Turkiye's Minister of National Defense Guler: Agreement with Pakistan for KAAN is about to be signed

[SaadH]

I don't think there's much to do in this scenario, you just have to rely on your existing air defence network - and then retaliate in the same way, barrage of missiles in response

Future Indian ABM system will blunt the missile barrage.

 

[TheSolution]

Future Indian ABM system will blunt the missile barrage.

It's a cat and mouse game, the missiles are constantly being improved and the air defence sophistication/integration is too.

The issue is whether Pakistan can keep up with it at an effective manner. Quality matters but corruption paired with nepotism is the opposite of quality.

 

[dBSPL]

In 2028, 20 KAAN Block-10 will be delivered to the Turkish Air Force. Starting from 2029, the standard production phase will be started with 2 units per month. In the range of 2036-37, the total production is expected to be exceeded over 200.

It would not surprise me if the Pakistan Air Force acquires 4/5 KAANs by 2029-30 for testing, infrastructure and training activities.

 

[TheSolution]

What agreement is this referring to? Is this the recent KAAN agreement?

 

[Falcon34]

Restoring balance of power with ten times larger neighbour is fool hardy. The neighbour is on its way up and Pakistan is moving in the opposite direction. It has lead to almost bankruptcy this year for Pakistan which the IMF saved. It will go further into bankruptcy again in a year or two and that is all because of its effort to restore the balance of power. It suits India fine.

Nikal BDSK, Did anyone ask for ur opinion **** head pajeet!!

 

[Falcon34]

What agreement is this referring to? Is this the recent KAAN agreement?

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Well it seems so the agreement has been signed, The paf has kept it quiet not to alarm the pajeets.
I have watch the video myself it clearly states " in military to military cooperation with Turkiye especially in the field of Defence production, two way sharing of technology and joint development of Fift gen aircraft.

 

[hembo]

They can for sure - only variable is stealth shaping - they have everything else they need via the Tejas Programme and GE engines made under license in India now. Dont underestimate them on this front now.

There are many other aspect of a 5th gen jets in addition to stealth shape, vis-à-vis 4th gen fighters. High maneuverability, including short-field capabilities, supercruise, advanced avionics, low-probability-of-intercept radar (LPIR), networked data fusion for situation awareness, multirole capabilities etc. I don't know much about what's happening with AMCA program, but I know one thing for sure, it will not be a cake walk just because of the success with the LCA. Neither will it be for the Turkish program, just because of a stealth shaped prototype.​

 

[Dalit]

Turkey views Pakistan as dead weight it is having to carry around. Let's face it, Pakistan has no economy. It doesn't even have democratically elected leadership. There is no vision nor money. Certain Kemalists are even opposed to Pakistani participation in the project. Pakistan might pass on the details to China...

 

[Dalit]

Nothing of value much since Turkey is far ahead compared to Pakistan in this regard. However Pakistan could've contributed money(as a partner) initially when the project started, which would've reduced some of the financial risks for Turkey. In return of sharing the financial risks...Pakistan could've benefitted from some limited work share and tech transfer.
...but as per other members here Pakistan squandered that opportunity by trying their own separate project Azm NGF(which went nowhere) rather than joining the Turks as a joint venture.

...still it's better late than never I guess...and more sales for Turkey.

Let me assure you. All friendly countries have lately shown Pakistan a mirror. Pakistan and the generals are living in a bubble. The truth is that Pakistan has very little on offer even tech wise. As you correctly claim, Turkey is much ahead tech wise. Pakistan should count itself lucky if it is able to acquire a decent 5th gen platform. These won't be cheap either. Especially with the economy in doldrums.

 

[TheSolution]

Turkey views Pakistan as dead weight it is having to carry around. Let's face it, Pakistan has no economy. It doesn't even have democratically elected leadership. There is no vision nor money. Certain Kemalists are even opposed to Pakistani participation in the project. Pakistan might pass on the details to China...

Pakistan can place a large order for a significant amount of units compared to most other partners like say Azerbaijan. This will drive the costs down overall and make it more affordable.

And yes, I think pretty much everyone can see how poorly run Pakistan is, and how difficult it is to co-operate efficiently with Pakistan because of incompetence.

But I think Turkey is also looking at this long-term, beyond just the KAAN project currently, to build a long-term defence partner. TAI and Baykar have opened their offices too. I hope they are giving criticism to those in charge where its due, it's the only way we can improve.

 

[indushek]

There are many other aspect of a 5th gen jets in addition to stealth shape, vis-à-vis 4th gen fighters. High maneuverability, including short-field capabilities, supercruise, advanced avionics, low-probability-of-intercept radar (LPIR), networked data fusion for situation awareness, multirole capabilities etc. I don't know much about what's happening with AMCA program, but I know one thing for sure, it will not be a cake walk just because of the success with the LCA. Neither will it be for the Turkish program, just because of a stealth shaped prototype.​

AMCA is awaiting fund release from CCS, to start prototype building. Paper submission done in Mar'22.

Its understood that GOI wants to go with a SPV model for AMCA manufacturing, but there is lukewarm response from Private sector. The SPV model means, tech transfer from ADA to the private manufacturer (like Reliance/TATA/Mahindra etc) , and use of HAL facilities. Not much profits can be made, and they won't be able to get much tech as well perhaps given how these PSU work.

GOI has to at least move their butts

AMCA Mk1 won't have supercruise by the way, given that it will be powered by F414. Mk2 will get it, but that's dependent on finalizing the partner for joint manufacturing of a planned 120KN new engine. For this Safran/RR and GE are in contention, and there has been talk of MOU with Safran in recent Modi's visit to France on their Bastille day. DRDO and Safran are supposed to iron out work share, by this December if this has to start soon.

 

[ghazi52]

.,.,

 

[Shabi1]

I don’t think it would be cleared for export for some time. The PAF would have to produce a fighter equipped with the WS-15 first, I’d assume, and it doesn’t look like the idea of a WS-15 equipped J-10 is gaining any traction, regardless of how many times it has been suggested, by myself and others.

Even a 170 kn export version of WS-15 on a follow up single engine stealth fighter derivative of the the J-10 (similar to the SAAB FS-2020 design) has been called a waste, apparently because China is moving on to 6 th generation jets and drone swarms to match the U.S. NGAD programs.

When we see why is required to designate an aircraft a 6th Gen fighter, I will try to come back to the design of the SAAB FS2020 and see if I can still advocate for a similar/updated design is still a viable replacement of the JF-17; the backbone fighter of the PAF, in manned and unmanned variants.

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A problem being encountered on the F-35 and expected to be on other 5-6gen fighters is the amount of power required to run the numerous electronics systems as well as future energy weapons/counter measure systems. For this reason I think next gen platforms should be ideally multi engine as amount of available electrical power now just as important as thrust.

 

[TheSolution]

 

[Trango Towers]

What does Pakistan bring to the table that Turkey already doesn't have ?

I am surprised young boys jumping up and down ... for what ?

Ahhhhhh same as what did the partners of f35 bring that USA didn't have...?? You question is invalid