Secularism in the context of Pakistan

[livingdead]

pardon me for being rude last time we met, no i can't explain sufism. it's really hard for me to explain it.
but sufism is something really connected with the spirtual world. where there are no worldly boundaries like religion, nationalism etc...

I dont remember the incident ... but excused anyway... lolz
well as a personal guiding philosophy of life, may be I can understand a bit what you are saying (or may be I dont), but that hardly be relied to make a real world decision involving large group of people.

 

[ssethii]

As I mentioned inthe OP


secularism shlecurims is just a slogan.

What people really want us Pakistanis is to reduce our fundoo Islamist habits and become normal human beings.

Human beings that are inclusive and tolerant.

That's all.

similarly someone can argue about your lifestyle too.
I agree on the first part.

 

[Kaniska]

Why religion is so important for most of people in Muslim countries? Why can not a citizen of Muslim nations have a life without invoking religion into all aspect of life ?...If we can, i feel that is enough to understand the meaning of secularism...

 

[BATMAN]

Secularism in the context of Pakistan

Secularism has no context in Pakistan, hence stop preaching it to kids.
Its an individual belief, keep it to your self or get prepare to accept return preach.

 

[ssethii]

I dont remember the incident ... but excused anyway... lolz
well as a personal guiding philosophy of life, may be I can understand a bit what you are saying (or may be I dont), but that hardly be relied to make a real world decision involving large group of people.

we live in a world in which trillions are spent on defense of countries and in same countries there are people who can't afford a piece of loaf two times a day.
So does that make sense to you?

Why religion is so important for most of people in Muslim countries? Why can not a citizen of Muslim nations have a life without invoking religion into all aspect of life ?...If we can, i feel that is enough to understand the meaning of secularism...

religion is of prime importance around the globe. That is the reason why we call ourselves civilized people.

 

[Bilal.]

Islamists are those who do politics in name of religion. The term is not used to mean Islamic scholars.

Like the Prophet(S.A.W) did?

 

[livingdead]

we live in a world in which trillions are spent on defense of countries and in same countries there are people who can't afford a piece of loaf two times a day.
So does that make sense to you?

no, it does not make sense, the issue is if a single country starts to spend weapon others have to spend some on it.
Without a universal agreement on weapon reduction or a no war pact, it will be stupid to stop spending on defence.
Anyway this is offtopic.

 

[Bilal.]

islamist is from islamism... followers of islam are called muslim not islamist...
islamism is the belief that islam is the driving force for all of the follower's action and in practice its activist islam / political islam / militant islam.

So basically someone who believes that Islam is not a set of rituals but a complete code of life, right?

For you it means that,but for 90% of the world population the word ''Islamist'' is a negative word such as;Muslim extremist,mullah,taliban,Al-Nusra,Hezbullah,Al-caida etc...
So i agree with @FaujHistorian .

Argumentum ad populum...



Btw shouldn't this be in social forum?

 

[livingdead]

So basically someone who believes that Islam is not a set of rituals but a complete code of life, right?

Actually the term is very loosely defined. My understanding is its a recently coined term to explain recent phenomena.
In its usage Its not as much about a personal belief (like say if you belief islam is a complete code of life and live by it personally without influencing others) but more strident demand for change you want in society/politics and everybody's life.

The activities can range from forming groups that influences others into beliving such system, or creating / demanding political voice to implement such system or in extreme case in using violence to bring changes to the existing system so as to make it compatible with islam.

 

[ssethii]

no, it does not make sense, the issue is if a single country starts to spend weapon others have to spend some on it.
Without a universal agreement on weapon reduction or a no war pact, it will be stupid to stop spending on defence.
Anyway this is offtopic.

sorry for going off-topic but that was a counter example.
The thing is everyone in this world is working for it's own interests that's why we see a lot of conflict of interests in every walk of life for say govt. Sufism starts with the idea of killing your own interests for the sake of others.

 

[livingdead]

sorry for going off-topic but that was a counter example.
The thing is everyone in this world is working for it's own interests that's why we see a lot of conflict of interests in every walk of life for say govt. Sufism starts with the idea of killing your own interests for the sake of others.

I think it is one of those things that beyond my capability of understanding, so I will probably wont strain my brain anymore.
thanks anyway.

 

[Bilal.]

Actually the term is very loosely defined. My understanding is its a recently coined term to explain recent phenomena.
In its usage Its not as much about a personal belief (like say if you belief islam is a complete code of life and live by it personally without influencing others) but more strident demand for change you want in society/politics and everybody's life.

The activities can range from forming groups that influences others into beliving such system, or creating / demanding political voice to implement such system or in extreme case in using violence to bring changes to the existing system so as to make it compatible with islam.

Politics is an aspect of life. Barring violence why is it wrong to try to promote ones political ideology?

 

[livingdead]

Politics is an aspect of life. Barring violence why is it wrong to try to promote ones political ideology?

I never said its wrong to promote one's political ideology.

 

[Kaniska]

we live in a world in which trillions are spent on defense of countries and in same countries there are people who can't afford a piece of loaf two times a day.
So does that make sense to you?


religion is of prime importance around the globe. That is the reason why we call ourselves civilized people.

I respect your opinion but i am not sure this is true in all senses.....People are good and civilized because they understand humanity, social behavior and whole lot of good things and it can be completely unrelated to religion too...

 

[Bilal.]

I never said its wrong to promote one's political ideology.

My reply was a generic one, towards the discussion at large and not specifically pointed at you.