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Pakistan army warns of ‘disproportionate response’ in future wars

We are not Indians buddy. We don't have 15 days long Keran operation drama here. ;)

It is you guys who is running behind truck ki batti. In fact there are two trucks. One china. Other Pakistan. :)
well bro we are not the ones who is pridicting 4th war with india over kashmir ....lolzzz you lost half your nation in 1971 just because of thet obsession and look at your condotion now dont worry about us come when your ready ..."pehle apna killa majboot karo fir hame fateh karne ki sochna"

rahi baat china ki to bhai mana ki wo ek taqatwar dushman hai per wo "befkoof" hargiz nahi hai aur apne suna hi hoga "ek samjhdar dushman (china) ek befkoof dost se jyada acha hota hai" aur hum hinduatani china jaisa taqatwar aur samajhdar dushman apni taraqi ke liye jyada achha samjhte hain baki aap khud samajhdaar ho kyon :azn:...............:coffee:
 
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I just quoted your post to correct you on two things. Most Indian leaders aren't obsessed with Pakistan. They are more concerned with their local issues. Like Telangana issue.

Two, majority of Indians are more concerned about safety of their daughters or providing three square meals to their children. Internet warriors do not form even 2% of our population

They might be concerned with their local issues but they don't forget to make Pakistan an issue for elections do they?? I never said they aren't concerned over their domestic issues just that they are more fixated with Pakistan then Pakistani leaders are with India. Secondly, i agree with that too but that one was directed to Indian internet warriors who claim they represent more than 2 billion people of you're country.
 
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well bro we are not the ones who is pridicting 4th war with india over kashmir ....lolzzz you lost half your nation in 1971 just because of thet obsession and look at your condotion now dont worry about us come when your ready ..."pehle apna killa majboot karo fir hame fateh karne ki sochna"

rahi baat china ki to bhai mana ki wo ek taqatwar dushman hai per wo "befkoof" hargiz nahi hai aur apne suna hi hoga "ek samjhdar dushman (china) ek befkoof dost se jyada acha hota hai" aur hum hinduatani china jaisa taqatwar aur samajhdar dushman apni taraqi ke liye jyada achha samjhte hain baki aap khud samajhdaar ho kyon :azn:...............:coffee:

I think you first put your spell checker to use before criticizing our army. As they are doing what they are supposed to do. Discussing all possible threats and scenarios to our country. In India this might be something new but this is very much common in the whole world. Believe me.;)
 
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So what are you gonna do? Fire your nukes against India?

Before bellyaching and laying the blame at India's doorstep (which you guys always do at the drop of a hat), I suggest you do some research as to why there is water shortage in Pakistan. It all adds up to one word: MISMANAGEMENT. And I'm not saying this. It's you guys who are. Check this out...

ISLAMABAD: Despite having largest irrigation system in the world, Pakistan loses about two third of its water resources due to poor state of infrastructure, said climate and agriculture experts here at a seminar marking World Water Day 2013.

This year the theme for World Water Day 2013 was “International Year of Water Cooperation”. Federal Secretary Ministry of National Food Security and Research (MNFSR) Ahmed Buksh while addressing the seminar said “About two thirds of our water resources are lost in transmission and seepage. This means that about 68 million acre feet of water can be brought in use if the canal system is adequately repaired and maintained”. Buksh stressed on the need for addressing the issue of water resource management at local, national, regional as well as international levels.

Water security: Pakistan’s water woes highlighted on World Water Day – The Express Tribune

Mismanagement of resources: Pakistan to become water-scarce society

Pakistan is going to become water scarce society in the near future due to mismanagement of available water resources. These views were expressed by a group of intellectuals and scholars during a programme of Bethik.

Speakers said that we are fond of criticising others but are unable to bear criticism on ourselves which is a bad habit.

Mismanagement of resources: Pakistan to become water-scarce society | Business Recorder

Despite statements by Foreign Minister Shah Mehmood Qureishi that Pakistani mismanagement, not Indian thievery, is responsible for water shortages, general perceptions about the issue –fueled by extremist groups like Jamaatud Dawa- do not coincide.

Pakistani Water Crisis: Concerns about Regional Stability and Conflict | Center for Strategic and International Studies

According to Kamal, as described in a new report from the Woodrow Wilson Center, Pakistan faces significant and widespread water challenges:

Inefficient irrigation.
Abysmal urban sanitation.
Catastrophic environmental degradation.
Lack of water laws to define water rights.
Lack of a sound policy on large dams.


Pakistan's Water Crisis and Mismanagement

Nuff said. Hope you got the point.


Yaar, some "sons-of-a-gun" should bother to READ first.
Till that happens; you are hoping for just too much! :-)
 
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I think you first put your spell checker to use before criticizing our army. As they are doing what they are supposed to do. Discussing all possible threats and scenarios to our country. In India this might be something new but this is very much common in the whole world. Believe me.;)
lolzzz i know and you know what your ARMY and establishment is capable of and how much guts they have we all saw that in raymond davis affir , OBL raid and salalaa and what PA response followed after that ...make no mistake Owr defence forces , MOD & establishment are better professionlas in dealing with owr national interests not like yours who are more concerned about devicing new plans to buy latest BMWs and playing golf and more interested in running shadi haals , bakeries and petrol pumps than the real job they were assighned to do in the first place ...any way good luck
 
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“Army’s mother document” says growing Indian military power “disturbs strategic equilibrium of the region”
Pakistan’s official Army Doctrine calls on the country to “invoke disproportionate responses” in future wars with India, a copy of the document obtained by TheHindu has revealed. “The causes of conflict with the potential to escalate to the use of violence,” the classified internal document states, “emanate from the unresolved issue of Kashmir, the violation of treaty arrangements on sharing of natural resources, and the organised and deliberate support by external powers to militant organisations.”

The December, 2011, Doctrine does not name any country as a threat, but Pakistan has accused India of seeking to block its access to Indus waters, and backing terrorism. The Doctrine describes itself as the “army’s mother document” and “the fountainhead for all subordinate doctrines.”

Indian military sources told TheHindu the study was commissioned in the summer of 2008, soon after former chief of army staff General Pervez Kayani took office. It evolved through intensive discussions of the Kargil war of 1999 and the near-war that followed the December, 2001, terrorist attack on Parliament House

Georgetown University scholar Dr. C. Christine, author of a forthcoming book, Fighting to the End, says the Doctrine confirms what scholars have long known. “It tells us several interesting things,” she says, “among them that the Pakistan army sees Indian military modernization as a threat, but that they also think nuclear weapons will insulate them from the consequences of pursuing high-risk strategies, like backing jihadist clients.”

Future wars, the Doctrine states, “will be characterised by high-intensity, high-tempo operations under a relatively transparent battle-space environment.” This, it states, is because of the “incremental increase in asymmetry of conventional forces and [the] nuclear overhang” — evident references to the programme of rapid modernization India put into place after the 2001-2002 crisis, and both countries’ efforts to expand their nuclear weapons capabilities.

In the view of the Doctrine’s authors, de-facto parity between the two countries induced “through a combination of conventional and nuclear deterrence, has obviated the [likelihood of] conventional war.”

However, the Doctrine argues, “a disparity at the conventional plane continues to grow disproportionately, which too disturbs the strategic equilibrium of the region.” This, it states, “depletes peaceful diplomacy and dialogue, replacing it with coercion on the upper planes and violence across the lower-ends of the spectrum.”

What worries Pakistan’s army,” says the former Indian Army vice-chief, Arvinder Lamba, “is their inability to organize offensive or defensive responses to our growing rapid mobilization capacity. Their challenge is to deter us from striking by threatening nuclear weapons use in the face of the least provocation.

“India’s government and military must seek perceptual clarity on exactly what we intend to do in the face of such threats,” he said.

The Doctrine states that Pakistan will use nuclear weapons “only as a last resort, given its scale and scope of destruction.” Nuclear parity between India and Pakistan, it argues, “does not accrue any substantial military advantage to either side, other than maintaining the status quo.”

“In a nuclear deterrent environment,” it adds, “war is unlikely to create decisive military or political advantage.” However, it argues that “integration and synergy between conventional and nuclear forces, maintaining both at an appropriate level… [will avoid] an open-ended arms race.”

It does not state what the red lines compelling nuclear weapons use might be, but says future strategic “force development centres around developing and maintaining credible minimum deterrence, based on a [land, sea and air] triad, including an assured second-strike capability [to an Indian nuclear first-strike].”

“Lots of this thinking has been operationalised in Pakistan’s military,” says Rana Banerjee, a New Delhi-based expert on the Pakistan army, and former Research and Analysis Wing official. “Basically, this document signals they intend to react to even limited Indian military operations with disproportionate force, and hope fear of escalation deters New Delhi from reacting to events like 26/11.
Pakistan army warns of ‘disproportionate response’ in future wars - The Hindu

Thanks for info, a good read.



Basically, this document signals they intend to react to even limited Indian military operations with disproportionate force, and hope fear of escalation deters New Delhi from reacting to events like 26/11.
Georgetown University scholar Dr. C. Christine, author of a forthcoming book, Fighting to the End, says the Doctrine confirms what scholars have long known. “It tells us several interesting things,” she says, “among them that the Pakistan army sees Indian military modernization as a threat, but that they also think nuclear weapons will insulate them from the consequences of pursuing high-risk strategies, like backing jihadist clients.”

No new finding, off coarse.

There are many India bashers here who are happy that 2014 is approaching, but those who have closely analyzed Iran nuke deal definitely know better.

There are several sources which indicate that after 2017, KSA's importance will be very much reduced from US POV so does that of Israel. The reason would be recently achieved self sufficiency of US in case of oil and new supplier of oil in form of Iran.

This will naturally affect situation in subcontinent.

@Capt.Popeye @KRAIT @SpArK > Your opinions are welcomed.
 
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India has a long held policy of desertification of Pakistan, their occupation of Kashmir is also motivated by the long term goal of depriving Pakistan from its water supplies. The solutions can be reached just like the IWT. If India keeps playing delay tactics and its little games, it will pay in a big way. We will retaliate massively as India is already committing aggression against us.


India is committing aggression?? Not true Mr.Moderator!!!

It was Pakistan's policy of insurgency and jihad in Kashmir that is complicating the issue. The first decision Pakistan took after formation is Jihad against India as if Pakistan won't survive or stay united if there is no enemy called India. (your fore fathers has some doubts regarding their ideology it seems)

India only held the part of Kashmir so as to not to give access to its enemies China and Pakistan to join their hands and attack India.

Water issues are raised in tribunal by Pakistan and they turned out to be not true. India never blocked the water to Pakistan even in times of war like situation.

Regarding shortage of water in Pakistan, there are various reasons for that

One is migration of people to cities in large numbers, second increase in population.

India and countries around the world are facing the same issues, people in India who are dependent on Brahmaputra which flows from China controlled area, Gangetic plains etc are also facing the same issues of lack of ground water levels and water shortages.

There is a water sharing mechanism and every thing is being sort out from time to time. Most of the dams constructed on rivers are for Power generation and they have no right to halt the water supply or store it.
 
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lolzzz i know and you know what your ARMY and establishment is capable of and how much guts they have we all saw that in raymond davis affir , OBL raid and salalaa and what PA response followed after that ...make no mistake Owr defence forces , MOD & establishment are better professionlas in dealing with owr national interests not like yours who are more concerned about devicing new plans to buy latest BMWs and playing golf and more interested in running shadi haals , bakeries and petrol pumps than the real job they were assighned to do in the first place ...any way good luck

Again your post has no reference or relation with my post. Poor job buddy. Very poor job. :)

I didn't even talk about guts but your lack of comprehension is completely outrageous.
 
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India has a long held policy of desertification of Pakistan, their occupation of Kashmir is also motivated by the long term goal of depriving Pakistan from its water supplies. The solutions can be reached just like the IWT. If India keeps playing delay tactics and its little games, it will pay in a big way. We will retaliate massively as India is already committing aggression against us.

Ok. This warning will keep me and all the Indians awake tonight.
 
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Again your post has no reference or relation with my post. Poor job buddy. Very poor job. :)

I didn't even talk about guts but your lack of comprehension is completely outrageous.
kya bhai ji choro ye sab apko bura laga ho to sorry sirji :angel:
 
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This is funny.. Pakistani military leadership assumes that India will not be ready for this kind of retaliation....

Lekin jang hogi to.... shuru Pakistan karega...aur khatam Hindustan karega.

“Army’s mother document” says growing Indian military power “disturbs strategic equilibrium of the region”
Pakistan’s official Army Doctrine calls on the country to “invoke disproportionate responses” in future wars with India, a copy of the document obtained by TheHindu has revealed. “The causes of conflict with the potential to escalate to the use of violence,” the classified internal document states, “emanate from the unresolved issue of Kashmir, the violation of treaty arrangements on sharing of natural resources, and the organised and deliberate support by external powers to militant organisations.”

The December, 2011, Doctrine does not name any country as a threat, but Pakistan has accused India of seeking to block its access to Indus waters, and backing terrorism. The Doctrine describes itself as the “army’s mother document” and “the fountainhead for all subordinate doctrines.”

Indian military sources told TheHindu the study was commissioned in the summer of 2008, soon after former chief of army staff General Pervez Kayani took office. It evolved through intensive discussions of the Kargil war of 1999 and the near-war that followed the December, 2011, terrorist attack on Parliament House

Georgetown University scholar Dr. C. Christine, author of a forthcoming book, Fighting to the End, says the Doctrine confirms what scholars have long known. “It tells us several interesting things,” she says, “among them that the Pakistan army sees Indian military modernisation as a threat, but that they also think nuclear weapons will insulate them from the consequences of pursuing high-risk strategies, like backing jihadist clients.”

Future wars, the Doctrine states, “will be characterised by high-intensity, high-tempo operations under a relatively transparent battle-space environment.” This, it states, is because of the “incremental increase in asymmetry of conventional forces and [the] nuclear overhang” — evident references to the programme of rapid modernisation India put into place after the 2001-2002 crisis, and both countries’ efforts to expand their nuclear weapons capabilities.

In the view of the Doctrine’s authors, de-facto parity between the two countries induced “through a combination of conventional and nuclear deterrence, has obviated the [likelihood of] conventional war.”

However, the Doctrine argues, “a disparity at the conventional plane continues to grow disproportionately, which too disturbs the strategic equilibrium of the region.” This, it states, “depletes peaceful diplomacy and dialogue, replacing it with coercion on the upper planes and violence across the lower-ends of the spectrum.”

“What worries Pakistan’s army,” says the former Indian Army vice-chief, Arvinder Lamba, “is their inability to organise offensive or defensive responses to our growing rapid mobilisation capacity. Their challenge is to deter us from striking by threatening nuclear weapons use in the face of the least provocation.

“India’s government and military must seek perceptual clarity on exactly what we intend to do in the face of such threats,” he said.

The Doctrine states that Pakistan will use nuclear weapons “only as a last resort, given its scale and scope of destruction.” Nuclear parity between India and Pakistan, it argues, “does not accrue any substantial military advantage to either side, other than maintaining the status quo.”

“In a nuclear deterrent environment,” it adds, “war is unlikely to create decisive military or political advantage.” However, it argues that “integration and synergy between conventional and nuclear forces, maintaining both at an appropriate level… [will avoid] an open-ended arms race.”

It does not state what the red lines compelling nuclear weapons use might be, but says future strategic “force development centres around developing and maintaining credible minimum deterrence, based on a [land, sea and air] triad, including an assured second-strike capability [to an Indian nuclear first-strike].”

“Lots of this thinking has been operationalised in Pakistan’s military,” says Rana Banerjee, a New Delhi-based expert on the Pakistan army, and former Research and Analysis Wing official. “Basically, this document signals they intend to react to even limited Indian military operations with disproportionate force, and hope fear of escalation deters New Delhi from reacting to events like 26/11.
Pakistan army warns of ‘disproportionate response’ in future wars - The Hindu
 
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Ok. This warning will keep me and all the Indians awake tonight.

We are not the ones obsessing over a policy document are we? Three articles about war with Pakistan in the last 24 hours... And then you have the audacity to call us war mongers?

MrSpockSays.jpg
 
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This time I am sure the Navy is going to show its true colors. I am not seeing a long lifeline future for Karachiites as Pakistanis in any scenario I wargame mentally.

Karchi is going down bros. Big time.
 
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We are not the ones obsessing over a policy document are we? Three articles about war with Pakistan in the last 24 hours... And then you have the audacity to call us war mongers?

MrSpockSays.jpg

Your respected pm was the one who started this debate. You were the one who routinely threaten the world with nuclear wars. You attacked us four times. War monger is an understatement.
 
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Your respected pm was the one who started this debate. You were the one who routinely threaten the world with nuclear wars. You attacked us four times. War monger is an understatement.

Yet it was Indian newspapers that have published three articles on war with Pakistan in the last 24 hours? How many Pakistanis have discussed grand strategic analysis of actual war with Pakistan in the last 24 hours?

Pakistan has never had or used first strike as a doctrine of war, there is a reason Pakistan has been securing a second strike capability. Indian media and analysts are no better than ZZH, fussing over Pakistan, why would Pakistan's top brass not develop strategies to counter threats from it's neighbor who has stronger conventional forces and has repeatedly caused contention?

Tell me, if you as an Indian find it funny that Pakistan's defence strategy is India centric, why is India always looking to increase her fleet capability to counter China's influence?
 
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