Rumors: Finally AH-1Z are coming

[ali_raza]

Hi,

Because he is our " GO TO GUY " over here---.

Once you establish your credentials---they will send their questions to you as well---.



Hi,

It is not easy to get the pictures of the choppers at the base---even though it is about a 150 yards from my house----the fence that is---.

u live in kant.
i have house at masoom shah

 

[ARMalik]

Yeah, I am finding out this may not be the right forum for me, too many egos and not enough facts. Have learnt a bit from a few posters who know what they are talking about but they are in a tiny minority here,

Hang in there buddy; just use 'Ignore' option and it will do wonders. Public forum needs a lot of patience.

 

[Yasser76]

I believe you used to participate on Pakdef as well,I do agree with you on the lack of facts on this forum that's why been a silent spectator for 14 years.

Yes, I started out on Pakdef in 2001, the early days! Showing my age now! What was your username there?

Hang in there buddy; just use 'Ignore' option and it will do wonders. Public forum needs a lot of patience.

Thanks Yaar

 

[crankthatskunk]

I believe you used to participate on Pakdef as well,I do agree with you on the lack of facts on this forum that's why been a silent spectator for 14 years.

That's what happened to me, I registered here in 2011. But when I started to write some home truth about OBL raid and Pakistan's army participation in it. I started to have the attention and my posts were deleted. I walked off from this forum, because I just cannot take hypocrisy.
Only in last one year I have come back and started to take active part.
That's why the posts counts is so high of many who have joined way after you and me.

The funny things is that because of their posts counts these people started to take themselves way too seriously.

 

[Mumm-Ra]

Page 16 on a thread about imaginary news. Only Pakistanis are capable of this...

This is peanuts as compared to the defunct F-16V thread. Then we had 100+ pages of speculation, discontent, blame game and ego $hit. Compared to that thread, this thread is quite civil.

 

[Signalian]

Its real and its Rawalpindi

Upgrading 48 x AH-1F would have added a better punch since the upgrade brings the capabilities of -1F closer to -1Z, even the ability of firing AGM-114R, which combines an anti-tank warhead with a fragmentation sleeve for use against both armored vehicles and soft targets. The main object of interest, LongBow Radar, is already not coming with -1Z while it has been provided across the border to IAF AH-64E.

Even then, if Pakistan gets the following from original deal, minus the -1Zs and the Engines, the upgrades of older -1F would have been worth it.
1000 x AGM-114 R Hellfire II Missiles
36 x H-1 Technical Refresh Mission computers
17 x AN/AAQ-30 Target Sight Systems
30 x 629F-23 Ultra High Frequency/Very High Frequency Communication Systems
19 x H-764 Embedded Global Positioning System/Inertial Navigation Systems
32 x Helmet Mounted Display/Optimized Top Owl
17 x APX-117A Identification Friend or Foe
17 x AN/AAR-47 Missile Warning Systems
17 x AN/ALE-47 Countermeasure Dispenser Sets
18 x AN/APR-39C(V)2 Radar Warning Receivers
15 x Joint Mission Planning Systems
17 x M197 20mm Gun Systems.

The -1Fs could have been upgraded with the following:
L3 Wescam MX-15D sensor turret which is similar to -1Z's AAQ-30A thus allowing the -1Fs to use the new sensor system with Hellfire missiles and Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System II laser-guided rockets, or APKWS II.
OrbitalATK AN/AAR-47 missile approach warning system coupled with an Extant Aerospace AN/ALE-47 dispenser able to fire decoy flares and chaff. Replacing all analog systems with LN-251 inertial navigation system.

The -1Zs provide advantages like precision strike, enhanced survivability and can operate at high-altitudes. It would have been more sensible to help the Turkish with their engine issues for the option of T-129, which provides similar advantages over older -1Fs, probably by letting go of -1Zs along with spare engines altogether. T-129 would have had a major advantage of Mmw Radar which -1Zs don't bring with them. WZ-10 would have bolstered older but upgraded -1F Cobras and it would also have its own MmW radar,but then again 20mm gun vs 23mm gun as logistics burden. Lastly, Mi-35 are already in service with their 23mm guns where as T-129 employs 20mm guns. This covers all the terrain from east and west, from north to south for PAA in case of gunships, but that is a sordid mixture of American, Turkish, Chinese and Russian ATGMs. Then the spares, upgrades and technician/pilot training on 4 different machines, if -1F retire; another ball game.

 

[Tipu7]

Pakistan and Turkey have discussed the matter of upgrading AH-1F of Pakistan alongside delivery of surplus airframes to replace the outdated airframes within Pakistan inventory year ago. But along side many other factors, US approval is crucial. And United States has repeatedly blocked several PAF attempts in recent years for acquiring surplus US origin hardware from non US sources.​

Therefore, the Americans, even if they allowed such upgrade will attempt to press their own stock of AH-1S and even AH-1W if we decided to keep the Cobra fleet for longer interval of time along side new AH-1Z. And their upgradation will be prone to US approval.

Upgrading 48 x AH-1F would have added a better punch since the upgrade brings the capabilities of -1F closer to -1Z, even the ability of firing AGM-114R, which combines an anti-tank warhead with a fragmentation sleeve for use against both armored vehicles and soft targets. The main object of interest, LongBow Radar, is already not coming with -1Z while it has been provided across the border to IAF AH-64E.

Even then, if Pakistan gets the following from original deal, minus the -1Zs and the Engines, the upgrades of older -1F would have been worth it.
1000 x AGM-114 R Hellfire II Missiles
36 x H-1 Technical Refresh Mission computers
17 x AN/AAQ-30 Target Sight Systems
30 x 629F-23 Ultra High Frequency/Very High Frequency Communication Systems
19 x H-764 Embedded Global Positioning System/Inertial Navigation Systems
32 x Helmet Mounted Display/Optimized Top Owl
17 x APX-117A Identification Friend or Foe
17 x AN/AAR-47 Missile Warning Systems
17 x AN/ALE-47 Countermeasure Dispenser Sets
18 x AN/APR-39C(V)2 Radar Warning Receivers
15 x Joint Mission Planning Systems
17 x M197 20mm Gun Systems.

The -1Fs could have been upgraded with the following:
L3 Wescam MX-15D sensor turret which is similar to -1Z's AAQ-30A thus allowing the -1Fs to use the new sensor system with Hellfire missiles and Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System II laser-guided rockets, or APKWS II.
OrbitalATK AN/AAR-47 missile approach warning system coupled with an Extant Aerospace AN/ALE-47 dispenser able to fire decoy flares and chaff. Replacing all analog systems with LN-251 inertial navigation system.

The -1Zs provide advantages like precision strike, enhanced survivability and can operate at high-altitudes. It would have been more sensible to help the Turkish with their engine issues for the option of T-129, which provides similar advantages over older -1Fs, probably by letting go of -1Zs along with spare engines altogether. T-129 would have had a major advantage of Mmw Radar which -1Zs don't bring with them. WZ-10 would have bolstered older but upgraded -1F Cobras and it would also have its own MmW radar,but then again 20mm gun vs 23mm gun as logistics burden. Lastly, Mi-35 are already in service with their 23mm guns where as T-129 employs 20mm guns. This covers all the terrain from east and west, from north to south for PAA in case of gunships, but that is a sordid mixture of American, Turkish, Chinese and Russian ATGMs. Then the spares, upgrades and technician/pilot training on 4 different machines, if -1F retire; another ball game.

 

[Yasser76]

Upgrading 48 x AH-1F would have added a better punch since the upgrade brings the capabilities of -1F closer to -1Z, even the ability of firing AGM-114R, which combines an anti-tank warhead with a fragmentation sleeve for use against both armored vehicles and soft targets. The main object of interest, LongBow Radar, is already not coming with -1Z while it has been provided across the border to IAF AH-64E.

Even then, if Pakistan gets the following from original deal, minus the -1Zs and the Engines, the upgrades of older -1F would have been worth it.
1000 x AGM-114 R Hellfire II Missiles
36 x H-1 Technical Refresh Mission computers
17 x AN/AAQ-30 Target Sight Systems
30 x 629F-23 Ultra High Frequency/Very High Frequency Communication Systems
19 x H-764 Embedded Global Positioning System/Inertial Navigation Systems
32 x Helmet Mounted Display/Optimized Top Owl
17 x APX-117A Identification Friend or Foe
17 x AN/AAR-47 Missile Warning Systems
17 x AN/ALE-47 Countermeasure Dispenser Sets
18 x AN/APR-39C(V)2 Radar Warning Receivers
15 x Joint Mission Planning Systems
17 x M197 20mm Gun Systems.

The -1Fs could have been upgraded with the following:
L3 Wescam MX-15D sensor turret which is similar to -1Z's AAQ-30A thus allowing the -1Fs to use the new sensor system with Hellfire missiles and Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System II laser-guided rockets, or APKWS II.
OrbitalATK AN/AAR-47 missile approach warning system coupled with an Extant Aerospace AN/ALE-47 dispenser able to fire decoy flares and chaff. Replacing all analog systems with LN-251 inertial navigation system.

The -1Zs provide advantages like precision strike, enhanced survivability and can operate at high-altitudes. It would have been more sensible to help the Turkish with their engine issues for the option of T-129, which provides similar advantages over older -1Fs, probably by letting go of -1Zs along with spare engines altogether. T-129 would have had a major advantage of Mmw Radar which -1Zs don't bring with them. WZ-10 would have bolstered older but upgraded -1F Cobras and it would also have its own MmW radar,but then again 20mm gun vs 23mm gun as logistics burden. Lastly, Mi-35 are already in service with their 23mm guns where as T-129 employs 20mm guns. This covers all the terrain from east and west, from north to south for PAA in case of gunships, but that is a sordid mixture of American, Turkish, Chinese and Russian ATGMs. Then the spares, upgrades and technician/pilot training on 4 different machines, if -1F retire; another ball game.

Good post, but then these upgrades will require US permission, they will cost money, they will add more weight to a chopper then already struggles at altitude and from what I gather a lot of the fleet remains unservicable due to lack for airframe spares. Only 3-4 operators left globally all with relatively small fleets. Of course massive number of used ones in US boneyard we can use for spares but that also needs US permission.

 

[Arsalan]

Its real and its Rawalpindi

I think he was talking about this picture that you quoted in below mentioned post and confirmed as fake.

The picture was a bad PS circulating in military circles.

Il-78 has not brought anything from today's flight.

View attachment 641582

This is the picture that was used in the photo shopped version, Imposed over the image of Rawalpindi city.

Among other things that people have been pointing out,, look at the pilot uniforms, not ours!

 

[Signalian]

Pakistan and Turkey have discussed the matter of upgrading AH-1F of Pakistan alongside delivery of surplus airframes to replace the outdated airframes within Pakistan inventory year ago. But along side many other factors, US approval is crucial. And United States has repeatedly blocked several PAF attempts in recent years for acquiring surplus US origin hardware from non US sources.​

Therefore, the Americans, even if they allowed such upgrade will attempt to press their own stock of AH-1S and even AH-1W if we decided to keep the Cobra fleet for longer interval of time along side new AH-1Z. And their upgradation will be prone to US approval.

Jordanians planned to upgrade their -1Fs. Turks will replace the older AH-1F in any case, probably keeping AH-1W in service with T-129. Older/refurbished US AH-1S and AH-1W, if upgraded still carry a punch, although Pakistan could then get a chance to upgrade its -1Fs too. T-129 engine is the issue on which Pakistan could join Turks to talk with USA, at least for first batch of deliveries. An engine and full fledged gunship like -1Z are not the same, leverage could be there. T-129 should become the mainstay of PAA if WZ-10 doesn't show up in ranks. One has to see what -1Z offers which T-129 doesn't and vice versa, eventually T-129 could come on top for PAA.

Good post, but then these upgrades will require US permission, they will cost money, they will add more weight to a chopper then already struggles at altitude and from what I gather a lot of the fleet remains unservicable due to lack for airframe spares. Only 3-4 operators left globally all with relatively small fleets. Of course massive number of used ones in US boneyard we can use for spares but that also needs US permission.

AH-1F vs AH-1W/1Z for engine power and the T-129 for same Ops.

 

[Tps43]

hahahaha ker rahi hai behind the curtain Americans ne kaha tha Visa le lo ya AH-Z1/Radar apke bhai ne Visa sacrifice ker diya mulk ke liye ab tu defense ministry se keh ker 1 Balakot mai plot dila do

hahaha roger

Super Cobras, are coming, or have started coming?

C130J = 4+5

Real stuff - In next 60days, new ..........

As per my info we are inducting them in new sqn.
Yes correct 4+5
New MOB

 

[Signalian]

hahaha roger


As per my info we are inducting them in new sqn.
Yes correct 4+5
New MOB

How many -1Z arriving next week?

 

[Tps43]

How many -1Z arriving next week?

next month

 

[Tipu7]

next month

And No deliveries made yet?

 

[Tps43]

And No deliveries made yet?

As per input 2 were taken