Scrap Rafale, Viva Tejas!

[Hindustani]

What this thread has exposed so far is the deep rooted understanding of Pakistanis that they will never be able to fight India again, and that they need china to do it for them. Their past boasts about one muslim being equal to ten hindus, and therefore Pakistan snatching Indian states from India easily have all been drowned in the cold waters of reality. So their current national dream is that in future they will provoke a war with India, and then big daddy China will attack India with all its might (risking all its progress and peace for the sake of an unworthy Pakistan), and thereby allow Pakistan to steal the Indian states they covet. They don't bother to think about the ground reality, that India is far more important to china than Pakistan is, with thousands of kms of shared borders, hundreds of billions of dollars in trade (the annual trade between India and China will be half of Pakistan's GDP by 2018) and common aspirations on the world stage. They think that just because India and CHina fought a limited border war 50+ years ago, Chinese people hate Indians in the same manner that Pakistanis do. Not realizing that hatred for an entity defining their existence is the hallmark of weak, tottering, failing nations, not that of countries like China or India. So when a Chinese member points out that there is no such hatred between the two, they feel terribly insecure, because there goes there dreams of getting India's territories from India, by getting a worthier country to fight their wars. They feel so scared and insecure that they start hurling abuses against one and all. Another common delusion they live in is that each state in India is trying to secede from India, and the people there associate themselves with china or Pakistan or Timbuktu more than India. Pakistanis have these fearsome insurgencies in every province that they find difficult to quell, and they have to believe that India is the same, because they don't want to admit the fact that India is doing better as a nation than they are. So a handful of Maoists living deep in some forest, getting their backsides kicked by police forces equates to their army and air force warring against powerful militias. Everybody who "looks oriental" (whatever that means) owes allegiance to china. (Why not to Korea, btw? They look "oriental" too.)


@Chinese-Dragon: You are wrong to think that @RazPaK has something personal against you. He does not discriminate, he spews racist garbage and religious insults every time his pet delusions come face to face with reality. When he loses an argument, he immediately starts insulting Hinduism, or insulting the other person's mother. That provides us with some laughs, because it is always fun to see somebody come into a thread all macho, and then descending into the depths of desperation.

On topic:

BS article to discuss the topic. Rafales and LCAs can only complement each other, not substitute each other. They are in different categories. Rafales carry 8 tonnes of armament, LCA Mk1 carries 3.5 tonnes. LCA costs less than half a rafale to procure, and the cost of ownership will be several times lower. Rafale procurement WILL NOT kill the LCA Mk2 - the IAF will need hundreds of light aircrafts to do the bulk of its lower end needs, even if we get 200 rafales. Getting rafales AND gripen would have killed the LCA. LCA will serve in large numbers, and so will rafales. There is no question about it.

I'm gonna save this.

 

[MST]

The problem with their line of thought, is that it is just not true. Chinese people don't really think about South Asia at all, our main priorities are in the Pacific.

And we sure as Hell aren't going to fight on behalf of foreign nations, just like we never conducted a military intervention in any Indo-Pakistani conflict in the past.

If they want to ignore all basic logic and geopolitical realities (national self-interest) and then start insulting me and hurling racial abuse at me when they crush their own delusions, what can I say.

This is not the first time its happening. During the Afghan War (against Soviets) Pakistanis were trained to think that Americans are their savior. Now that the reality struck after 2001 90% of them hate US. The problem is that most Pakistanis are fed on propaganda that is devoid of logic. Earlier the darling was US now its China.

 

[AHAM BRIHMASMI]

Assamese are not Chinese citizens, they are not ethnic Chinese, they are not culturally Chinese, they do not live on Chinese territory, nor have they applied for a Chinese passport.

So attacking an Assamese is most certainly NOT the same as attacking a Chinese.

I am really quite confused as to why you would say that? Most Chinese don't even know what an Assamese is, I certainly didn't before I came to this forum.

Actually this the biggest drawback of most pakistanis,

They hate reading and studying from the sources other than madarsa's

 

[arp2041]

The last time a BIG POWER Declared WAR on another BIG POWER b'coz of her attack on a SMALL NATION, it resulted in a World War. But than that was 20th century & THAT was PRE-NUCLEAR AGE.

Can We afford something like this today??

This is 21st Century, Stop Dreaming, neither India nor China can afford a War with each other when there economic interest are so intertwined in the ERA OF GLOBALIZATION & that too b'coz of some THIRD nation??

Give Me A BREAK!!

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

The last time a BIG POWER Declared WAR on another BIG POWER b'coz of her attack on a SMALL NATION, it resulted in a World War. But than that was 20th century & THAT was PRE-NUCLEAR AGE.

Can We afford something like this today??

This is 21st Century, Stop Dreaming, neither India nor China can afford a War with each other when there economic interest are so intertwined in the ERA OF GLOBALIZATION & that too b'coz of some THIRD nation??

Give Me A BREAK!!

That's true.

In the age of a globalized economy and nuclear weapons, it is no longer feasible for large countries to fight each other.

Nowadays it is always one big country attacking a smaller country, like America vs. Vietnam/Iraq etc. Never big countries fighting each other.

Simply because the costs are too great. It becomes much easier to just buy out the resources that you need, like China is doing in Africa.

 

[Dillinger]

The last time a BIG POWER Declared WAR on another BIG POWER b'coz of her attack on a SMALL NATION, it resulted in a World War. But than that was 20th century & THAT was PRE-NUCLEAR AGE.

Can We afford something like this today??

This is 21st Century, Stop Dreaming, neither India nor China can afford a War with each other when there economic interest are so intertwined in the ERA OF GLOBALIZATION & that too b'coz of some THIRD nation??

Give Me A BREAK!!

Needs must. Remember Razzi's post about how they could eviscerate us...conditional upon China providing unhindered and unprecedented military support in men and hardware on the "Pakistanis independence day celebrated in Hyderabad" thread? Never did go it alone, too much of a burden for a flea-bitten nation which aspires to punch above its weight and ends up being called out by all and sundry. Lord forbid that India and China actually settle the border dispute in the future, some of our established posters here might actually collapse and fall victims to delirium.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Point is, he vent his Frustration on you

Maybe because I was supporting India against the western hypocrisy in the Italian marines issue.

This is not the first time its happening. During the Afghan War (against Soviets) Pakistanis were trained to think that Americans are their savior. Now that the reality struck after 2001 90% of them hate US. The problem is that most Pakistanis are fed on propaganda that is devoid of logic. Earlier the darling was US now its China.

That's not our fault though, if they want to have such a delusion.

Everyone knows how geopolitics work, it's all about national self-interest.

 

[arp2041]

Needs must. Remember Razzi's post about how they could eviscerate us...conditional upon China providing unhindered and unprecedented military support in men and hardware on the "Pakistanis independence day celebrated in Hyderabad" thread? Never did go it alone, too much of a burden for a flea-bitten nation which aspires to punch above its weight and ends up being called out by all and sundry. Lord forbid that India and China actually settle the border dispute in the future, some of our established posters here might actually collapse and fall victims to delirium.

Believe Me, It may take time - Years or even one or two Decades, but it will surely be settled Once & for all.

This is a DIPLOMATIC issue b/w these two MATURE nations.

No way like a Kashmir Dispute.

We may settle for a "West for East" (read Aksai Chin for Arunachal) solution with China which makes the Status quo border as the IB.

Both countries know that they can't take the burden of world's largest Border Dispute forever.

 

[EagleEyes]

Stick to the topic....

 

[SamantK]

I still don't understand what you are trying to say.

Dude, As I said before many Pakistani think in one way, either you are with us or you are against us..
They think that Pakistan being in a 'strategic location' and countries wanting the access to the 'warm water' (Gwadar) will court Pakistan no matter what.

 

[janon]

@WebMaster am I allowed to report a number of posts all which are derailing this thread and discussing a banned member?

You are also allowed to report a number of off topic posts by a site site admin, about assam and ULFA. Why the selectivity in detecting off topic posts?

And by the way, the "banned member" in question contributed a lot to the thread (in his own manner), before being banned. So mentioning him did not come randomly out of the blue.

And in my defence, only 13.3% of my post discussed the banned dude. The rest was either about the ongoing geopolitical discussion, or strictly on topic of the thread.

Now in fear that you may report THIS post for being off topic for the thread, I will contribute something on Tejas and Rafale again, though the premise of the article is not really worth discussing:

Looking at the number of aircrafts that IAF has to retire by 2017, and knowing that IAF needs 39 to 42 squadrons to defend the nation's interests comfortably, any fool can see that 126 (or even 189) rafales will not be enough. We will still face a shortage of 200 aircrafts, and LCA will fill that vacuum. Neither will kill the other. Neither can substitute for the other.

 

[Dillinger]

I WANTED A TWO FRONT WAR WHERE THE SFF WOULD LASE THE TARGETS AND OUR DARIN EQUIPPED JAGUARS, DAMOCLES EQUIPPED RAFALES WOULD ENGAGE MASSED MECHANIZED FORCES WITH DAISY CUTTERS AND CLUSTER MUNITIONS! NO SUCH LUCK NOW IT SEEMS.

 

[janon]

I WANTED A TWO FRONT WAR WHERE THE SFF WOULD LASE THE TARGETS AND OUR DARIN EQUIPPED JAGUARS, DAMOCLES EQUIPPED RAFALES WOULD ENGAGE MASSED MECHANIZED FORCES WITH DAISY CUTTERS AND CLUSTER MUNITIONS! NO SUCH LUCK NOW IT SEEMS.

While the MKIs fly in circles across Beijing and Shanghai, painting the sky with the tricolor. Learn to dream big!

 

[Awesome]

Dude, As I said before many Pakistani think in one way, either you are with us or you are against us..
They think that Pakistan being in a 'strategic location' and countries wanting the access to the 'warm water' (Gwadar) will court Pakistan no matter what.

Just one guy... Where did you get MANY figure? I was there talking to CD as well. We can disagree without issues. He can have an opinion about Pakistan contrary to mine and I of China contrary to his. He is not representative of China, nor I of Pakistan.

 

[SamantK]

Just one guy... Where did you get MANY figure? I was there talking to CD as well. We can disagree without issues. He can have an opinion about Pakistan contrary to mine and I of China contrary to his. He is not representative of China, nor I of Pakistan.

I was not talking about you, was talking about others I have read. Forgive my memory I can not list all here.