Pakistan draws redlines for joining Saudi alliance

[DJ_Viper]

While it's true that the goals aren't clear, there may still be hope for this alliance not becoming an anti-Iranian defence organisation as a few of Iran's allies or countries that are on good terms with them are also part of the alliance such as Oman, Indonesia and Lebanon. Also, with Raheel Sharif heading the alliance, it is very unlikely that any direct actions against Iran will be taken. On the other hand, it is likely that the IMA will combat Iranian-sponsored proxies in countries like Yemen and Syria but if Iran has any objections to that, that's on them.

Well, Raheel Shariff's been out for over a week now, right after Trump's visit to KSA, he turned his two weeks notice. KSA's main target is Iran and Iranian backed groups. Pakistan wants to keep herself out the mess to not start something from Iran into Baluchistan through Indian support like before. Iran has given Pakistan solid commitment on it, the result of which was the capture of the agent spy agent. So it makes sense from the Pakistani side.

Plus, if you are a nuke country, and you finally have a golden opportunity to be on of the top 15-20 highest GDP nations, why won't you get stronger economically? And that would mean not getting into any conflict. Very smart move. It seems like people making the decisions are doing it for the right purposes this time.

 

[wiseone2]

A balanced approach is the right approach. We have no beef with either the Saudis or Iran. Having said that the balanced approach faction will increasingly become weaker the stronger Indian-Iranian ties become. Already Chahbahar is seen with a lot of suspicion (especially post the Yadav case). Even if the Iranians have no intent in working against Pakistan, they have indirectly granted India a legitimiate presence next to one of Pakistan's most volatile regions. If Indian presence in this region continues to grow I'm afraid sooner or later the pro-Saudi faction will gain enough sympathy domestically to move ahead with this alliance, which is a shame because purely demographically speaking, Pakistanis are the only people in the wider region who have a positive view of Iran.

Does it even matter that pakistanis view Iran positively ?

Unlike Iran which has a lot of hydrocarbons Pakistani elite has made a living off Afghanistan
In the 1980s they skimmed money off the anti-Soviet war effort. After 9/11 they made money for being so-called ally against Taliban.

If Iran provided alternate access to Afghanistan their value drops significantly
Hence that explains their nervousness over Chahbahar.

 

[The Accountant]

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan has decided to draw certain ‘redlines’ for becoming part of the Saudi-led Islamic Military Alliance against Terrorism (IMAT) in an effort to avoid the negative fallout of its participation in the initiative that has potential to undermine ties with neighbouring Iran.

It was thought that the government had already joined the alliance when in April it granted permission to former army chief General (retd) Raheel Sharif to lead the 41-nation counter-terrorism alliance.

Officials, however, clarified that the final decision had not yet been taken.

What compelled Pakistan to have a second thought was the recent Arab Islamic-US summit in Riyadh where statements from Saudi authorities suggested that the alliance was meant to counter Iran as well as fighting terrorism.

The government in principle agreed to be part of the Saudi initiative if its sole purpose was to fight terrorism and extremism, officials insisted. The final decision, however, will be taken once the terms of reference (ToRs) of the alliance are finalised, officials added.

The ToRs would be finalised during the meeting of defence ministers of the participating countries.

A senior official familiar with the development told The Express Tribune that Pakistan would present its set of proposals during the defence ministers meeting scheduled to be held in Saudi Arabia in coming weeks.

Pakistan, according to the official, would recommend that the alliance should have clear objective that is to fight terrorism. Any deviation from this goal will not only undermine the alliance but also lead to more divisions in the Muslim world.

“We are very clear that we will join this alliance only to fight terrorism,” the official emphasised, adding that the government would stick to its stance.

Foreign office spokesperson Nafees Zakria also indicated that Pakistan had yet to take a final decision on the Saudi alliance.

“What we need to understand is that the Terms of Reference (TORs) of the alliance are yet to be finalised. The defence ministers of the participating countries will meet and discuss the modalities of the coalition. We must wait until we have all the information to comment on its outcome. We shouldn’t indulge in speculations,” Zakria clarified at the last weekly briefing.

The government already gave a public commitment that it would not become part of any initiative whose aim is to target any other Islamic country, including Iran.

Defence Minister Khawaja Asif on the floor of National Assembly assured that Pakistan would withdraw if the Saudi alliance turns out to be sectarian in nature.

Even Gen (Retd) Raheel before accepting the foreign job reportedly told Saudis that he would lead the grouping only if its main purpose was to fight terrorism and not aimed at any other Islamic country.

In order to avoid any strain with Iran, Pakistan pushed for mediation between Tehran and Riyadh. Islamabad even mooted the idea of inclusion of Iran in the alliance.

However, all those efforts could not succeed since Saudi Arabia and Iran have serious differences on regional disputes particularly the current hotspots in Middle East.

Main opposition parties—Tehreek-e-Insaf and Pakistan Peoples Party—have been calling for maintaining ‘neutrality’ in Arab-Iran rivalry.

But given longstanding strategic relationship with Saudi Arabia, Pakistan is unlikely to completely withdraw from the alliance. Nevertheless, its participation would only remain confined to counter-terrorism efforts, officials stressed.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1421638/pakistan-draws-redlines-joining-saudi-alliance/

Good decision...

 

[SabzShaheen]

Well, Raheel Shariff's been out for over a week now, right after Trump's visit to KSA, he turned his two weeks notice. KSA's main target is Iran and Iranian backed groups. Pakistan wants to keep herself out the mess to not start something from Iran into Baluchistan through Indian support like before. Iran has given Pakistan solid commitment on it, the result of which was the capture of the agent spy agent. So it makes sense from the Pakistani side.

Plus, if you are a nuke country, and you finally have a golden opportunity to be on of the top 15-20 highest GDP nations, why won't you get stronger economically? And that would mean not getting into any conflict. Very smart move. It seems like people making the decisions are doing it for the right purposes this time.

The problem is that this moves runs the risk of aggravating Pakistan's Arab allies, especially the ones that Pakistan significantly relies on like Saudi Arabia and the UAE (and we know how easily the UAE gets annoyed when Pakistan doesn't send its soldiers to die for their political games). I see what you mean by the move making economic sense as it means that there is less chance of Iran helping India destabilise Balochistan which of course would make CPEC very difficult to make a reality; however, the expenses may include isolation of Pakistani expatriates in GCC countries as well as unofficial pressure on Pakistani companies in those countries as well.

I know these ideas sounds quite extreme but both the Arabs and the Iranians have a great deal of enmity for each other so for Pakistan to take measures like this in order to tread along the middle ground will likely lead to a great deal of backlash from whichever side Pakistan says no to.

 

[Cthulhu]

The worry on the Pakistani side is that India will use investments in Chabahar as a cover from which its agents will penetrate through the porous Iran-Pakistan border into our side of Balochistan. Already we have captured one of their spies (https://tribune.com.pk/story/1072455/terror-purge-forces-nab-indian-spy-in-balochistan/), who claims to have been a simple businessman working in Chabahar.

The suspicion stems from India's usage of Afghan consulates close to the Pakistani border as bases from which their secret service agency RAW operates. One US intelligence officer speaking in anonymity in Afghanistan had this to say about Indian activity in the country

"While the U.S. media has frequently reported on Pakistani ties to jihadi elements launching attacks in Afghanistan, it has less often mentioned that India supports insurgent forces attacking Pakistan, the former intelligence official said. "The Indians are up to their necks in supporting the Taliban against the Pakistani government in Afghanistan and Pakistan," the former intelligence official who served in both countries said."
http://foreignpolicy.com/2009/02/16/can-the-intel-community-defuse-india-pakistan-tensions/

Chuck Hagel too in a video from a couple of years back is heard saying "India has over the years financed problems for Pakistan on that side of the border, and you can carry that into many dimensions.”
https://www.dawn.com/news/788984/india-finances-trouble-in-pakistan-hagel

The worry in Pakistan is hence that India will simply use the Sistan-Balochistan front to widen its terror campaign inside Pakistan, through legitimate "consulates" and "investments". Whilst I can appreciate that Iran is simply building a port which is open to all investors whether they be Chinese or Indian, you have to take into account that we are in a quasi state of war with India, and a heavy Indian presence that close to the border with Pakistan will probably be seen by the average Pakistani as Iran indirectly facilitating Indian activities in the region. Of course if Iran clamps down hard and makes it clear to India that such a purpose for Indian investments in the Sistan-Baluchistan region is not acceptable then Pakistanis will be fine with it, but the Kulbushan Yadav episode has gotten everyone worried. If such events reoccur then public opinion might push Pakistan increasingly towards the Saudi alliance, which individuals like myself are strongly against. As said I am for balancing our act in the Mideast, just like you guys aim in South Asia.

I understand your concerns, As for our ports, I can assure you they will not be used against you militarily no matter what cause our constitution doesn't allow it.
The Constitution of Islamic Republic of Iran
Chapter IX [Article 113 to 151]: The Executive Power
Article 146 [No Foreign Military Bases]

"...[F]oreign military bases in Iran, even for peaceful purposes, is forbidden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_Islamic_Republic_of_Iran
That leaves India's secret service agency as the only force that may use that port as a cover and operate against you, and if your government has any evidence that they are doing this, They should give them to our government during a diplomatic trip or something, and we will take care of it. And as the Indian guys saying in the video that i've posted, If they don't invest in Chabahar port, The Chinese are going to fill their place, so it's not like that we don't have any options other than Indians, so we can kick them out if we want to.

 

[Eagle_storm]

When will Pakistan ask Iran about RAW wings operating from Iranian soil against Pakistan ?
Furthermore about the Iranian themselves recruiting Pakistani terrorist ?

What kind of balancing is Pakistan looking for ?

By making happy iranian we are repeating the same mistake.
First they should stop their terror influence in yemen.

No one should forget that the iranian are those who start to drop the pillars of islamic empire.
Who martyred Hazrat Umar R.A??

After that USMAN R.A.

Won't this a counter revolutionary movements by iranian khawarijeen.

We know about the KSA laziness but remember
You will have to answer for this land.

We don't want anything with iran but they should away from saudi.
They also support raw agents.
Will anybody tell me from where the hell this kulbushin shit came from.
Wasn't he operating in iran???

It has also came to know that isis was supported by iranian too in a secret deal with obama administration but now they are refuting from this due to Russian and china declaration of isis as a terrorist to the asian region as well as for the middle east region.

we didn't fight in Yemen for the lazy arabs amd we shouldn't fight against Iran either.
for Pakistan both Iran and the Saudis are just as bad as each other. let them kill each other and make uncle sam money and Israel happy.

Do you Remember me ????
Yesterday your quotes was declaring me as a non muslim???? Hmmm

Why would we let khawarij to attack every where.
Saudi don't belong to arab only it belongs to the whole muslim ummah.
Better you should stop this poisonous changing on pdf.
Pakistan isn't created for only to serve in the fixed ratio.
Allah almighty put the responsibility on those who are able of responsibility.

Go get and read khilafit Rashida era.

I honestly smell you some kinda of threat to the Muslims.

 

[Safriz]

Iran is openly supporting India despite Pakistan's favours for them . We gave them nuclear technology, all their centrifuges' are Pakistani design.

Pakistan should openly support Saudia and forget about Iran as they won't have good relations with any country where Sunni are majority.

 

[Kaniska]

I understand your concerns, As for our ports, I can assure you they will not be used against you militarily no matter what cause our constitution doesn't allow it.
The Constitution of Islamic Republic of Iran
Chapter IX [Article 113 to 151]: The Executive Power
Article 146 [No Foreign Military Bases]

"...[F]oreign military bases in Iran, even for peaceful purposes, is forbidden."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_Islamic_Republic_of_Iran
That leaves India's secret service agency as the only force that may use that port as a cover and operate against you, and if your government has any evidence that they are doing this, They should give them to our government during a diplomatic trip or something, and we will take care of it. And as the Indian guys saying in the video that i've posted, If they don't invest in Chabahar port, The Chinese are going to fill their place, so it's not like that we don't have any options other than Indians, so we can kick them out if we want to.

Wow...nice to see some intellectual words to kick us out if you want to...Of course your country and your rule...But these words does not sound friendlier to me..

 

[Cthulhu]

Wow...nice to see some intellectual words to kick us out if you want to...Of course your country and your rule...But these words does not sound friendlier to me..

Look, I don't want to offend anyone here, firstly what i've wrote has a big "If" before it. Here, look again.

That leaves India's secret service agency as the only force that may use that port as a cover and operate against you, and if your government has any evidence that they are doing this, They should give them to our government during a diplomatic trip or something, and we will take care of it. And as the Indian guys saying in the video that i've posted, If they don't invest in Chabahar port, The Chinese are going to fill their place, so it's not like that we don't have any options other than Indians, so we can kick them out if we want to.

It is a conditional sentence, meaning that if your secret service agency is using our port as a cover to operate against Pakistan and make trouble for us, we're gonna have to ask you out.
Secondly, if what I've wrote has offended you, i apologize, i should have used the term "nicely ask them out".

 

[Finer]

Pakistan has been maintaining diplomatic stance for a while. The problem still persists because of Iran and KSA, not of Pakistan. Both Iran and KSA are arrogant and egocentric putting the entire Middle East in danger without any remorse for the dire consequence suggests there is no way they would ever get past the sectarian mindset.

Unfortunately, Pakistan is in the position whether to maintain diplomatic stance [KSA no happy], pro KSA-stance [Iran no happy] or isolate them [Pakistani Sunnis-Shias no happy]. It is messed up.

 

[M. Sarmad]

A balanced approach by Pakistan, hopefully this news is true.

This quote has been attributed to Imam Ali A.S:

“If you are against a group of ‪Muslims and the kuffar (unbelievers) are against them too, then know that you have aligned yourself with the kuffar against your own brothers. And know that if that is the case, then there is definitely something wrong with your view. If you want to know where the most righteous of Muslims are then look to where the arrows of the kuffar are pointing.”

Is it authentic ?

 

[Trango Towers]

By making happy iranian we are repeating the same mistake.
First they should stop their terror influence in yemen.

No one should forget that the iranian are those who start to drop the pillars of islamic empire.
Who martyred Hazrat Umar R.A??

After that USMAN R.A.

Won't this a counter revolutionary movements by iranian khawarijeen.

We know about the KSA laziness but remember
You will have to answer for this land.

We don't want anything with iran but they should away from saudi.
They also support raw agents.
Will anybody tell me from where the hell this kulbushin shit came from.
Wasn't he operating in iran???

It has also came to know that isis was supported by iranian too in a secret deal with obama administration but now they are refuting from this due to Russian and china declaration of isis as a terrorist to the asian region as well as for the middle east region.




Do you Remember me ????
Yesterday your quotes was declaring me as a non muslim???? Hmmm

Why would we let khawarij to attack every where.
Saudi don't belong to arab only it belongs to the whole muslim ummah.
Better you should stop this poisonous changing on pdf.
Pakistan isn't created for only to serve in the fixed ratio.
Allah almighty put the responsibility on those who are able of responsibility.

Go get and read khilafit Rashida era.

I honestly smell you some kinda of threat to the Muslims.

yesterday I told you I didn't call you a non muslim..even showing you exactly what I wrote ...now I am calling you a liar and asking you show me where I have called you a non muslim. either PUT UP OR SHUT UP. LIAR LIAR LIAR

CALLING YOURSELF A QAZI ....... do you even know what that is? if you do then behave as such....

big talk about khilafat before you get there show me where I have specifically called you a non muslim. if there word non muslim isn't there then I expect you to admit that you are a liar

 

[Big Tank]

This alliance is doomed to fail. The goals of this alliance aren't clear and eventually, it would become a Saudi sponsored insurance policy against Iran. Iran is a huge issue within itself and to the globe. But Pakistan here is making a smart decision.
With her growing economy and a nuke power status, she should just focused on economic growth and getting internally strong, plus adding more military muscle. Getting into any conflict will only weaken that goal. Pakistan is well on her way towards being one of the top 20 and then top 15 economies in the next few years. Leaving many Arab nations way behind in prosperity. That goal needs to be achieved no matter what. With a hostile India and a hostile Afghanistan, you couldn't achieve that goal with a hostile Iran on the third side. So a smart move.



Common man, you read good posts and then you read crap like the above. Is it really true? If someone was "such" a slave, half of your army would be serving in KSA today fighting Yemen. Why do people ruin a factual argument based on personal bias?

That's because its the Army which kept safe distance between slavery and good relative.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

so? thats a good thing,iran can never be trusted and never was our friend and never will be.

It was also the first country to recognise Pak and help Pak in wars against India.

The relation turned bad after the irani revolution and Pak joining pacts like seato and cento.

 

[Khanate]

Erdogan didn't attend Riyadh Summit, he sent his Foreign Minister. So why did Nawaz Sharif attend Riyadh Summit? What were his objectives and achievements for the summit?