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Netherlands cancel landing permit for turkish foreign minister

It is not a game or bait, but knowledge based challenge over cheap claims.

When you claim something, and challenged with knowledge in return; BS and Bait kind of answer implies that you are a cheap talker not more.
If you can't tell the difference between a politician and a public functionary, you need to take a class in public administration 101. Sure, of course, naturally I am a cheap talker, just because you say so. And Dutch are fascists, killers of 8000 Bosnians in former Yugoslavia, just because Erdogan says so.

Today I am going to vote in a free election.

You have a nice day now.

:meeting:
What's the reason for banning our officials in the first place ? We are not at war as far as i know.
They were informed well in advance their propaganda tour was not welcome at this time, stirring up divisions among Dutch Turks here just before the elections here. There is no reason why they have to come at this particular time. The whole issue could have easily been avoided by coming after the elections here. They deliberately chose to ignore the Dutch government statement on this. Naturally there is a reaction. Besides, Turkish law does not allow what they were attempting to do.

It doesn't matter if it is a referendum or election, what matters is people has a say. And that these people has the right to be informed, nobody can ban the visit of a foreign minister of Turkey and call themselves a "friendly" nation to Turkey.
One of your fellow countrymen pointed out that this is about a referendum and not about an election. You need to figure out among yourselves how that matters in the context of your own countryu's law.

Meanwhile, nobody can call us and other nazi's and call us murderers of 8000 bosnians and call themselves a "friendly" nation to The Netherlands. It is Erdogan that is deliberate causing trouble here, because he has a weak position at home and needs a diversion and something to stir up nationalist feelings.

In 2012, the countries celebrated 400 years of diplomatic ties. Let's not let the actions of one man destroy that.
 
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They were informed well in advance their propaganda tour was not welcome at this time, stirring up divisions among Dutch Turks here just before the elections here. There is no reason why they have to come at this particular time. The whole issue could have easily been avoided by coming after the elections here. They deliberately chose to ignore the Dutch government statement on this. Naturally there is a reaction. Besides, Turkish law does not allow what they were attempting to do.
:tup::tup::tup::tup::tup::tup::tup::tup:

This is the first honest reaction i got from my European friends after 15 pages.

I agree you on %100 percent. Our officials wanted an escalation that's why they choose the date to visit 2 days before the Dutch elections and despite the Dutch officials warnings.

Erdoğan wanted an external enemy. Holland would be fine, if the whole Europe can be made enemy it's even better. Erdoğan will keep escalating the issue until April 16. Then suddenly Erdoğan will drop the issue and begin to fix the ties.
 
What needs did when illegal Israeli agents came to Amsterdam and killed a woman who helped palestaninan freedom fighters don't tell me it is the right of meds where Muslim comes all humanity and laws starts but if Jews do 10000 time bigger illegal the law sleeps of EU
What does this have to do in any way with the current Turkish-Dutch spat? Indeed, completely nothing. It is not a Jewish v. Muslim issue whatsoever.

Besides, at least have the courtesy to post something to illustrate/support the claim you make about Israeli agents.
You appear to be talking about operation "Wrath of God", which was in 1974, after Palestinian killed the Isreali Olympic team in 1972 in Munich. What whent down is a bit different than you portray. Incidentally, the EU was formed in 1993, on the basis of the Maastricht Treaty, well after this event.

Shortly afterward, three Mossad operatives travelled to London to meet with a source who offered information on Salameh. When the source failed to show up, the team members began suspecting they were under surveillance. A female assassin-for-hire seduced one of the agents in a hotel, then shot him dead in his hotel room. The Mossad team members located the woman in Amsterdam three months later, and she was killed near her home on August 21 after she instinctively reached for a weapon as the team approached her. Local sources revealed that she was a freelance assassin, and it was never learned who exactly contracted her to kill the agent. The kidon team leader was later reprimanded for acting outside the assigned scope of the mission. One of the team members said, "most of our victims plead for their lives before being killed but not this woman. She was different. She didn't plead. She looked us all directly in the eye with cold detached hatred. Her face reflected nothing but disdain and defiance before we killed her.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wrath_of_God#Ali_Hassan_Salameh
 
One of your fellow countrymen pointed out that this is about a referendum and not about an election. You need to figure out among yourselves how that matters in the context of your own countryu's law.

Meanwhile, nobody can call us and other nazi's and call us murderers of 8000 bosnians and call themselves a "friendly" nation to The Netherlands. It is Erdogan that is deliberate causing trouble here, because he has a weak position at home and needs a diversion and something to stir up nationalist feelings.

In 2012, the countries celebrated 400 years of diplomatic ties. Let's not let the actions of one man destroy that.

It is not important whether this is an election or referendum or both. People is going to get the chance to vote a "Yes" or "No". The important thing is, people are going to vote, not donkeys or monkeys, and people has their right to get enlightened by their ministers PM or president about this referendum.

A humble question, are you from the Netherlands?

Bosnian people are like Turkish people to Turks. And we care a lot about them, and we know exactly what happened in the Bosnian genocide. Dutch soldiers were idling nearby when 8000 Bosnian boys and men were getting massacred systematically. So yes, pretty much you have the same burden on your shoulders as those degenerate serbs (at that time). And Erdogan pointed this out, because Holland wanted to teach Turkey some ethic and moral values. Then Erdogan naturally pointed this out that NL is in no place to teach us moral and ethics.
 
If you can't tell the difference between a politician and a public functionary, you need to take a class in public administration 101. Sure, of course, naturally I am a cheap talker, just because you say so. And Dutch are fascists, killers of 8000 Bosnians in former Yugoslavia, just because Erdogan says so.

Today I am going to vote in a free election.

You have a nice day now.

If you have no knowledge on law and international treaties, then a dictionary only brings you some humiliation in an international forum and makes you a cheap talker, also gives us some clue about your own intelligence and education that brings you the title of cheap talker and humiliation... bad sign for Dutch education system.

You jumped on another topic, which also signals that you are a weak debater who tries to get some leverage. Anyway, The Dutch soldiers drank some champaign with serbian genociders before they left Bosian civilians into the hands of Serbian genociders, on top of that the same soldiers were given medals by the Dutch state for their ''courage''. Meanwhile, the courts held those ''brave'' Dutch soldiers responsible and therefore ruled compensation.

Who else did the exact same thing in Europe And how are they called now?

Dear cheap talker and weak debater,
Please continue, if you like to bring more humiliation on yourserlf with your own intelligence.
 
It is not important whether this is an election or referendum or both. People is going to get the chance to vote a "Yes" or "No". The important thing is, people are going to vote, not donkeys or monkeys, and people has their right to get enlightened by their ministers PM or president about this referendum.
Like I said, you need to figure out among yourselves how that matters in the context of your own country's law.
AFAIK Tukish law forbids use of e.g. embassay for policital campaigning.

A humble question, are you from the Netherlands?
nRw7zZm.jpg



Bosnian people are like Turkish people to Turks. And we care a lot about them, and we know exactly what happened in the Bosnian genocide. Dutch soldiers were idling nearby when 8000 Bosnian boys and men were getting massacred systematically. So yes, pretty much you have the same burden on your shoulders as those degenerate serbs (at that time). And Erdogan pointed this out, because Holland wanted to teach Turkey some ethic and moral values. Then Erdogan naturally pointed this out that NL is in no place to teach us moral and ethics.
I think you need to educate yourself on this a bit. Because this is a very 'one dimensional', biased and untrue representation of what actually happend. Besides, where were the Turkish military in preventing all this, mr. on-your-high-horse? What does Srbrenica have to do with your referendum?

Clearly, Erdogan is deliberately stirring up trouble because he is weak at home and needs an external scapegoat/diversion. That's ALL this is.
 
@Sinan

Içkiyi feto değil, Allah yasakladı itirazın mı var?

Why do you delete your comments you coward?

Gezi ayaklanmasını, 15 temmuz Darbesini desteklediğini biliyoruz, Cumhurbaşkanına sarfettiğin hakaret ve iftiraların da çoktan not edildi
 
Like I said, you need to figure out among yourselves how that matters in the context of your own country's law.
AFAIK Tukish law forbids use of e.g. embassay for policital campaigning.


nRw7zZm.jpg




I think you need to educate yourself on this a bit. Because this is a very 'one dimensional', biased and untrue representation of what actually happend. Besides, where were the Turkish military in preventing all this, mr. on-your-high-horse? What does Srbrenica have to do with your referendum?

Clearly, Erdogan is deliberately stirring up trouble because he is weak at home and needs an external scapegoat/diversion. That's ALL this is.

You can ask any Bosnian where Turkey was, and you'll get your answer right away mr. ignorant.

Let's see it from your angle then: "On 6 September 2013, the Supreme Court dismissed a Government appeal,[280] a judgment that the Government accepted.[281] On 16 July 2014, a Dutch court held the Netherlands liable for the killings of more than 300 Bosniaks at Srebrenica, although the same court ruled that the Netherlands was not liable for the other deaths in Srebrenica."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

Your own court acknowledges that Dutch soldiers themselves killed more than 300 Bosniaks, rest of them were not physically killed but your soldiers were watching serbs doing their genocide.

And you're asking where Turkey was, are you freaking serious? :D If Turkey weren't present in Bosnia, we wouldn't have any Bosnia today, this is admitted from Bosnians as well.
'Türkiye'de olmasaydı, Bosna Hersek haritadan silinirdi''
English: "If Turkey wasn't present, Bosnia would be erased from the map".

- Senad İbriç, a veteran from Bosnian/Serbian war/genocide

And besides, don't worry about our internal politics and Erdogan. Erdogan is very strong inside Turkey, he has atleast 50% of the people on his side, don't worry about that.

Edit: "
  1. BM'nin Srebrenitsa'yı korumakla görevlendirilen 700 Hollanda askeri, bölgeye "güvenli" olma güvencesi ile sığınmış 8.000 kadar Bosnalı Müslümanı katledilecekleri bilindiği halde Sırp milislere teslim etmiştir. Kendilerine göstermiş oldukları "üstün hizmet" sebebiyle daha sonra madalya töreni düzenlenmiş ve ödüllendirilmişlerdir.[6]"

    English translation: UN gave 700 Dutch soldiers the job to defend Srebrenica. The dutch soldiers delivered the 8.000 Bosnian Muslims to Serbian militants knowing they would slaughter them. And these dutch soldiers were later given prizes as executing "Superior service" in this duty.
 
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@Sinan

Içkiyi feto değil, Allah yasakladı itirazın mı var?

Why do you delete your comments you coward?

Gezi ayaklanmasını, 15 temmuz Darbesini desteklediğini biliyoruz, Cumhurbaşkanına sarfettiğin hakaret ve iftiraların da çoktan not edildi
Abi, bi bitmediler......sayıyla mı gönderdiler lan sizi ?
 
If you have no knowledge on law and international treaties, then a dictionary only brings you some humiliation in an international forum and makes you a cheap talker, also gives us some clue about your own intelligence and education that brings you the title of cheap talker and humiliation... bad sign for Dutch education system.
Luckily, I have a PhD in a relevant from a good US university. Done now with the personal attacking (and lack of substantive points)?

You jumped on another topic, which also signals that you are a weak debater who tries to get some leverage.
Sure. Like I said, I'm weak weak weak. Ask around here just how weak.

Anyway, The Dutch soldiers drank some champaign with serbian genociders before they left Bosian civilians into the hands of Serbian genociders, on top of that the same soldiers were given medals by the Dutch state for their ''courage''. Meanwhile, the courts held those ''brave'' Dutch soldiers responsible and therefore ruled compensation.
Anyway, this is all totally unrelated to the issue over which Turkey and Netherlands have a spat, which further illustrates how Erdogan (and, judging from your post, with some succes) is seeking and playing a self-ignited external conflict to mask his own weakness at home. All that was necessary was coming around a week later. But nooooooo, ....he is just seeking to add fuel to make a small fire into a blaze. This man is jeopardizing 400+ years of good relations with NL, just so he can remain in his chair. I wish him and you and Turkey good luck.

Who else did the exact same thing in Europe And how are they called now?
I wouldn't know because it didn't go down the way you portray, as is evident from a ton of Dutch and international reports on the whole period. Your remark about the court ruling is actually incorrect: the court ruled that 8000-60 cases were NOT the responsibility of the Dutch soldiers and hence NOT eligible for compensation. And that sums up the state of your knowledge and debating skill.

Dear cheap talker and weak debater,
Please continue, if you like to bring more humiliation on yourserlf with your own intelligence.
Blablabla. Get a life.

You can ask any Bosnian where Turkey was, and you'll get your answer right away mr. ignorant.
Oh, so really, you can't answer that question.

UNPROFOR was composed of nearly 39,000 personnel. It was composed of troops from Argentina, Australia, Bangladesh, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, Colombia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Egypt, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Ghana, India, Indonesia, Ireland, Italy, Jordan, Kenya, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malaysia, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zealand, Nigeria, Norway, Pakistan, Poland, Portugal, the Russian Federation, Slovak Republic, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Tunisia, Turkey, Ukraine, the United Kingdom and the United States.

On 12 July 1995 UNPROFOR failed to deter the Bosnian Serb attack on Srebrenica because they were not able to sufficiently reinforce the Dutch battalion in place, and the city was overrun. When the dual key practices effectively prevented any serious air support from materialising all the Dutch could do was evacuate the women and children. The Serbs held the Muslim men and massacred thousands of them.

VRS forces (not Dutch forces) committed several major massacres during 1995.

With 100 members of the Greek Volunteer Guard, together with 2,000–3,000 reinforcements and 200–300 members of the Serb Volunteer Guard, the Bosnian Serbs could muster 4,000–5,000 men for the offensives against Srebrenica and Žepa. Of these, it was estimated that 2,000 would take part in the thrust to capture Srebrenica in July 1995. This included tanks and heavy weapons such as artillery and heavy mortars.
The Bosniaks, not as well-armed as their opponents, had a military force of 6,000 men within the town, about one-third or one-half of whom were armed. 1,500 of these were professional soldiers and 1,500 were armed militiamen.
UNPROFOR DUTCHBAT consisted of around 570 persons armed with personal weapons, machine guns, a couple of anti-tank launchers and a few YPR-765 (=ACV-AIFV).

  • The VRS began attacking various points at the southern edge of the Srebrenica enclave on 6 July. The forces of the VRS, numbering 1,500 in the initial stages of the attack, then shelled a series of Dutch observation posts in the southern portion of the enclave, forcing the Dutch peacekeepers stationed there to flee.
  • On the other hand, the few thousand remaining Bosniak soldiers of Srebrenica offered little resistance as their best-trained units had already abandoned the town. To make matters worse, Dutch peacekeepers had confiscated their weapons. When the Bosniaks demanded that their weapons be returned to them, the Dutch refused. As a result, Bosniak troops attempted to block the Dutch withdrawal in the face of the Bosnian Serb onslaught and more than 100 Dutch soldiers were taken hostage by the Bosniaks in a desperate attempt to stop them from leaving. Subsequently, a Dutch peacekeeper was killed after a hand grenade was thrown at his APC by a Bosniak soldier.
  • The Dutch then demanded that NATO bomb Serb positions around the town, but their requests were ignored.
  • With virtually no Bosniak resistance, the VRS relentlessly pounded Srebrenica with artillery on 9 and 10 July. On 11 July, the VRS entered the town. As it did, Mladić had about thirty Dutch soldiers taken hostage (their number now down to 440, encircled and cut of from supply)
  • About 3,000-4,000 Bosniak civilians then fled to the UN compound in Potočari where all men between fourteen and seventy were segregated by the VRS, the great bulk of which were trucked to neighboring Serb-held Bratunac. DutchBat personnel who attempted to follow them were seized by the VRS, together with their UN vehicles and some uniforms, weapons and other equipment.
  • Whereas Mladić had expected the ARBiH 28th Division to regroup near Potočari, the men of this division chose instead to flee to Bosnian-held territory. On 12 July the Serbs learned that the majority of the town's men had indeed fled the enclave, with 700–900 fleeing east to Serbia, 300–850 fleeing south to Žepa, and 10,000–15,000 fleeing north to Tuzla. Of these 10,000–15,000, approximately 6,000 were fleeing Bosniak soldiers, of whom 1,000–1,500 were armed. By the time the VRS had been redeployed, about 3,000 soldiers of the column's better-armed vanguard had successfully escaped to Tuzla.
  • The 9,000–12,000 Bosniaks who remained were encircled by VRS units and attacked by artillery, armor and small arms fire. The relatively few who survived the experience recounted how many panic-stricken Bosniak men committed suicide, killed each other in the dark, or drowned while attempting to cross the Jadar river, but by far the greatest portion of the men surrendered, some unwittingly to VRS soldiers equipped with stolen UN vehicles, helmets and uniforms.
  • At midday on 11 July, NATO planes arrived from Italy and struck a Bosnian Serb tank, before being forced to cease operations after General Mladić threatened to "destroy" both the Dutch soldiers and the Bosniak population of Srebrenica unless airstrikes were called off.
  • That afternoon, Mladić, accompanied by General Živanović (then Commander of the Drina Corps), General Krstić (then Deputy Commander and Chief of Staff of the Drina Corps) and other Bosnian Serb officers, took a triumphant walk through the deserted streets of the town of Srebrenica. The moment was captured on film by Serbian journalist Zoran Petrović. Mladić posed for television cameras, before declaring that Srebrenica had been "returned forever to the Serbs."
  • Later, Thom Karremans, the commander of the Dutch troops in the town, drank a toast with Mladić which was filmed for Serb television. Off-camera, however, Mladić warned Karremans that the UN compound in Potočari, where thousands of Bosniak refugees had gathered, would be shelled by the VRS if NATO planes reappeared
One can blame the Dutch political and military leadership, as well as UN leadership, but I doubt much that the troops on the ground stood any chance and actually could have done anything.

Now, I'm done dealing with something that is so obviously NOT related to the current dispute between our two countries. Ergodan is just namecalling, nothing more, like a fishwife on the fishmarket. Trying to rattle up nationalistic feelings over a self-created problem. I'm surprised anyone would fall for that.

You have a nice day now.
 
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@Sinan

Içkiyi feto değil, Allah yasakladı itirazın mı var?

Why do you delete your comments you coward?

Gezi ayaklanmasını, 15 temmuz Darbesini desteklediğini biliyoruz, Cumhurbaşkanına sarfettiğin hakaret ve iftiraların da çoktan not edildi
Nihal Atsiz is GOD!!!
 
Luckily, I have a PhD in a relevant from a good US university. Done now with the personal attacking (and lack of substantive points)?


Sure. Like I said, I'm weak weak weak. Ask around here just how weak.


Anyway, this is all totally unrelated to the issue over which Turkey and Netherlands have a spat, which further illustrates how Erdogan (and, judging from your post, with some succes) is seeking and playing a self-ignited external conflict to mask his own weakness at home. All that was necessary was coming around a week later. But nooooooo, ....he is just seeking to add fuel to make a small fire into a blaze. This man is jeopardizing 400+ years of good relations with NL, just so he can remain in his chair. I wish him and you and Turkey good luck.


I wouldn't know because it didn't go down the way you portray, as is evident from a ton of Dutch and international reports on the whole period. Your remark about the court ruling is actually incorrect: the court ruled that 8000-60 cases were NOT the responsibility of the Dutch soldiers and hence NOT eligible for compensation. And that sums up the state of your knowledge and debating skill.


Blablabla. Get a life.


Oh, so really, you can't answer that question.
I'm done dealing with something that is so obviously not related to the current dispute between our two countries. Ergodan is just namecalling, nothing more. I'm surprised anyone falls for that.

Have a nice day.
I already answered enough, read my post if you didn't get it the first time.
 

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