Qaher F313 l News & Discussion

[VEVAK]

And they are must have for supersonic jets, unless u have DSI or cones. Qaher has neither. Even for transonic jets they are recommended.

One look at the wing and you can tell that this is clearly not meant to be a super sonic fighter! this is a high subsonic fighter and if you wanna compare it to anything you'll have to compare it to the U.S. F-117 NOT other 5th generation fighters!

Also, this is a working prototype NOT a production model! It may not pass the test required to get to a production model yet!

 

[SOHEIL]

This is clearly NOT a production Model! This is Iran 1st working prototype and with all prototypes you use as many off the shelf parts as you can this is NORMAL!

In fact I like those wheels ...

 

[VEVAK]

even Russia and China are struggling with 5th generation fighter , why people except us to make 5th gen fighter with 8-12 billion dollars yearly budget ( and most of it spend in other fields ) !?

Say's who?
Both Russia & China have built 5th generation fighters!

I'm not expecting Iran to build a 5th gen fighter with AESA radar, advanced sensors, IRST, thrust vectoring, super cruise....

Iran 1st and for most needs high speed, high maneuverability, low RCS interceptors and air superiority fighters!
As we have seen in Syria Air Defense systems are not enough to stop a raid!

Also Air Defense systems can easily be overwhelmed when 60-100 missiles are suddenly fired at one location

This Q-313 Iran has showed I love BUT I still believe Iran needs to be developing a supersonic low RCS platform that can in the future be turned into a 5th gen fighter via upgrades

 

[ashool]

vivak are you engineer or do you have any proof this fighter is not supersonic or are you the one of those people have secret info about it so if not please close that door do you think if one powerful engine it had cant be supersonic so please dont say any crap

One look at the wing and you can tell that this is clearly not meant to be a super sonic fighter! this is a high subsonic fighter and if you wanna compare it to anything you'll have to compare it to the U.S. F-117 NOT other 5th generation fighters!

Also, this is a working prototype NOT a production model! It may not pass the test required to get to a production model yet!

 

[VEVAK]

In fact I like those wheels ...

It's not a matter of like brother it's how much weight, pressure and beating those wheels can handle during landing!

I believe Iran needs to be investing in a platform that will have a future! Don't get me wrong I love this new Q-313 and it makes me proud BUT I honestly would have been happier if Iran had reverse engineered the F-14!

Iran needs to start investing in a platform that can be upgraded into a 5th Gen fighter! The Engines can be J-79's and later upgraded same with every other equipment from radars to everything else "BUT"
The Platform needs to be capable of supersonic flight, Low RCS design with an internal weapons bay!
And all of this is within Iran's capability!

The reason they chose the Q-313 is because just like the F-5 it is an aircraft with LOW Titanium requirements! And this is the MAIN mistake Iran keeps on repeating!

Today Iran is exporting it's Aluminum! they have recently started exporting their magnesium and within a year they will start exporting our Titanium!
Why do you think Europeans came and started buying our magnesium as soon as we started production? Because we are stupid enough to sell such an expensive alloy and mineral rather than turn it in to a product!

Iran can easily design and build a Supersonic, Low RCS Platform with an internal weapons bay! The engine, sensors, and weapon system may not be 5th gen but just as the U.S. did with the F-22 the other parts can be upgraded through time as long as the platform is there!

The Q-313 unfortunately is not a platform that can ever be turned into an Air Superiority fighter but at least its a start for Iran to design it's own fighter rather than reverse engineer them BUT at the end of the day investing in a platform with low titanium requirements is a mistake!

The war in Syria has proven once again that a country without a strong Air Force is a country at risk! And a country that can't build it's own Advanced Fighters will always be a country dependent on others!

vivak are you engineer or do you have any proof this fighter is not supersonic or are you the one of those people have secret info about it so if not please close that door do you think if one powerful engine it had cant be supersonic so please dont say any crap

That Aircraft is a high Subsonic fighter! Anyone that tells you otherwise doesn't even know how the speed of sound was broken let alone anything else!

So the one that doesn't know jack here is YOU buddy!

 

[mohd497]

Say's who?
Both Russia & China have built 5th generation fighters!

I'm not expecting Iran to build a 5th gen fighter with AESA radar, advanced sensors, IRST, thrust vectoring, super cruise....

Iran 1st and for most needs high speed, high maneuverability, low RCS interceptors and air superiority fighters!
As we have seen in Syria Air Defense systems are not enough to stop a raid!

Also Air Defense systems can easily be overwhelmed when 60-100 missiles are suddenly fired at one location

This Q-313 Iran has showed I love BUT I still believe Iran needs to be developing a supersonic low RCS platform that can in the future be turned into a 5th gen fighter via upgrades

You just cant be sure if this is super sonic or sub sonic. Just yet. Next, yes it is not as maneuverable as other fighers but who cares. Is maneuverability the first line of defence or stealth. This is 21st century there is a reason everyone is going for 5th generation stealth platform rather to persue maneuverability.

If you think that iran cant produce 5th gen. You are in big surprise. I highly recommend you to research about boeing bird of prey. Objective of that fighter is very clear. Unibody, cheap, stealth and affective aircraft. Qaher is just like that. Plus have some believe in your armed forces they know what there need is.

If they didnt US advance drone will not be brought down. With US changing statements undermining iran.

Obama wouldnt had begged for drone to return rather there will be a strike.

Hezbullah wouldnt have shot down israeli ship with iranian cruise missile.

After seeing yourself. Your own advancment in stealth coating. Where US carriar couldnt spot your drone. You are saying to me that iran cant produce 5th generarion fighter ....


For price you need to understand even if you make a simple table inside the US it will cost 500 dollars. In iran it will cost 50 dollars.

Have some beleive man.

 

[Hassan Guy]

....we should probably build a stealth fighter too now

 

[VEVAK]

You just cant be sure if this is super sonic or sub sonic. Just yet. Next, yes it is not as maneuverable as other fighers but who cares. Is maneuverability the first line of defence or stealth. This is 21st century there is a reason everyone is going for 5th generation stealth platform rather to persue maneuverability.

If you think that iran cant produce 5th gen. You are in big surprise. I highly recommend you to research about boeing bird of prey. Objective of that fighter is very clear. Unibody, cheap, stealth and affective aircraft. Qaher is just like that. Plus have some believe in your armed forces they know what there need is.

If they didnt US advance drone will not be brought down. With US changing statements undermining iran.

Obama wouldnt had begged for drone to return rather there will be a strike.

Hezbullah wouldnt have shot down israeli ship with iranian cruise missile.

After seeing yourself. Your own advancment in stealth coating. Where US carriar couldnt spot your drone. You are saying to me that iran cant produce 5th generarion fighter ....


For price you need to understand even if you make a simple table inside the US it will cost 500 dollars. In iran it will cost 50 dollars.

Have some beleive man.

Please read my other post before commenting!

1st off I am 100% sure that it is a high subsonic fighter NOT a supersonic fighter! If that design breaks the sound barrier it will start shaking to a point that it will compromise the airframe! So I'm sure!

2ndly you don't know much about fighters if you think Maneuverability is not important if a missile is fired at you and you can't make steep high G turns then your dead! Why do you think US put Thrust Vectoring on it's F-22 that is the most advanced stealth fighter in it's arsenal and the stealthiest? On a fighter they have banned from exporting! Also, if what you said made any sense the U.S. wouldn't of retired the F-117 a decade ago!
The F-15 was produced a decade before the F-117 and is still being used today but the F-117 is not! So Your absolutely wrong!

And here is your bird of pray
Max speed 299 MPH

SO again YOUR WRONG!


Iran is capable of building the Airframe of a 5th Generation fighter if they were to invest in it that much is clear
BUT Iran is NOT capable of building

1.Turbofan Engines with Super Cruise Capability
2.Thrust Vectoring engines
3.AESA Radars
4.5th Gen Data links
5.5th Gen Sensors
6.Advanced long range IRST
7.Helmet Mounted Displays
8.5th Gen Weapons Systems with BVR capability
Etc, Etc,

The most expensive part of an Air Superiority Fighter is it's Air Frame! Why? Because the amount of titanium required to build it is greater than the weight of the actual Aircraft it's the same with F-15's, F-14's & F-22's

Iran is capable of building a 5th Generation Supersonic Airframe with Low RCS (Stealth) and an Internal Weapons bay! BUT they Choose NOT TO DO SO! WHY? because they want to build a fighter with low titanium requirements just like the F-5 & the Q-313
It's not a matter of Can't! They can at the very least build a 5th Gen Airframe! The main problems is that they don't want to spend the money on a fighter that requires an expensive Airframe!

Titanium is one of the top 10 most abundant minerals in the world but what makes is so expensive is the process required in turning it into an alloy! Also, there are different grades of titanium & aluminum and the ones needed in Air Superiority fighters are extremely expensive

So it's not a matter of CAN'T it's that Iran doesn't WANT to build an expensive Airframe required in a 5th Generation Air Superiority fighter

 

[eagle2007]

ALCON,

Just so everyone's clear, the Boeing Bird of Prey was NOT a fighter aircraft concept, but a manned tech demonstrator for their future UCAV designs. The Boeing X-45A traces its lineage directly from the BoP.

Boeing made it "on the cheap" (still cost $67mil) because they had to pay for it, not the DoD. Heck, the poor bird likely didn't even have a pressurized cockpit (evidenced by its ceiling of just 20,000 feet).

http://www.boeing.com/news/frontiers/archive/2002/november/i_pw.html

Fabulous design though.

 

[scythian500]

Mohsen !?

Do you really think i am stupid !?

View attachment 391037

Exactly same wheels !!!

View attachment 391038

View attachment 391041

It seems that the Qaher picture you have chosen is not in the same angle of view as of F-5s.. am I right? If I,m right then another meter could be added so my estimate would 14 meters... Although Mashregh, in its report, mentioned 16m and also 15 to 20 t final version (the one that is going to fly) and it will be super sonic, interal bay and with radars. This is what the guys in charge of the project say.. I guess

 

[Englishman]

Quite embarrassing......

Why are you persians actually defending this piece of junk? No proof it can actually fly other than some I'll prepared CGI......

You guys are quite resilient and you've dealt with sanctions quite well but you can't make a 4th jen fighter never mind a 5th gen.

Regards

 

[mohd497]

Please read my other post before commenting!

1st off I am 100% sure that it is a high subsonic fighter NOT a supersonic fighter! If that design breaks the sound barrier it will start shaking to a point that it will compromise the airframe! So I'm sure!

2ndly you don't know much about fighters if you think Maneuverability is not important if a missile is fired at you and you can't make steep high G turns then your dead! Why do you think US put Thrust Vectoring on it's F-22 that is the most advanced stealth fighter in it's arsenal and the stealthiest? On a fighter they have banned from exporting! Also, if what you said made any sense the U.S. wouldn't of retired the F-117 a decade ago!
The F-15 was produced a decade before the F-117 and is still being used today but the F-117 is not! So Your absolutely wrong!

And here is your bird of pray
Max speed 299 MPH
View attachment 391138


SO again YOUR WRONG!


Iran is capable of building the Airframe of a 5th Generation fighter if they were to invest in it that much is clear
BUT Iran is NOT capable of building

1.Turbofan Engines with Super Cruise Capability
2.Thrust Vectoring engines
3.AESA Radars
4.5th Gen Data links
5.5th Gen Sensors
6.Advanced long range IRST
7.Helmet Mounted Displays
8.5th Gen Weapons Systems with BVR capability
Etc, Etc,

The most expensive part of an Air Superiority Fighter is it's Air Frame! Why? Because the amount of titanium required to build it is greater than the weight of the actual Aircraft it's the same with F-15's, F-14's & F-22's

Iran is capable of building a 5th Generation Supersonic Airframe with Low RCS (Stealth) and an Internal Weapons bay! BUT they Choose NOT TO DO SO! WHY? because they want to build a fighter with low titanium requirements just like the F-5 & the Q-313
It's not a matter of Can't! They can at the very least build a 5th Gen Airframe! The main problems is that they don't want to spend the money on a fighter that requires an expensive Airframe!

Titanium is one of the top 10 most abundant minerals in the world but what makes is so expensive is the process required in turning it into an alloy! Also, there are different grades of titanium & aluminum and the ones needed in Air Superiority fighters are extremely expensive

So it's not a matter of CAN'T it's that Iran doesn't WANT to build an expensive Airframe required in a 5th Generation Air Superiority fighter

I read your post. I didnt cleared out each and everything.

First off ... we will see. Since you are also guessing using visual cues.

Second off ... what about b2 bomber or f 35 do you think they compromised much maneuverability on f35 for stealth. Also why going for what US does. How will they fire a missile if they cant even spot you? During iran iraq war tell me how many iraqi fighters maneuvered your aim 54 missiles. What advantage you had? We see them before they see you. You lock on and shoot.

Did you just post the speed of bird of prey. Buddy, thats just a prototype. Iran is building like that full fledged fighter. Which speed will be higher, higher maneuverability, higher stealth. Bigger size. Same principles.

Your whole argument is around titanium. Tell me if iran cant proccess titanium... how the hell they are making owj engines. To make engine of that type it is necessary to have processed titanium. I sure hope iran is using titanium and carbon aloy on qaher 313.

You already make AESA radars. Bavar.
I am pretty sure all sensors you mentioned iran can do it.

Final point. It is a stealth aircraft. Main objective for this are the marine time targets. Syrian example you gave ... if US hit the very same missile on iran ... these ships just needed 3 cruise missiles to obliviate it. It is not a air superiority fighter. It is the first step towards it. You cant just make that type of craft in one night. But i am damn sure it is stealth and do the job wonderfully what it is assigned to do.

Please read my other post before commenting!

1st off I am 100% sure that it is a high subsonic fighter NOT a supersonic fighter! If that design breaks the sound barrier it will start shaking to a point that it will compromise the airframe! So I'm sure!

2ndly you don't know much about fighters if you think Maneuverability is not important if a missile is fired at you and you can't make steep high G turns then your dead! Why do you think US put Thrust Vectoring on it's F-22 that is the most advanced stealth fighter in it's arsenal and the stealthiest? On a fighter they have banned from exporting! Also, if what you said made any sense the U.S. wouldn't of retired the F-117 a decade ago!
The F-15 was produced a decade before the F-117 and is still being used today but the F-117 is not! So Your absolutely wrong!

And here is your bird of pray
Max speed 299 MPH
View attachment 391138


SO again YOUR WRONG!


Iran is capable of building the Airframe of a 5th Generation fighter if they were to invest in it that much is clear
BUT Iran is NOT capable of building

1.Turbofan Engines with Super Cruise Capability
2.Thrust Vectoring engines
3.AESA Radars
4.5th Gen Data links
5.5th Gen Sensors
6.Advanced long range IRST
7.Helmet Mounted Displays
8.5th Gen Weapons Systems with BVR capability
Etc, Etc,

The most expensive part of an Air Superiority Fighter is it's Air Frame! Why? Because the amount of titanium required to build it is greater than the weight of the actual Aircraft it's the same with F-15's, F-14's & F-22's

Iran is capable of building a 5th Generation Supersonic Airframe with Low RCS (Stealth) and an Internal Weapons bay! BUT they Choose NOT TO DO SO! WHY? because they want to build a fighter with low titanium requirements just like the F-5 & the Q-313
It's not a matter of Can't! They can at the very least build a 5th Gen Airframe! The main problems is that they don't want to spend the money on a fighter that requires an expensive Airframe!

Titanium is one of the top 10 most abundant minerals in the world but what makes is so expensive is the process required in turning it into an alloy! Also, there are different grades of titanium & aluminum and the ones needed in Air Superiority fighters are extremely expensive

So it's not a matter of CAN'T it's that Iran doesn't WANT to build an expensive Airframe required in a 5th Generation Air Superiority fighter

Please read my other post before commenting!

1st off I am 100% sure that it is a high subsonic fighter NOT a supersonic fighter! If that design breaks the sound barrier it will start shaking to a point that it will compromise the airframe! So I'm sure!

2ndly you don't know much about fighters if you think Maneuverability is not important if a missile is fired at you and you can't make steep high G turns then your dead! Why do you think US put Thrust Vectoring on it's F-22 that is the most advanced stealth fighter in it's arsenal and the stealthiest? On a fighter they have banned from exporting! Also, if what you said made any sense the U.S. wouldn't of retired the F-117 a decade ago!
The F-15 was produced a decade before the F-117 and is still being used today but the F-117 is not! So Your absolutely wrong!

And here is your bird of pray
Max speed 299 MPH
View attachment 391138


SO again YOUR WRONG!


Iran is capable of building the Airframe of a 5th Generation fighter if they were to invest in it that much is clear
BUT Iran is NOT capable of building

1.Turbofan Engines with Super Cruise Capability
2.Thrust Vectoring engines
3.AESA Radars
4.5th Gen Data links
5.5th Gen Sensors
6.Advanced long range IRST
7.Helmet Mounted Displays
8.5th Gen Weapons Systems with BVR capability
Etc, Etc,

The most expensive part of an Air Superiority Fighter is it's Air Frame! Why? Because the amount of titanium required to build it is greater than the weight of the actual Aircraft it's the same with F-15's, F-14's & F-22's

Iran is capable of building a 5th Generation Supersonic Airframe with Low RCS (Stealth) and an Internal Weapons bay! BUT they Choose NOT TO DO SO! WHY? because they want to build a fighter with low titanium requirements just like the F-5 & the Q-313
It's not a matter of Can't! They can at the very least build a 5th Gen Airframe! The main problems is that they don't want to spend the money on a fighter that requires an expensive Airframe!

Titanium is one of the top 10 most abundant minerals in the world but what makes is so expensive is the process required in turning it into an alloy! Also, there are different grades of titanium & aluminum and the ones needed in Air Superiority fighters are extremely expensive

So it's not a matter of CAN'T it's that Iran doesn't WANT to build an expensive Airframe required in a 5th Generation Air Superiority fighter

 

[eagle2007]

ALCON,

Concerning that size of the F-313, something to keep in mind:

If it really is 16 meters long, that would make it just a meter or so shorter than a MiG-29 and any comparison between these two birds will tell you right away that it is MUCH smaller. I'm personally confident it's shorter than a F-16 as well (~15 meters in length) because I've given one a walk around on several occasions.

Now, 16 meters of length may be how big it ends up being someday but IMHO there is no way that aircraft we've seen is anywhere near that size.

It's not as though this was the first time an Iranian news org was flat-out wrong on something (see the "50mm" sniper rifle thread for a recent example).

 

[Hack-Hook]

1st this is clearly a Subsonic fighter and if you wanna compare it to anything you'll need to compare it to the F-117 not the F-15 that is an Air Superiority fighter

well I don't see any different
let ask you a question if you plan for a mission to strike a target which one is preferable
1 - sneak under radar let say between 30-50m with a stealth airplane at for example 700km for 1000km
2 - fly with F-16, F-18, Mig-25, SU-24, Mig-29 at 13km of altitude with a speed of 850km for 1000km

the point is all of them are subsonic unless they want to use afterburner and have fuels for only 20min of flight.

This version is a great step forward for Iran's fighter program but this design will NEVER be a Supersonic fighter!

and what they stated as the mission for this airplane won't made it necessary to be supersonic

Optimal cruise Altitude for all aircrafts is practically the same and changing the wing design will not change that

and what that is? as far as I'm aware optimal cruise speed and altitude is a lot different between different airplanes.
for D=F-5 its something for SR-71 its something else and for U2 another thing .

This wing design will have negative effects on the aircrafts maneuverability at high speeds and maneuverability is one of your main weapons against incoming missiles

let me assure you no airplane is maneuverable enough to out maneuver modern Air to Air missiles as matter of fact no human can stay conscious after pulling the turn needed to out maneuver a modern missile.

This wing design may have had great success in wind tunnel testing for flight but when it comes to maneuverability it will not be so positive at higher speeds and this is something Iran will learn during the test flights but since this is clearly a subsonic aircraft it may not matter but at least Iran will learn that it can NOT use such a design for a supersonic Iranian fighter that they will one day build!

I assure you that there is no real need for actual flight to conclude that and the designers knew of it before hand and that's why they never advertised it as a fighter while they did such with Saeqe

 

[VEVAK]

I read your post. I didnt cleared out each and everything.

First off ... we will see. Since you are also guessing using visual cues.

Second off ... what about b2 bomber or f 35 do you think they compromised much maneuverability on f35 for stealth. Also why going for what US does. How will they fire a missile if they cant even spot you? During iran iraq war tell me how many iraqi fighters maneuvered your aim 54 missiles. What advantage you had? We see them before they see you. You lock on and shoot.

Did you just post the speed of bird of prey. Buddy, thats just a prototype. Iran is building like that full fledged fighter. Which speed will be higher, higher maneuverability, higher stealth. Bigger size. Same principles.

Your whole argument is around titanium. Tell me if iran cant proccess titanium... how the hell they are making owj engines. To make engine of that type it is necessary to have processed titanium. I sure hope iran is using titanium and carbon aloy on qaher 313.

You already make AESA radars. Bavar.
I am pretty sure all sensors you mentioned iran can do it.

Final point. It is a stealth aircraft. Main objective for this are the marine time targets. Syrian example you gave ... if US hit the very same missile on iran ... these ships just needed 3 cruise missiles to obliviate it. It is not a air superiority fighter. It is the first step towards it. You cant just make that type of craft in one night. But i am damn sure it is stealth and do the job wonderfully what it is assigned to do.

1st Is it a Stealth Aircraft? I don't know yet because this is a working prototype NOT a Production Model so in this configuration NO it is NOT because of it's cockpit! In this configuration it is a low RCS aircraft it's RCS is lower than F/A-18 & F-16 but greater than the F-35 & F-117 that much is clear!

As for the B-2 Bomber! B-2 Bombers are Bomber NOT FIGHTER'S and they will likely be escorted by and protected by F-22's! US will also use UAV's as decoys to confuse ground radars it's a well known tactic!

As for the Bird of Pray's speed it's Thrust to Weight ratio and design is what matter not it's size!
And in terms of design unlike the F-313 it has not v shaped stabilizers which means increased drag

Unless Iran redesigns the wings and canards that Aircraft will remain a Subsonic fighter! Which is fine! An F-16 is also incapable of going supersonic when armed with fuel tanks & Air to Ground weapons just like the Q-313
The advantage the Q-313 has is that it possess lower RCS with greater control at low altitude where as the F-16 can run away faster & possesses better Air to Air weapons!

To my knowledge Iran has not build AESA radar for it's current fleet of fighter jets and once we do we still need to develop a weapon system with weapons with BVR capability

As for Iraqi pilots in the Iran-Iraq war fact is if their aircrafts had better sensors that could detect the incoming missiles & if their pilots were properly trained they could have easily outmaneuvered Iranian AiM-54 missiles used by our F-14!
According to Iranian F-14 pilots every time they fired at them most of their pilots would take no counter measures either because they didn't detect the missiles or because they weren't properly trained to do so

All well trained pilots know that if you have an incoming missile you need to turn and deploy chaff and flairs or else your dead! THAT IS A FACT!

Iran has Titanium and is even increasing production of Titanium that is not the issue! I'm sure in the next year or two they will even export titanium! Again that is NOT the issue! It's cost of the Airframe that Iran is not willing to pay! They want a cheep Airframe design