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Shahed-136 - Tracking usage & expanding understanding.

They don't fill the same job, a cruise missile hits a bunker and there's no more bunker, your drone hits a bunker and there's no more drone
Drone hits bunker. Bunker is ignited with almost anywhere from 20-50kg of diesel depending on remaining fuel.

No problem if you want to be a cooked marshmallow.
 
I dont understand why Ukraine doesnt publish a memory dump of Shahed-136 in internet.

Any Ukrainian engineer can do that.

And it will be useful for two things:
a) Demostrate it's Iranian technology
b) Let a lot of people around of world to try to reverse engineering it and search bugs to shoot down shaheds cheaply.
 
I dont understand why Ukraine doesnt publish a memory dump of Shahed-136 in internet.

Any Ukrainian engineer can do that.

And it will be useful for two things:
a) Demostrate it's Iranian technology
b) Let a lot of people around of world to try to reverse engineering it and search bugs to shoot down shaheds cheaply.
Why are you surprised the apparently most advanced military on earth - NATO, that couldnt beat the backwards Taliban in the Afganistan war, would be able to come up with quick and effective solutions to the Shahed 136 problem in Ukraine?

And you know Ukraine is lying when it says its intercepting 85% of the S-136s in Ukraine? lool...it seems like for Ukraine, the worse Ukraine's military does, the more Shaheds UAF shoots down. Ukraine can only live a lie for so long.

Apparently Ukraine lost 200K forces in the war so far. Green novice smoke packs Cannon fodder army.
 
Why are you surprised the apparently most advanced military on earth - NATO, that couldnt beat the backwards Taliban in the Afganistan war, would be able to come up with quick and effective solutions to the Shahed 136 problem in Ukraine?

And you know Ukraine is lying when it says its intercepting 85% of the S-136s in Ukraine? lool...it seems like for Ukraine, the worse Ukraine's military does, the more Shaheds UAF shoots down. Ukraine can only live a lie for so long.

Apparently Ukraine lost 200K forces in the war so far. Green novice smoke packs Cannon fodder army.
They lost 200000 military personnel, I actually feel that’s a highly inflated number, because you would think if let’s say the Russians are right they lost 2 to 3 thousand men or if you believe western numbers 30 to 50 thousand dead or injured they should have technically won by now, my point 200000 men is highly exaggerated
 
They lost 200000 military personnel, I actually feel that’s a highly inflated number, because you would think if let’s say the Russians are right they lost 2 to 3 thousand men or if you believe western numbers 30 to 50 thousand dead or injured they should have technically won by now, my point 200000 men is highly exaggerated
You know, you are probably correct, but it still indicates that Ukraine has lost ALOT of military manpower.

Ukraine has easily lost 50-150K soldiers since the conflict started, and obviously many of these will be experienced troops (probably also experienced in the Ukraine war from 2014-now), which aren't easily replaceable by new or conscript troops.
 
You know, you are probably correct, but it still indicates that Ukraine has lost ALOT of military manpower.

Ukraine has easily lost 50-150K soldiers since the conflict started, and obviously many of these will be experienced troops (probably also experienced in the Ukraine war from 2014-now), which aren't easily replaceable by new or conscript troops.
Again if you include civilians yeah 150000, 50000 dead and injured believable on the soldier front, again if you can believe 150000 experienced Ukrainian soldiers are dead or badly injured Russia should have won by now, not fortifying cities for a last stand, beginning of the war was Ukrainians fighting last stands in factories, again it’s the Russians who are telling people to evacuate and cross to more secure lines, that’s not a Russia that’s speaking like they’re going to win the war that’s Russia saying run or your going to die.
 
Another conflict where China avoids head to head showdown with the west.

Wish Mao was still alive.
YOu misunderstand China's strategic patience for weakness. Timing matters alot.

Can we get any relevant stats on Ukrainian military's shoot down % of the Shahed-136s?? Ukranian military last said they intercept 85%, so how do they back that big claim up?
 
Theyre not supposed to fill the same role but they have proven to be more effective in the Russian war effort than whatever Russia has mustered thus far.

I take it as a compliment that US wants to reverse engineer our drones lol
Not really, cruise missiles and ballistic missiles were much more devastating at the start of the war.

No one wants to copy your drones, US has far more and better suicide drones than Iran. They're studying your weapon to counter it better.

Drone hits bunker. Bunker is ignited with almost anywhere from 20-50kg of diesel depending on remaining fuel.

No problem if you want to be a cooked marshmallow.
All you do is burn up some cement while the soldiers are sitting safely inside
 
Reading this is literally mind-blowing,its an article by the new york times which purports to show the ukrainians "success" at "pioneering successful techniques in the difficult art of anti-drone warfare"


‘We Heard It, We Saw It, Then We Opened Fire’
With an intense, hastily assembled effort, the Ukrainian military is pioneering successful techniques in the difficult art of anti-drone warfare.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/23/world/europe/ukraine-russia-drones-iran.html
23ukraine-drones-photo1-articleLarge.jpg

Police officers in Kyiv, Ukraine, trying to shoot down a drone during an attack on Oct. 17. The drone was believed to be an Iranian-made Shahed-136, purchased by Russia in August:guns: 😮

By Andrew E. Kramer
Oct. 23, 2022


KYIV, Ukraine — Directed by ground controllers tracking a drone on radar, a Ukrainian fighter jet pilot, code-named Juice, streaked through the sky in pursuit, hoping to sneak up behind the slow-moving Iranian-made craft and take it down with a missile.
But on this day, as on many others, Juice found nothing.
Shooting down noisy, propeller-driven Iranian-made drones is a frustrating business and harder than it might seem. It takes multiple actors on the ground and in the air working closely together for 24 hours a day.
“The last few weeks were very busy, very exhausting for us,” Juice said of the air war against the drones, dozens of which Russia has deployed daily. “It’s still very, very difficult to shoot them down.”
The war in Ukraine is now fought in two mostly separate arenas: on the ground in the south and east, where the Ukrainian Army has the upper hand, and in the air, where Russia is firing long-range missiles and deploying the exploding Iranian-made drones to cripple the electrical and heating infrastructure in Ukrainian cities in the hopes of demoralizing the population.

Since Russia began terrorizing Ukrainian cities in September with the drones, Ukraine has turned its focus to an intense counter-drone strategy, made up on the fly but often surprisingly successful.
Currently, it consists of three layers of protection: fighter jets that patrol around the clock; ground-fired antiaircraft missiles; and teams of soldiers with machine guns who try to shoot the drones down as they fly past.
The hardest part is simply finding the drones, Juice said. On radar, the small, plodding drones can be confused with migrating birds or trucks on a highway. Ground controllers identify potential targets and direct jets to intercept them, but often the pilots come up empty.

Despite the hurdles, the Ukrainian military is now routinely shooting down more than 70 percent of the Shahed-136 drones Russia purchased from Iran in August, Yuriy Sak, an adviser to the Ukrainian minister of defense, said in an interview.

Ukraine shot down the first such drone in the country’s east on Sept. 13 and has since downed at least 237, the Ukrainian military said in a statement last week. “We are trying to quickly adapt to the new reality,” Mr. Sak said.

Exploding drones are a rapidly emerging class of weapons that are proliferating around the world and likely to become a staple of modern armed conflicts, military analysts say. That is a point that Ukrainian officials have been making in seeking air defense assistance from their allies. If Ukraine can learn to shoot the drones down with its three-pronged effort, allied countries’ militaries could reap the benefits of this hard-won experience, Mr. Sak said.

There have been notable successes.

One Ukrainian MiG pilot won folk hero status in Ukraine this month for shooting down five Iranian Shahed-136 drones over the central Ukrainian city of Vinnytsia, only to be forced to eject after crashing into the debris of the last one. The pilot, Karaya — who identified himself by only his nickname, according to military policy — told the local news media afterward, “Within a short period of time, we are adapting to this kind of weapon and are starting to destroy it successfully.”

After colliding with the airborne debris, he said, Karaya steered his MiG away from Vinnytsia and ejected. The jet crashed into houses in an outlying area, but injured nobody on the ground. Karaya later visited the site to apologize.

“I visited the scene, said I was sorry for the discomfort I caused the residents and thanked them for their steel nerves,” he wrote on Instagram, saying he showed up in his tattered uniform, missing epaulets. He joked that it was a violation of military protocol. “Lost them while leaving the office,” he wrote.
While fighter jets have been effective against Iranian drones, said Yurii Ignat, a Ukrainian Air Force spokesman, the approach is costly because of its use of air-to-air missiles. “It’s frustrating that we must hit these drones with expensive missiles,” he said. “What else can we do? This is the reality now.”
Before Russia’s arsenal included the Iranian-made drones, beginning in August, Ukraine had an edge in drone warfare.

Ukrainian soldiers along the front line flew off-the-shelf commercial drones to spot targets and drop grenades on Russian trenches. The United States has supplied Ukraine with its Switchblade drones, a type of exploding drone. Ukraine has also deployed Turkish-made Bayraktar TB2 drones — larger, longer-range craft that surveil the battlefield and fire guided missiles.

In August, the United States promised that within the next nine months it would deliver to Ukraine a small, compact counter-drone missile system that could be mounted on the back of an ordinary pickup truck. The so-called Vampire system is a newly developed anti-drone technology that can reach out farther than a machine gun, but is portable enough to be driven quickly into the path of incoming drones.
After a drone swarm attack on Kyiv on Monday, Ukraine’s foreign minister, Dmytro Kuleba, appealed to Israel for air defense weapons. The plea was rebuffed by Israel’s minister of defense, Benny Gantz, largely because Israel depends on Russian cooperation for the Israeli Air Force to conduct raids in Syria. Israel, he said, would provide early warning systems, but not air defense weapons.
Mr. Sak, the adviser to the Ukrainian defense minister, said Israel could be missing an opportunity to hone its tactics in facing down threats in its own territory by assisting in the counter-drone efforts now underway in Ukraine.
“These Iranian drones that are hitting Ukrainian cities were not developed, not meant for Ukraine,” Mr. Sak said. “They were developed as a mass capability to strike Israel. They are using Ukraine as a testing ground, to see weaknesses, to perfect them, and sooner or later they will use them against Israel.”
A Ukrainian official, speaking off the record, has said Israel has provided intelligence useful for targeting the Iranian drones.

The drones, when in flight, also have a distinctive buzz from their small engines, which has proved a vulnerability.
In Kyiv, three policemen shot down one drone with their Kalashnikov rifles after hearing the buzz, described by witnesses as sounding like a chain-saw engine, and then seeing the triangular weapon fly toward them over rooftops.
“There was very little time to make a decision,” said Sgt. Oleksandr Kravchuk, who is a shooting instructor with the police department.
He said he fired all 30 rounds in his magazine, trying to aim in front of the craft to account for its speed in flight. The drone veered off course and crashed, blowing up about 75 yards from where he was standing, Sergeant Kravchuk said in an interview.
“We heard it, we saw it, then we opened fire,” he said.
 
Again if you include civilians yeah 150000, 50000 dead and injured believable on the soldier front, again if you can believe 150000 experienced Ukrainian soldiers are dead or badly injured Russia should have won by now,
Russia "should have won by now" is not fully logical, because nobody knows exactly what really should have happened now, so you cant just choose what outcome to expect of Russia- For one, expecting a win by now is acutally unrealistic when you consider and accept NATO's HUMUNGOUS supply of weapons and $$ to Ukraine.

Buuuuut also, Ukraine hasnt taken ANY LAND in the past 3 weeks- that could be very indicative that Ukraine has already lost too many important soldiers, and more are dying in vain trying to enter Kherson and Donetsk, and RUssia is literally MOWING THEM like GRAINS and seeds into the ground with Artillery, missiles and drones.

Good Ukraine war analysts like Moon of Alabama correctly said Ukraine has been losing 500-1000 soldiers PER DAY in this war, and this war is almost 9 months old, so if you do that math, you still get mid to high xx,xxx # of Ukrainian soldiers dead.
 
Russia "should have won by now" is not fully logical, because nobody knows exactly what really should have happened now, so you cant just choose what outcome to expect of Russia- For one, expecting a win by now is acutally unrealistic when you consider and accept NATO's HUMUNGOUS supply of weapons and $$ to Ukraine.

Buuuuut also, Ukraine hasnt taken ANY LAND in the past 3 weeks- that could be very indicative that Ukraine has already lost too many important soldiers, and more are dying in vain trying to enter Kherson and Donetsk, and RUssia is literally MOWING THEM like GRAINS and seeds into the ground with Artillery, missiles and drones.

Good Ukraine war analysts like Moon of Alabama correctly said Ukraine has been losing 500-1000 soldiers PER DAY in this war, and this war is almost 9 months old, so if you do that math, you still get mid to high xx,xxx # of Ukrainian soldiers dead.
@Stryker1982 Please forgive me, this will be my last post.
 

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