The Shattering of the Muslim Hope in India

[Joe Shearer]

Joe, i have read your post for the last 13 years, under different alias...i do not survive here...but you are the old die hard Congress/ Nehru loyalist.

You have no clue what you are talking about, and your assertion is merely the kneejerk response of any Sanghi who is unable to bring logic or reason to bear, and falls back on labelling his non-Sanghi opponents as the only thing he recognises and understands, a die-hard Congress/Nehru loyalist.

As it happens, if you had really been reading my posts, you would have seen that from 1967, when I watched a corrupt, distrusted Congress ministry being thrown out, I have been, in fact, anti-Congress.

But who is to come between a Sanghi and his fixed beliefs?

I enjoy your play with English, and I understand you are bit old to assimilate suppressed facts which is new for you, but Sir, your bitterness will only grow. ...you were once on other side of PKistani posters here and now you share the table with them.

Don't be silly. Even today my posts have never abandoned a position to remain comfortable. It is just that even some - not all - of those among Pakistani members who have most aggressively disputed a certain matter with me have acknowledged that I bring no religious, linguistic or ethnic enmity with me to the table.

I realise that this is difficult for you to understand, and I realise that you can never come to that position yourself, or be acknowledged to be straightforward and possessing integrity by your opponents.

Sir, your bitterness will only grow.

Why?

My bitterness as it exists is with those fundamentally perverted people who oppose citizens of India in every way due to their religion. It has nothing to do with anything else.

You are like my late Uncle, a die hard commie Principal...with collapse of USSR, he had a shatterred last decades of his life....his utopian dreams gone @jamahir mind this.

I am not @jamahir. He will be the first to inform you that while I defend him as an underdog under constant attack, I do not share his political views.

So once again, you have applied yet another label that does not apply.

 

[Joe Shearer]

But I love you anyway. You have enlightened me for more than a decade. You can give me negative rating and also give me permanent ban....the salt rubbing hurts a lot I concede.. .but I will continue reading your post...which only amuses me....in the memory of my late uncle.

Thank you very much.

The only lesson that you need to gain from my posts, the only core that I have insisted on, is that the partition of the Crown Colony of India into India and Pakistan was done because ONE SIDE sought a religious partition, whereas the other side DID NOT.

I wish I had met your late uncle, but sadly that is impossible. My views have been formed by no party platform but have evolved by studying what I believe to be right for the country.

PS: Look at your post where you got a negative rating.

If you are not already aware, the poor have a faster reproductive rate than those who have the ability to survive. The population growth rate among Muslim Indians is directly linked to the bulk of them being in the north, in the most impoverished states; only a minority of that religious following is in the relatively more prosperous south.

Hindus are also distributed in a similar manner, but whether located in the north or in the south, they are more prosperous than the Muslims. As long as reproductive rate is linked to poverty, the poorer community will inevitably grow at a faster rate than the more prosperous one. Do the statistics for yourself.

It is not a coincidence that today, the reproductive rate of Muslim Indians has dropped, and is continuing to drop. This is directly attributable to the replacement of the leading elements in society that had emigrated in 1947, and left behind a vacuum. Only now, slowly, has that been reversed, and the results are visible in numbers.

I suggest you review and edit your negative rated post, to reflect reality.

 

[Wood]

Thank you very much.

The only lesson that you need to gain from my posts, the only core that I have insisted on, is that the partition of the Crown Colony of India into India and Pakistan was done because ONE SIDE sought a religious partition, whereas the other side DID NOT.

I wish I had met your late uncle, but sadly that is impossible. My views have been formed by no party platform but have evolved by studying what I believe to be right for the country.

I've read that Jinnah wanted federation while Nehru was for a union. Is this also not a difference that was too big to resolve?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Crown Colony of India into India and Pakistan was done because ONE SIDE sought a religious partition, whereas the other side DID NOT.

Very concise statement - "Crown Colony of India". Just want to add that the British Crown Colony had been partitioned prior to this event of 1947 which dominates discourse over the other 'partitions'. Few years before Burma had also been sectioned off.

Just saying ...... !

The British separated Burma Province from British India in 1937 and granted the colony a new constitution calling for a fully elected assembly, with many powers given to the Burmese, but this proved to be a divisive issue as some Burmese felt that this was a ploy to exclude them from any further Indian reforms.

I've read that Jinnah wanted federation while Nehru was for a union. Is this also not a difference that was too big to resolve?

Your Nehru was a smart cookie. Real smart. You people in India have a lot to thank him.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I've read that Jinnah wanted federation while Nehru was for a union. Is this also not a difference that was too big to resolve?

Jinnah agreed to a federation as a compromise, short of the extreme position of Pakistan that he had put forward as a bargaining position.

Nehru wasn't for a union; that came later. He certainly was for centralisation, and that is probably what you are defining as a union. Before the constitution was written, what was the union to be composed of?

The major difference between Gandhi, Nehru and Patel on the one hand and Jinnah on the other was that the original discussion was very clear in the understanding that parts A, B and C would delegate members to the constituent assembly, but those members would carry out the political programme that their part, their bloc had authorised them to do. Quite clearly, while it was not stated so, Gandhi, Nehru and Patel wanted the freedom to 'work' on the delegates and get them to see things their way. There was a VERY strange letter from Gandhi to Cripps suggesting that this should be held to be a possibility, to which Cripps gave a disapproving though very polite response. Jinnah did not know about this exchange. Finding Cripps firm in this, Nehru mentioned that he expected delegates to be free to vote as they wished, and that was the final, definitive breach.

Very concise statement - "Crown Colony of India". Just want to add that the British Crown Colony had been partitioned prior to this event of 1947 which dominates discourse over the other 'partitions'. Few years before Burma had also been sectioned off.

Just saying ...... !

Perfectly correct.

Your Nehru was a smart cookie. Real smart. You people in India have a lot to thank him.

He was right in his centralising impulse at that point of time, but it has become a burden around our necks over the years. I bet - no factual response this, just a bow drawn at a venture - that fully 70% of the bureaucracy in Delhi can be transferred to the districts and states if we were to go strictly by the constitution.

 

[Markandeya]

@Joe Shearer

I totally agree with what you have written as far as contemporary history is concerned. I am not a BJP loving guy but after suffering so much in the hands of Congress and Laloo , I can never bring myself to support the trio Sonia-Pappu-Priyanka. They have ruined Congress. After the first 15 years of rule of Krishna Sahi in Bihar, congress on an average changed CM in less than year, till the last one, Mishras...sold the crown to Laloo at the highest bid. ...If you do not have a leader at helm who spent minimum 5 years, your growth is going to go to dumps. Bihar growrh has been bad because of Congress High Command desire to keep the provincial government head..weak. Be in past or even now, fake Gandhis will opt for an idiot loyalist over meritorious. We had no choice than to support BJP. We do not have alternative. Other parties are Muslim appeasing in optics.

Your inputs on Ancient India is anti hindu though. You discard the new evidence as cooked up evidence of RSS. This part I referred as the one you need to open up.

It is good to see you back in the forum. You had disappeared for a long time ( for me) and I missed your post.


@jamahir is another poster who is born before the time. He is at another level, with his patience to write so much. Kya khata hai Jamahir....but he is a true dreamer...no harm there.

 

[MultaniGuy]

I have been reading the comments.

Personally, the demand for Pakistan was legitimate by us just being Muslims.

Why should we share our land and resources with Hindus.

That is a valid argument in itself.

 

[Big_bud]

Indian Muslims, specially is the youth is well "domesticated". They are spiritless, gutless Muslims who don't even know what's happening around in the world.

 

[xeuss]

I am not a BJP loving guy but after suffering so much in the hands of Congress and Laloo ,

How did you suffer?

 

[PradoTLC]

Enough progressives and rational Hindus. Can help the other rationals in India to build a advanced, sensible and harmonious socie

and yet modi wins in landslide elections....

if there do exist fair minded people they clearly have no impact.. it is like saying Iraqi airforce has good pilots.... but did it make any impact?

You make only banal statements and are unable to explain in simple words.

i dont need to write a thesis to explain my self

My english is fine and words are concise .. may be if you read the Quran with understanding you would able understand things better?

I am among a very few members on PDF who has posted the progressive aspects of Islam including the marriage law,

Clearly you need understanding on Islam.. there is no such thing as "certain aspects" of progressive islam.. The entre religion is progressive , lest you understand it.

 

[PradoTLC]

I have the English translation of the Quran by Abdullah Yusuf Ali and though I have not read beyond ten pages

and you there you go .. you have answered your own confusion... ie why you cant understand what i state... with such limited knowledge you will struggle to understand


BTW ...That must have been an incredible feat for you... 10 whole pages!

 

[PradoTLC]

Can help the other rationals in India to build a advanced, sensible and harmonious society.

Balkanisation of India is the only solution and Modi's anti muslim hate policy is a big force multiplier for us

hat makes what eight million, if my maths is correct ?

now divide that over 800M hindus...

the problem is thier belief system that has to be changed.. it has been done before the American did it against the Japanese with thier screwed up belief system. The Japanese in their fcuked in the head superiority complex did massive crimes against humanity to chinese and others

 

[PradoTLC]

Why should we share our land and resources with Hindus.

agree considering we ruled india for a 1000 years

 

[Joe Shearer]

@Joe Shearer

I totally agree with what you have written as far as contemporary history is concerned. I am not a BJP loving guy but after suffering so much in the hands of Congress and Laloo , I can never bring myself to support the trio Sonia-Pappu-Priyanka. They have ruined Congress. After the first 15 years of rule of Krishna Sahi in Bihar, congress on an average changed CM in less than year, till the last one, Mishras...sold the crown to Laloo at the highest bid. ...If you do not have a leader at helm who spent minimum 5 years, your growth is going to go to dumps. Bihar growrh has been bad because of Congress High Command desire to keep the provincial government head..weak. Be in past or even now, fake Gandhis will opt for an idiot loyalist over meritorious. We had no choice than to support BJP. We do not have alternative. Other parties are Muslim appeasing in optics.

Your inputs on Ancient India is anti hindu though. You discard the new evidence as cooked up evidence of RSS. This part I referred as the one you need to open up.

It is good to see you back in the forum. You had disappeared for a long time ( for me) and I missed your post.


@jamahir is another poster who is born before the time. He is at another level, with his patience to write so much. Kya khata hai Jamahir....but he is a true dreamer...no harm there.

WILL YOU PLEASE STOP WANDERING ALL OVER THE LANDSCAPE AND AMEND YOUR POST ABOUT THE MUSLIM PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION? I'M WAITING FOR THAT.

Replies to this interesting post later.

 

[Rollno21]

Balkanisation of India is the only solution and Modi's anti muslim hate policy is a big force multiplier for us



now divide that over 800M hindus...

the problem is thier belief system that has to be changed.. it has been done before the American did it against the Japanese with thier screw up belief system. The Japanese in their fcuked in the head superiority complex did massive crimes against humanity via chinese and others

It's funny when Pakistani uses balkanisation of india is good for Muslims in India, remember Pakistan was once part of india ,and everyone can see what has happened to Pakistan today.