearing the Burqa & what do you know the next thing happens is that they explode on the security checkpost !

like yo usaid as the news said...only DNA would be able to tell it was a male of female...And as for checking if you saw video in post 2 she had no problem with security checking!

So something which has no justification in Islam unless one thinks that Medieval Arab culture is the same as Islam, I don't see why something like this should be tolerated !

Unless you are saying Quran was talking about Medieval Arab culture and that they were wearing nothing and hence they were asked to cover their bosom...then Yea maybe! But that is as ridiculous as it can get!

You claimed its not in the Quran I showed you what is! Asking women to cover up...how? cover your bosoms and the description given...now unless the women in "MEDIEVAL ARAB" didnt cover their bosoms that is why Quran said so or maybe Quran was joking coz women were already covering up you know wearing t-shirts as per your example then Yea its not mentioned in the Quran to cover up...it was a mistake!

And here I am not justifying Western countries - I don't give a frig about what they do or do not do in their own countries - I'm just saying that I wouldn't want this to be done in Pakistan !

Why not?

Because if the State can say 'wearing promiscuous' clothing is not alright than it sure as hell can say that 'wearing a Burqa' is not alright !

What about the West? Where nude beaches is alright!

 

[flamer84]

What about the West? Where nude beaches is alright!

Yes...private places......start your private burqa beaches.

 

[ranjeet]

why does the "their country their law" rule doesn't apply here? If certain countries want it banned they have full right to go ahead and do that.

 

[Armstrong]

You brought up t-shirt as though they didnt already wear some form of clothing!

I simply brought up the T-Shirt to emphasize that one doesn't need to wear a Burqa or any similar dress to cover one's self up - Even a T-Shirt does that !

IF it were the Arab's culture it wouldnt be in the Quran...QURAN is not to teach us their culture...Yes I was pointing at covering up...

Its not in the Koran !

We took the 'covering up bit' & drew endless extrapolations from it & said to ourselves 'Hey this is what the Medieval Arab women used to wear so this must be Islam' - Its not !

Go for the 'principle' not the 'cultural attire' !

For you while a bikini is chaste enough in the West!

I don't deal in 'chaste' or otherwise I was just pointing out that what we Muslims use to identify 'chastity' isn't really intrinsically linked with 'chastity' - Its Arab Culture & their expression of 'chastity' !

Maybe you dont understand I am not for banning the burqa coz it kills the very freedom that differentiates East from West!

I am for banning the Burqa because in my opinion it has no justification in Islam & so I'm not going to listen to someone else (not you) emotionally blackmailing others that this is 'religious discrimination'; furthermore its a security threat & should not be allowed as such !

I can't imagine why wearing a head-scarf doesn't fulfill any Muslim's religious sensibilities ?

Furthermore I don't really care what the West does - I know that they're not fair in this....the minarets in Switzerland & the Mosques in Athens amongst other things is testament to that including the scare-mongering about Muslims despite evidence to the contrary - I speak only in the context of Pakistan !

 

[Dubious]

No,because you're exagerating.There are plenty of mosques in Europe,minaret ban is only in tiny Switzeland and you can still have mosques and the ones that allready had minarets weren't destroyed.

Yea and niqaab ban started from France and now is spreading too...so how secure are Muslims about Switzerland intolerance not spreading?

Many companies adapted to their muslim employees regarding praying hours,food choice,etc-so did schools,universities,etc.Muslims aren't hunted in the streets.Muslim politicians are part of the rulling class from the UK to Romania.....I can go on and on.Despite all of this you got the nerve to call us racists.It's shamefull.

i didnt call you racist! That is you and your thinking but I will call Europeans intolerant and discriminatory!

Branding Europe as an opressive place for muslims is idiotic,disrespectull and simply a lie.All of that just because a tiny fringe of the muslim community wants to wear a beadsheet from the 9th century.

I never said it was oppressive...I pointed out some things that you guys have done and cant deny it! And that was damn racist as compared to anything I said!

Its not a tiny fringe for the one using it!

It is not a tiny fringe for the one to whom it means something

It def is not a tiny fringe when it is getting banned!

 

[liontk]

Apparently @flamer doesnt think so as he calls all foreigners as foreigners be they 10th generation...as he mentioned clearly in a few of his posts till then...that his country and others shouldnt bring in their culture...clearly putting you not in the "our" area!

Security concern is already tackled in the video in post 2....yes and the lady clearly mentioned she has no problem where its a security issue....

as for going back...you cant even say that to those who chose to wear the face veil and are converts to Islam...which country do you (who is not considered a local - I am talking about Europe- though dealt as one under the law but still not considered ...the word Asian still pops up) want to send the "local" to? ....

He has a point though, if you will consider yourself a foreigner so will the general population. Integration is a two way street and if muslim community can integrate successfully in north america, I am sure we can do so in l'Europe. However this is not the case, if a community chooses to settle themselves in ethnic ghettos then it simply impossible to integrate. Although this discussion pertaining to niqab has nothing to do with the socio economic problem but rather the security situation in europe. We have had people of certain muslim sects sadly from even Canada go down to middle east and wage some mythical Jihad. I will reiterate, niqab is not only a security concern but also something that is a barrier to integration.