Pakistan Army's T-129 ATAK Helicopter Deal | Updates & Discussions.

[-blitzkrieg-]

Imam ul haq?

I dont know who he is..
I meant to describe, like a horse, we keep moving, we dont sit and consolidate but rather move and accumulate.

 

[StormBreaker]

I dont know who he is..
I meant to describe, like a horse, we keep moving, we dont sit and consolidate but rather move and accumulate.

You missed the joke...

 

[khansaheeb]

omg "AgustaWestland"- stay away.

Westland helis were notorius for crashing and the company was bribing customers to buy.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

Why move on? Why not give Turks the support they need to get this right? T-129 is a good product. They have their first international contract with Pakistan and Pakistan can afford to wait.

This is how the eco-system will be built. It won't be easy but in the long run, it is laying the foundation of an independent military-industrial complex in the Muslim world that is free from sanctions and arm twisting by the dominating powers.

Pakistan goes the extra mile for Turkey, in the future they too will do it for Pakistan.


Absolutely. Once bitten, twice shy. I think both Pakistan and Turkey can relate to that.

Pakistan has NO time

The Turks are offering us joint production off their upcoming heavy attack helicopter and transport helicopter much better than the Chinese option

Haven't heard any official news, sounds like some YouTube video or something.

Nope why cancel it buy additional z10 and let T129 come as well. We need them all.

Why have redundancies? Who's going to pay for both systems

 

[StormBreaker]

omg "AgustaWestland"- stay away.

Westland helis were notorius for crashing and the company was bribing customers to buy.

O yeah, let’s not buy Boeing anymore because 737 MAX was horrible

 

[khansaheeb]

O yeah, let’s not buy Boeing anymore because 737 MAX was horrible

Boeings are always crashing, scary.

 

[Path-Finder]

damn engine problems.

 

[mingle]

Why move on? Why not give Turks the support they need to get this right? T-129 is a good product. They have their first international contract with Pakistan and Pakistan can afford to wait.

This is how the eco-system will be built. It won't be easy but in the long run, it is laying the foundation of an independent military-industrial complex in the Muslim world that is free from sanctions and arm twisting by the dominating powers.

Pakistan goes the extra mile for Turkey, in the future they too will do it for Pakistan.


Absolutely. Once bitten, twice shy. I think both Pakistan and Turkey can relate to that.

If engine can't direct import by Turkey Pak can import from US directly???

 

[dBSPL]

- Most probably helicopters of Pakistan Army will have B2 configuration (aka Atak-II). Or there will be an intermediate variant with similar features. That will include the most up-to-date countermeasures , ED and communication systems.

- Engines to be used in helicopters will be completely independent of US restrictions. There will even be D-level maintenance authority over the entire helicopter, including the engine.

- The types of ammunitions to be used shall be customizable to Pakistan's specific needs and will be free from any restrictions. The agreements with Roketsan are largely related to this.

- Turkey's attack helicopter program does not include a single variant. A wide range of programs in 3 main models up to 10ton MTOW and the system's indigenousity rates are increasing day by day. In other words, Pakistan has the chance to meet its needs in the same logistics chain, in the long term, and become the technology partner of the program.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

No Major Rush

 

[khanasifm]

Pakistan extends Turkey’s deadline to deliver T129 helos
By: Burak Ege Bekdil   7 hours ago
U.S. reluctance to grant Turkey technology export licenses.

With the American move now seriously jeopardizing the sale, the Turkish government has tasked Tusas Engine Industries, TAI’s sister company, with developing an indigenous engine for the T129.

“Pakistan has agreed to give us another year [to resolve the problem]. We hope we will be able to develop our indigenous engine soon to power the T129,” Ismail Demir, the head of Turkey’s top procurement agency, said Jan. 6. “After one year, Pakistan may be satisfied with the level of progress in our engine program, or the U.S. may grant us the export license.”

In 2018, TAI signed a $1.5 billion agreement to sell a batch of 30 T129 helos to Pakistan. However, the company needs to secure U.S. export licenses for any export deal with a third country. TAI produces the 5-ton attack helicopter, which is based on its predecessor, the A129 Mangusta.

The T129 is a twin-engine multirole attack helicopter produced under license from the Italian-British company AgustaWestland. It’s powered by two LHTEC T800-4A turboshaft engines. Each engine can produce 1,014 kilowatts of output power. The T800-4A is an export version of the CTS800 engine. LHTEC, the maker of the engine, is a joint venture between the American firm Honeywell and the British company Rolls-Royce.

A procurement source told Defense News on Jan. 10 that Pakistan is also lobbying the U.S. to support the deal.

But U.S. diplomatic sources in Ankara said it’s unlikely Washington will issue the license given the cold nature of U.S.-Turkish defense procurement ties. The U.S. last year suspended Turkey’s membership in the multinational Joint Strike Fighter program in response to Turkey’s acquisition of the Russian-made S-400 air defense system.

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But industry sources warn that any successful engine development program would take at least five to 10 years.

TAI recently delivered its 56th helicopter gunship to the Turkish military.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/...tends-turkeys-deadline-to-deliver-t129-helos/

This is not the first rejection t-129 was ordered by another customer and eventually due to non availability of engine order was cancelled. At the time there were no issues between turkey and US I think , bottom line why would US encourage competition to its products ???

I read it on Turkish site not sure what country may be Philippine’s??

 

[hyperman]

I think the blocking of the sale is most likely related to the AH-1Z sale to pakistan, it seems like a very Trump move, to block a competing product if there is a similar product that he is selling to the same country. It would be interesting to see how the ATAK helicopter looks with its domestic engines, and how it performs..

 

[mingle]

I think the blocking of the sale is most likely related to the AH-1Z sale to pakistan, it seems like a very Trump move, to block a competing product if there is a similar product that he is selling to the same country. It would be interesting to see how the ATAK helicopter looks with its domestic engines, and how it performs..

They did before with Pak in F16s PAF wanted used from Belgium but US rejected the proposal even Powell was Secretary of State that time later they offered new ones
If US offered more AH1z to Army I assure U they will pick them Up like hot cakes if that happens it's worth to pick old super cobras as well along will give us decent numbers and quick replacement of our current cobras and wait for turkish engine will take 5 to 10 yrs to mature

 

[Trango Towers]

We win. Turks win.

Good that Turks are investing in engine... down the road we need a lot of helliz...and localised production.. so I say great news!

Viperz ... sure... Khafee said so...

Khafe says a lot. F16V also have arrived

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

- Most probably helicopters of Pakistan Army will have B2 configuration (aka Atak-II). Or there will be an intermediate variant with similar features. That will include the most up-to-date countermeasures , ED and communication systems.

- Engines to be used in helicopters will be completely independent of US restrictions. There will even be D-level maintenance authority over the entire helicopter, including the engine.

- The types of ammunitions to be used shall be customizable to Pakistan's specific needs and will be free from any restrictions. The agreements with Roketsan are largely related to this.

- Turkey's attack helicopter program does not include a single variant. A wide range of programs in 3 main models up to 10ton MTOW and the system's indigenousity rates are increasing day by day. In other words, Pakistan has the chance to meet its needs in the same logistics chain, in the long term, and become the technology partner of the program.

Wasn't there an ATAK variant that was supposed to use the T625's rotor/dynamic parts and TS1400?