Mustefa Kemal Ataturk: The greatest Muslim general of the 20th centuary?

[qamar1990]

Europe has been dominating since mid 1640s military revolution and scientific advances.Which happened precisely after the collapse of church interference in state affairs in the aftermath of the thirty years war with the treaty of westphalia[1648].
European domination began and the world u see today is product of that decision to eliminate bigoted religious authorities and embrace science and reason instead of blind faith.
Allama iqbal may have been a great scholar but that quote was born out of his faith not out of his brain.

did i just catch you trying to change history? lmao

when did separation of church and state truely happen in europe and americas? do you know? obviously not.
europe was not the dominate and thinking and reason has nothing to do wuth their success, it was their willingness to slaughter people by the millions to take their land and resources, get your head straight boy!, you being an indian should know that very well.

allama iqbal is thinker, he didnt just say that out of thin air he went to europe and saw what was happening, what are we humans without morals religion, and ethics? ANIMALS!!

 

[FaujHistorian]

As, per my reading, i'd consider Mustafa Kemal Pasha, Ataturk the greatest Muslim general of the 20th centuary after General Sultan Fateh Ali Tipu in the 19th Centuary.

Do you have any more worthy candidate, in the 20th Centuary?
Its one of my wishes, to visit his tomb and pay my respects.

Please discuss....

With due respect, A general should never be linked to religion.


As soon as you bring religious connotation into military history, you will not learn a single bit from it.


So discuss if you want MKA as just a general and not "Muslim" general.


thank you

 

[livingdead]

I think ataturk will much prefer to be called a turk than a muslim...

 

[FaujHistorian]

I think ataturk will much prefer to be called a turk than a muslim...

Doesn't matter.

He is dead now.

And if we want to learn about his military prowess, we should simply talk about him as general. No religious mumbo jumbo.


Anyone who wants to say MKA was "Muslim" general, is really trying to do "religious preaching" on the cheap.


However if we are discussing Mullah, and ayatullah, then we are bound to say "which religion".


peace

 

[Wright]

you calling allama iqbal a bigot?
so far europe has been dominate only 80 years well see who is dominate in aother 30 years.

80 years ago was ~ WW2.

@Topic
Unless he was fighting for the establishment of the Islamic empire, he cannot be called a "muslim" general.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

did i just catch you trying to change history? lmao

when did separation of church and state truely happen in europe and americas? do you know? obviously not.
europe was not the dominate and thinking and reason has nothing to do wuth their success, it was their willingness to slaughter people by the millions to take their land and resources, get your head straight boy!, you being an indian should know that very well.

allama iqbal is thinker, he didnt just say that out of thin air he went to europe and saw what was happening, what are we humans without morals religion, and ethics? ANIMALS!!

You are the one revisioning history.All historians acknowledge the reduced role of the church after 1648[last time europe went to war over religion]and the sceintific and military revolution,The rigid theocratic thinking can never inspire innovation....only freedom of thought can achieve that...so it has everything to do with it.It wasn't their willingness to slaughter,many others also slaughtered millions...but the power to do so was derived from advance of technology that came from free thought based on reason and not faith or holy scripture.

Morality has nothing to do with religion....conscience is the basis of morality.What u are saying is people who don't believe in god can't be moral.Completely false.Many great thinkers and humanitarians of history have been non believers.
Organized religion's role in slaughtering millions throughout history and sowing division and hatred can't be denied.

 

[TurAr]

The title should have been "One of the Greatest generals of the 20th century" instead of this. Because the way it is now is encouraging those who live in the darkness of radical Islam to spread BS about this great man.

 

[FaujHistorian]

The title should have been "One of the Greatest generals of the 20th century" instead of this. Because the way it is now is encouraging those who live in the darkness of radical Islam to spread BS about this great man.

Greatest in 20th century?

It depends which list is considered, and how that list is prepared and ordered.

There is stiff competition for any general in 20th century. Very stiff.

 

[TurAr]

Greatest in 20th century?

It depends which list is considered, and how that list is prepared and ordered.

There is stiff competition for any general in 20th century. Very stiff.

"One of the Greatest generals of the 20th century"

 

[Myth_buster_1]

The british raj can be claimed to have given political unification to India minus Pakistan.

Had Britishers not been there, India would have been a lot of different kingdoms a majority of which would have been Maratha instead of the Democracy we have now.

THats why i siad, be thankful to British raj other wise Ghandi was a traitor who destroyed your "maratha" system

The title should have been "One of the Greatest generals of the 20th century" instead of this. Because the way it is now is encouraging those who live in the darkness of radical Islam to spread BS about this great man.

So any Muslim who questions Ataturk is living in darkness of radical Islam? Are all nationalist Turks raised up to be this ignorant about the world?
Your leader defiantly can make up to "one of the best" list in the category of.
1. British Agent.
2. anti-Islam
3. Atheist leader
4. Satanist.

It does not make sense to make a person Muslim leader when he is against the religion.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

With due respect, A general should never be linked to religion.


As soon as you bring religious connotation into military history, you will not learn a single bit from it.


So discuss if you want MKA as just a general and not "Muslim" general.


thank you

Saladin military achievements can be only associated with his faith in Islam.

 

[TurAr]

So any Muslim who questions Ataturk is living in darkness of radical Islam? Are all nationalist Turks raised up to be this ignorant about the world?
Your leader defiantly can make up to "one of the best" list in the category of.
1. British Agent.
2. anti-Islam
3. Atheist leader
4. Satanist.

It does not make sense to make a person Muslim leader when he is against the religion.

You are not questioning Atatürk, you are accusing him with being satanist just because according to you, he wasn't Muslim enough. You don't have to love him nor approve his actions, but you should show some respect to the founder of Turkey, a country which is also being considered as a friend of Pakistan.

 

[T-123456]

This just bs,if they were al freemasons then why did Stalin kill Trotsky(Stalin sent assasins to south america)
That was just an example.

 

[T-123456]

Saladin military achievements can be only associated with his faith in Islam.

Bs,he was a tacticus.
You cant win wars with shouting ALLAH ALLAH and storming to the enemy.

he wasnt 100% jewish but he had jewish ancestry.





so what are you saying? ataturk didnt destroy your culture?

Was he a Turk?yes!
The rest doent matter.

 

[livingdead]