Pakistan buys 13 F16 from Jordan

[krash]

So block 40's will have kill ratio of 2 and MKI's will be sitting ducks? Quite funny.

Ground offensive are well supported by air dominant MKI's and bisons. They are well kept away from your ADF fight envelope. To counter the close proximity and get BVR more effective MKI's are based a bit interior. Lesser potent fighters are not gonna exposed to your supposed AMRAAM's before you are fired upon by MKI's or you get rid of them(unlikely).

Everything aside, "supposed AMRAAMs"?

develop 150 jf17 in one night.... is PAF also acquiring Skynet from Cyberdyne Systems? if yes, we should be looking john connor right away!

Are we going to bicker on typos now?

 

[PoKeMon]

Everything aside, "supposed AMRAAMs"?

Yes, the supposed AMRAAM who are supposed to take down jaguar(the ground attack) fighter even when escorted by MKI and that too miles ahead.

Are we going to bicker on typos now?

How can that be a typo. At best boasting of level superman.

And why are you picking up small words in other's post? Whats your point?

 

[krash]

Yes, the supposed AMRAAM who are supposed to take down jaguar(the ground attack) fighter even when escorted by MKI and that too miles ahead.

Okay....so you don't know how to use the word, I can live by that. Your sentence otherwise meant something completely different i.e. "there are no AMRAAMs in PAF's inventory. Nvm, carry on.

How can that be a typo. At best boasting of level superman.

And why are you picking up small words in other's post? Whats your point?

If you had read the whole sentence once, then again, then maybe again if the need be, I'm pretty sure you would have goten it yourself.

 

[PoKeMon]

Okay....so you don't know how to use the word, I can live by that. Your sentence otherwise meant something completely different i.e. "there are no AMRAAMs in PAF's inventory. Nvm, carry on.
If you had read the whole sentence once, then again, then maybe again if the need be, I'm pretty sure you would have goten it yourself.

So Mr professor, why cant I call such AMRAAM to be supposed one which can take on jaguar flying atleast 15 miles behind MKI and MKI not taking a shot? Such AMRAAM must have range greater than 150 km and such AMRAAM can only be termed as "supposed". They dont exist.

Use of word.

Now please excuse me, you will get away with your "english classes" but me less important will get the hammer.

 

[trident2010]

So when will PAF take the first delivery?

 

[MilSpec]

Everything aside, "supposed AMRAAMs"?



Are we going to bicker on typos now?

what was the typo? one night,150 , or Jf17's?

 

[krash]

what was the typo? one night,150 , or Jf17's?

"We bought them coz we have extensive exp on F-16 compare to JF-17. Plus we can't develop 150 JF-17 in 1 night so we have to buy something that fits our bill and equally fits our requirements." Makes better sense no? Especially when considering what he was answering to?

 

[MilSpec]

"We bought them coz we have extensive exp on F-16 compare to JF-17. Plus we can't develop 150 JF-17 in 1 night so we have to buy something that fits our bill and equally fits our requirements." Makes better sense no? Especially when considering what he was answering to?

relax... have some sense of humor!

 

[PhoneyMember]

These 13 F-16 Block 15 ADF's are MLU'ed according to



I wonder how much capable they are: Block 25, 32 or 42... and do they use P&W F100-220E engine ??

@Oscar @Armstrong @Devil Soul @fatman17 @Aeronaut

Good if these are MLU but SIPRI suggests otherwise.
PAC Kamra can upgrade older engines to f-100-220e specs,so that shouldn't be a problem.

 

[PhoneyMember]

develop 150 jf17 in one night.... is PAF also acquiring Skynet from Cyberdyne Systems? if yes, we should be looking john connor right away!

skynet or not. but PAF has networked all ground based radars and AEW&C into one giant network.This work has been going on since 1977.PAF jets can get info from the network for detecting and tracking enemy aircrafts.That pretty much nullifies MKI advantage for better Radar than PAF planes

 

[MilSpec]

skynet or not. but PAF has networked all ground based radars and AEW&C into one giant network.This work has been going on since 1977.PAF jets can get info from the network for detecting and tracking enemy aircrafts.That pretty much nullifies MKI advantage for better Radar than PAF planes

ok

 

[Viper0011.]

So block 40's will have kill ratio of 2 and MKI's will be sitting ducks? Quite funny.
Ground offensive are well supported by air dominant MKI's and bisons. They are well kept away from your ADF fight envelope. To counter the close proximity and get BVR more effective MKI's are based a bit interior. Lesser potent fighters are not gonna exposed to your supposed AMRAAM's before you are fired upon by MKI's or you get rid of them(unlikely).

Oh no you didn't!!! How 'bout them BISONS = "Bad Integration Shit ONly". Need I say more? Just like them BISONS, PAF's F-7 CAN also fire similar BVR's using their Italian G-M2 radars. Ask a PAF pilot on here . But the fact is, 30-40 KM BVR through Mig 21......is STILL not potent. The Radars aren't as powerful in Mig 21 and similar airframes' as compared to the MKI's or the F-16's or the JF-17. Crappy tires put on a Mercedes CLS don't make it equal to a track Ferrari.....

Also, the proximity from the PAF's FOB's to the Indian border is crazy short than larger strike squadrons placed inside the Indian borders. The issue is, an F-7 taking off Lahore or from the Pakistani side of Kashmir can immediately lock on a fighter that's still 5-10 km inside the Indian border. Add AEW, they can see inside the Indian airspace for 200-300 km's and know when a plane takes off. You guys can do the same of course but they don't have to scramble anything till its in their basic fighter's radar's range. So your AEW becomes kind of useless to some degree, including the mighty radar of the MKI. It would be the other way around if the Pakistanis were the offensive force. You guys would be shooting them like birds...
Due to so much visibility inside your border, in a war situation, theoretically, you may have a SAM coming at you while you'd still be 40 KM's inside the India border as its the WAR. There is no air defense warning sent when coming too close to the border. Remember, your best link (if you want to grow together economically) is also your weakest link militarily. That is the shared border and literally, a few minutes flight from airbase to airbase!
I can write many strong arguments here that anyone with common sense would agree with. But you guys won't as you don't want to accept the reality. The loss of a Mirage 2000 and one MKI far exceeds the money put into used F-16's or other F-16's acquired in the 80's. So losing 40 MKI's (for example, that's a lower enough number), plus a few Mirages 2000 plus a few Jags and Migs......you are losing very critical strength against the Chinese . That's why you wouldn't risk these expensive toys. Why were Mirages sent and not MKI's when you guys tried to attempt that per-emptive strike for media show-off? Because the risk was great, tensions were high and you might have seen a real interception taking place by the Pakistanis if they were crazy in their heads wanting war to take place. Risk or thought of an MKI going down like that, would crush the moral of the IAF that considers the MKI a super-plane sent from the Russian heaven . That's bad press, would show that the MKI pilots aren't that great, etc, etc. Apply that effect across the border towards the Chinese end...

I can guarantee it. The war days are gone. It is all talk. Any war with Pakistan will make India insanely weaker for the Chinese, not to mention the economic loss of Trillions of dollars. I don't think anyone has the stomach for that. You guys should start talking about friendship, food, sports and movies and forget about the war. Do business together and everyone makes money, sends their kids to good schools, nice vacation, houses and relationships. That's what life is for, to enjoy!

 

[rohailmalhi]

if you can't fill your own requirement with jf-17 .. how you suppose to deliver the export orders ?
in plain english... you are purchasing second hand f-16 block A .. when you could go for the jf-17 and at the same time comparing jf-17 with F-16 advance blocks... it is quite evident that jf-17 is quite inferior to even f-16 A.

Well you understanding of the JF-17 is quite wrong and I think you have not gone through the thread. I would recommend that you go through the JF-17 official thread so that you have know how of JF-17 and how it stands in relation to F-16 Blocks, before you make any assumptions.

Again do you have any prove that the purchased F-16 are Block A and not ADF (Block 40/42) . and Even if it is Block A.
The experience we (PAF) have with F-16 over the years , we cannot develop that experience over night in JF-17. But Once we do sure it will be our main focus but what till then . I wish they can somehow increase the strength of F-16 fleet ot 100+ . That will be real punch in PAF's hand .

btw why is it always live or die situation for indians there can be things in between them.

 

[majesticpankaj]

Well you understanding of the JF-17 is quite wrong and I think you have not gone through the thread. I would recommend that you go through the JF-17 official thread so that you have know how of JF-17 and how it stands in relation to F-16 Blocks, before you make any assumptions.

Again do you have any prove that the purchased F-16 are Block A and not ADF (Block 40/42) . and Even if it is Block A.
The experience we (PAF) have with F-16 over the years , we cannot develop that experience over night in JF-17. But Once we do sure it will be our main focus but what till then . I wish they can somehow increase the strength of F-16 fleet ot 100+ . That will be real punch in PAF's hand .

btw why is it always live or die situation for indians there can be things in between them.

I have gone through the Jf-17 threads which is full of fanboy stuffs ....
There is quite apparent that PAF is more comfortable with the second hand F-16 block A than the jf-17 which you guys compared with f-16 high end variants.... as production of jf-17 is not an issue as because you are offering it in international market...even China is not having plan to induct jf-17.....
agreed that you have a good exposure with f-16 but again it is not sanctioned proof....
on a side note... what is the development about J10 B....?

 

[rohailmalhi]

I have gone through the Jf-17 threads which is full of fanboy stuffs ....
There is quite apparent that PAF is more comfortable with the second hand F-16 block A than the jf-17 which you guys compared with f-16 high end variants.... as production of jf-17 is not an issue as because you are offering it in international market...even China is not having plan to induct jf-17.....
agreed that you have a good exposure with f-16 but again it is not sanctioned proof....
on a side note... what is the development about J10 B....?

It might have fan boy stuff but there has alot of information on different systems which are being used in JF-17.

Having a technology is one thing and developing expertise and tactics to use that tech is other things. We can produce JF-17 in good numbers but can we develop our tactics and experience on JF-17 as much we have on F-16 (3 decades) in 1 year or 2 years. We are currently in the process of developing tactics and exp and this process is very long one .

JF-17 doesnt fit their requirements so Chinese AF is not going to induct them. It was PAF brain child and it will remain so.

Regarding Development of J10-B again . I was not in favor of inducting J-10 B . It doesn't offer something exceptional that our JF-17 cannot offer (might have some issues with ASEA currently as space is bit less but lets see what chinese can come up with).

For fan boys its will be moment of joy thinking about induction of a newer platform in to PAF but when it comes to reality it will be a night mare. We are in process of getting use to (developing expertise and tactics) JF-17 which is currently a new brand plane for PAF.

Should PAF divide its focus .No it shouldn't .

What is the solution then . Get some more F-16s use them as stop gap measure till you get excellent with JF-17 . After which you have induct another platform (advanced 4.5 GEN or may be 5Gen ) replacing older F-16s.