Pakistan - Turkey (PAC-TAI) Collaboration for NGFA-TFX 5th Gen Aircraft l Updates, News & Discussion

[Basel]

Only Hurdle for PAF are engines

For TFX EJ-200 upgraded version with TVC EJ230 was offered by RR and it will be better option if Pakistan is joining the program.

 

[Muhammad Saftain Anjum]

others would.

AWC

 

[Basel]

This would make the most sense IMO. I think a strike-based TFX would come much later -- like mid-to-late 2030s -- but it would create more time for Turkey to develop its indigenous engine. Moreover, the PAF can probably keep closing capability gaps with additional J-10CEs and JF-17 B/Block-3-based variants (especially if the latter's slated to use a new engine).

PAF NGF development speed depends on IAF NGF program, of they fast track it then PAF will may also do the same.

 

[RadarGudumluMuhimmat]

I raised the same question in the previous thread before it was locked. But the members who are more aware have basically confirmed that the AZM platform has been canned in favor of TFX.

I'm still not sure, it's because Kotil broadcast live at TAI facilities via national channel 1 week ago and he didn't mention Pakistan while he was talking about TFX, only he said some Pakistani students and TAI engineering office that he opened in PAC supported it. had previously stated. Kotil may have said Turkish - Pakistani fighter to look cute because they support each other.

 

[Bilal.]

So if NUST is going to be the design centre for work outsourced to Pakistan then what would Air University and the rest of aviation city supposed to do. Will they be canned too…

 

[Trango Towers]

PAF NGF development speed depends on IAF NGF program, of they fast track it then PAF will may also do the same.

I think we need to forget India. With jf17 under the belt and now a solid 5th gen program. Indians are way behind.

 

[Bilal.]

I'm still not sure, it's because Kotil broadcast live at TAI facilities via national channel 1 week ago and he didn't mention Pakistan while he was talking about TFX, only he said some Pakistani students and TAI engineering office that he opened in PAC supported it. had previously stated. Kotil may have said Turkish - Pakistani fighter to look cute because they support each other.

The thing is. You are probably right that he made it sound cute because as advance stage as TFX already is in. PAC or NUST work seems more of an offset type arrangement rather than a full blown joint development.

 

[JamD]

I'm still not sure, it's because Kotil broadcast live at TAI facilities via national channel 1 week ago and he didn't mention Pakistan while he was talking about TFX, only he said some Pakistani students and TAI engineering office that he opened in PAC supported it. had previously stated. Kotil may have said Turkish - Pakistani fighter to look cute because they support each other.

I think that's basically what has happened. Yes there is a small Pakistani technical team in Ankara. According to this interview it certainly sounds like TAI wants to offload some manufacturing and maybe some low-level design work to Pakistan. But TFX is definitely not a "Turkish-Pakistani fighter". I think he was just playing to the gallery.

So if NUST is going to be the design centre for work outsourced to Pakistan then what would Air University and the rest of aviation city supposed to do. Will they be canned too…

On one hand, planning isn't Pakistan's strength. I think Air University was being built up to support a local Azm FGFA.

On the other hand, it only takes some paperwork to start calling the buildings next to PAC, NUST PAC Campus instead of Air University Aviation City Campus. Dr.Riaz is PAF afterall. I wouldn't worry too much about names. I don't think they'll be building manufacturing infrastructure in H12. That may be reserved for Kamra. On the other OTHER hand, we had a member tell us of all the land acquistion problems with Kamra Aviation City - which is why there has been so little civil works on the ground in Kamra.

EDIT: I know that a few posts ago I said that there's a lot of infrastructure near Kamra already and here I am saying there is little. My point was that three rather large buildings have been constructed near Kamra. This shows serious commitment. This also shows that so many other buildings that should've been built (according to Air University Aviation City Campus Model) have not been built.

 

[deep_blue]

1.Is PAF trying to achive commonality of fleet/ weapons/ avionics with friendly nations i.e China, Turkey?
2. Is Pakistan Trying to bring together China and Turkey in technical areas?
3. Can we expect flow of Turkish tech into JF17 current or future block(if any)?

 

[Bilal.]

I think that's basically what has happened. Yes there is a small Pakistani technical team in Ankara. According to this interview it certainly sounds like TAI wants to offload some manufacturing and maybe some low-level design work to Pakistan. But TFX is definitely not a "Turkish-Pakistani fighter". I think he was just playing to the gallery.



On one hand, planning isn't Pakistan's strength. I think Air University was being built up to support a local Azm FGFA.

On the other hand, it only takes some paperwork to start calling the buildings next to PAC, NUST PAC Campus instead of Air University Aviation City Campus. Dr.Riaz is PAF afterall. I wouldn't worry too much about names. I don't think they'll be building manufacturing infrastructure in H12. That may be reserved for Kamra. On the other OTHER hand, we had a member tell us of all the land acquistion problems with Kamra Aviation City - which is why there has been so little civil works on the ground in Kamra.

You know what just ticked me off. Did a bit of search just now on Aviation City and found adverts for Fazaiya Housing at the same location. Resources well utilized? I mean are you kidding me!

Fazaia Housing Scheme Aviation City Kamra

 

[JamD]

You know what just ticked me off. Did a bit of search just now on Aviation City and found adverts for Fazaiya Housing at the same location. Resources well utilized? We mean are you kidding me!

Fazaia Housing Scheme Aviation City Kamra

Hahahaha there's nothing more inevtiable than a DHA or Fazaia Society.

They're even using pictures of the Air University Campus. Wow. I shouldn't be surprised.

 

[Amaa'n]

I raised the same question in the previous thread before it was locked. But the members who are more aware have basically confirmed that the AZM platform has been canned in favor of TFX.

Buildings location tells us something else , I would say , even if PAC doesn't use them others would.

I'm still not sure, it's because Kotil broadcast live at TAI facilities via national channel 1 week ago and he didn't mention Pakistan while he was talking about TFX, only he said some Pakistani students and TAI engineering office that he opened in PAC supported it. had previously stated. Kotil may have said Turkish - Pakistani fighter to look cute because they support each other.

So if NUST is going to be the design centre for work outsourced to Pakistan then what would Air University and the rest of aviation city supposed to do. Will they be canned too…

This is what i do not appreciate about Twitter and social media because unnecessary hype is created and when the balloon bursts, it is nothing but air....

Renowned universities are working on different areas. just to highlight few:

• ****************************************************************jects.....

Try speaking to Graduate & PhD level candidates at these unis

https://www.au.edu.pk/Pages/Faculties/IAA/Departments/Avionics/avi_R_and_D.aspx

 

[Bilal.]

This is what i do not appreciate about Twitter and social media because unnecessary hype is created and when the balloon bursts, it is nothing but air....

Renowned universities are working on different areas. just to highlight few:

• ********************

Try speaking to Graduate & PhD level candidates at these unis

My point was actually in positive sense. That they will end up building capabilities unless canned which most likely will not happen.

We need to develop the ecosystem. If not now then eventually it will enable us to undertake complex projects largely in-house. What TAI is today, we will be there in due time.

Hahahaha there's nothing more inevtiable than a DHA or Fazaia Society.

They're even using pictures of the Air University Campus. Wow. I shouldn't be surprised.

Being marketed as education facility for the local residents not the cutting edge institution that will undertake research and development for our key aviation programs.

 

[The SC]

The Pakistan Aviation Complex has signed a deal with the Turkish aviation industry in the T-FX fifth generation combat aircraft program with Pakistan becoming an official partner.

The T-FX will now be redesigned and modified by PAC and integrated with Project Azm's NGFA program to meet the common requirements of the air forces of both countries through a single platform.

Aircraft development will be divided between Pakistan and Turkey.. TAI and PAC's expertise will be pooled together for joint development, which will lower project costs, increase feasibility, increase combat capabilities, and shorten timelines.

The final manufacturing of the TF-X/JF-XX will take place in both countries.

News of Pakistan joining TAI's fighter program was confirmed by the CEO of Turkish Aerospace to Pakistani media this week, saying that the TF-X is now a "Turkish-Pakistani fighter" program.

The CEO of TAI also said that TAI will move some of its operations to Pakistan by the end of this year.

TF-X / TPF-XX / JF-XX is a joint program for the development of a multi-mission fifth-generation combat aircraft between Turkey and Pakistan,

 

[Zarf]

Just for my knowledge, I want to ask why Pakistan choose turkey for its 5th Generation Fighter and not let's say China?