Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[Cyberian]

why not? just think about 200+ stealth version of light wright low cost single engine jf-17s

Investment in stealth is not everyone's cup of tea - how many countries produce stealth fighter aircraft.

You might as well invest in drone technology if you want light-weight aircrafts.

 

[ziaulislam]

Not affordable too.

actually its cheaper than both rafale and typhoon

 

[Ultimate Weapon]

actually its cheaper than both rafale and typhoon

 

[GriffinsRule]

To give people an idea of the development times for 5th generation aircraft, a technically advanced country like Japan started its project for the X-2 demonstrator in 2009 and the assembly work only began in 2012 and the first flight did not happen until 2016. So that is 7 years for a first world country in its initial foray with new generation fighters (note that they have plenty of experience with building planes in house). Project AZM has just got its start and I doubt the 5yr timeline for a fresh design, unless that is what it exactly is ... a design. If they are talking about first flight, I would say 15yr mark seems very realistic.
Now, I think its better not to take the ambitious timeframe the air chief proclaimed, but look at the new AZM initiative to start building the technical knowledge, human resources and then finally industrial infrastructure needed for such a project. Right now as things stand, we can not even do the required R&D on JF-17 in terms of enhancements on the airframe etc. I remember some video on the the JF-17 project where the Chinese engineer being interviewed said the PAC was lacking all the updated machinery and equipment to produce the Thunder. We have now overcome that bit with the help of the Chinese but we still have a ways to go before we can be completely independent.
As most people here have pointed out, the most sensible route to take is to get on board with the Chinese and use their groundwork as a stepping stone in at least some form of coproduction for J-31. Rest assured that India will in the future get the F-35 and we need to maintain at least some sort of a qualitative balance given their modernization drive.

 

[undercover JIX]

To give people an idea of the development times for 5th generation aircraft, a technically advanced country like Japan started its project for the X-2 demonstrator in 2009 and the assembly work only began in 2012 and the first flight did not happen until 2016. So that is 7 years for a first world country in its initial foray with new generation fighters (note that they have plenty of experience with building planes in house). Project AZM has just got its start and I doubt the 5yr timeline for a fresh design, unless that is what it exactly is ... a design. If they are talking about first flight, I would say 15yr mark seems very realistic.
Now, I think its better not to take the ambitious timeframe the air chief proclaimed, but look at the new AZM initiative to start building the technical knowledge, human resources and then finally industrial infrastructure needed for such a project. Right now as things stand, we can not even do the required R&D on JF-17 in terms of enhancements on the airframe etc. I remember some video on the the JF-17 project where the Chinese engineer being interviewed said the PAC was lacking all the updated machinery and equipment to produce the Thunder. We have now overcome that bit with the help of the Chinese but we still have a ways to go before we can be completely independent.
As most people here have pointed out, the most sensible route to take is to get on board with the Chinese and use their groundwork as a stepping stone in at least some form of coproduction for J-31. Rest assured that India will in the future get the F-35 and we need to maintain at least some sort of a qualitative balance given their modernization drive.

agreed, but some members ignore the ground realities and become emotional.

 

[messiach]

Yes, i am aware of several visits.

An unknown delegation visited FC-31/J-31 production factory, during last Chinese Airshow. All I can say this. @messiach
Regards

 

[porris]

Imagination is more important than knowledge - Albert Einstein


Elhamdulillah!! That's the best thing about the Pak folks - they're always after something even if it's like putting one stone over another!!!! And, they won't just simply go home and die!!!!

Sir r u from Turky or from Pakistan

 

[Cookie Monster]

To give people an idea of the development times for 5th generation aircraft, a technically advanced country like Japan started its project for the X-2 demonstrator in 2009 and the assembly work only began in 2012 and the first flight did not happen until 2016. So that is 7 years for a first world country in its initial foray with new generation fighters (note that they have plenty of experience with building planes in house). Project AZM has just got its start and I doubt the 5yr timeline for a fresh design, unless that is what it exactly is ... a design. If they are talking about first flight, I would say 15yr mark seems very realistic.
Now, I think its better not to take the ambitious timeframe the air chief proclaimed, but look at the new AZM initiative to start building the technical knowledge, human resources and then finally industrial infrastructure needed for such a project. Right now as things stand, we can not even do the required R&D on JF-17 in terms of enhancements on the airframe etc. I remember some video on the the JF-17 project where the Chinese engineer being interviewed said the PAC was lacking all the updated machinery and equipment to produce the Thunder. We have now overcome that bit with the help of the Chinese but we still have a ways to go before we can be completely independent.
As most people here have pointed out, the most sensible route to take is to get on board with the Chinese and use their groundwork as a stepping stone in at least some form of coproduction for J-31. Rest assured that India will in the future get the F-35 and we need to maintain at least some sort of a qualitative balance given their modernization drive.

It is true that it would take Pak a long time if Pak were to do it alone...but assuming it to be a clean sheet design(and not J31), Pak would use China's help.

In my opinion the 5 year time is to come up with a design, which would include coming up with an initial design, testing in a wind tunnel, testing its RCS from various angles, making modifications as necessary and retesting, etc.

As for the engine, radar, and other avionics...most of those would be sourced by China and possibly Turkey. This is why Pak would be able to roughly meet the stated timeline bcuz Pak isn't trying to do all that work from scratch. Things like engine development or radar development alone are Herculean tasks. Instead a JF17 like approach would be taken and China/Pak would both collaborate on this, which would shorten the development time by a huge margin bcuz of China's experience with J20/J31.

 

[ARMalik]

Wasn't the same thing being said by people that it would take a 'very long' time for Pakistan to develop JF-17, and how Pakistanis were illiterate and had no technical base and would 'NEVER' pull this off, and bla, bla, bla? It never ceases to amaze me that the same logic is applied time and time again.

 

[GriffinsRule]

Pakistan didnt develop the JF-17. China did. Lets not make up facts on the go here.
We should be proud of our achievements and give credit where its due but when claiming things that are not factual, we just undermine those even more so.

 

[Awan68]

Pakistan didnt develop the JF-17. China did. Lets not make up facts on the go here.
We should be proud of our achievements and give credit where its due but when claiming things that are not factual, we just undermine those even more so.

You have no idea what ur talking about so it would serve you well to close ur uninformed trap.

 

[mzeeshanfahd]

@Dieno .... If I remember correctly there was this single engine design of a stealth against which you started a thread ..... I assume that may be the contender for project AZM ..... I am trying to find it but could not do so ....

 

[undercover JIX]

Pakistan didnt develop the JF-17. China did. Lets not make up facts on the go here.
We should be proud of our achievements and give credit where its due but when claiming things that are not factual, we just undermine those even more so.

Some what rue, but let us do not ignore the face that, Pakistan is closely and heavily involved is the all aspects of JF 17. we have the knowledge and people to carry on the projects of JF. what we lack currently is facilities and infrastructure to develop and carry on these projects on our own, because of financial constraints.

China is there to help and assist us in what we lake. we are trying and on the right track and we will reach to self reliance.

But there are some over ambitious members, who think we can do all by ourselves, that is just not logical.

 

[Mrc]

its going to be another JF 17 like project and shouldnot take long.... as only other country apart from USA to have a functioning stealth plane is already on board

 

[GriffinsRule]

That would be the most cost effective and risk averse approach.