Muslim Philosopher Says Islam Has Given Birth To Monsters, Needs Reform

[Dubious]

after a few generations of Muslims in Europe

Shall we take a look around?

Few generations of British Pakistanis, Bangalis, Indians have passed and all they have in common in the fear of racism which clustered them into their own communities ....Where the breeding of like minds (culture from sub continent) has effectively crippled any understanding or adaptations of good from the Western culture...

Instead due to extended pressure to want to fit in the kids do drugs and become more gora than the gora....

Such people are not good to prove anything esp when they are far from practicing anything Islamic rather just dwell in culture passed from parents of the sub continent...Heck even the Imam in the mosques in such areas are chosen based on the uncle who lived in the area the longest over someone who may be better suited..

Contradictions / Difficulties in the Qur'an
Eleven Qur'an Contradictions

Answering this blog is another called What's new on Answering Christianity (www.answering-christianity.com)?

Contradictions in the Qur'an | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry

Misquoting and quoting out of context does not count as contradictions

If I were to say you are Pakistani and then say you are Norwegian am I contradicting myself?

Contradictions in the Qur'an - WikiIslam

Of course your love of wiki....

Basically you have nothing

 

[Gibbs]

It seems unfortunate that wherever Muslims live they can't get along very well with people of other faiths, not even with people of their own faith. In Yugoslavia they clashed with Serbs, in Kashmir with Indians, in Palestine with Israelis, in Chechnya with Russians, in Xinjiang with the Chinese, in the Middle East with each other. Has this blood-shed no end? Why not live in peace for once?

Muslims in Sri Lanka are self-alienating themselves from the mainstream community – Dr Ameer Ali | Asian Tribune

 

[Dubious]

A culture derives its core values from its dominant religion. In Israel, the dominant culture is Jewish, not only because they have a Jewish majority, but also because their cultural values are derived from ancient Hebrew sacred scriptures. Same is the case with Western Christian countries. They are also considered Jude-Christian as both use same Bible as source of their core cultural values:
Judeo-Christian - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Same goes for various Muslim cultures across the globe as they consist of Islamic values not the other way around!

Not exactly, burying female infants was practiced way before Islam came into the picture and is still practiced...Nothing to do with Islam and not adhering to Islam where even a verse came to question so that man may ponder and feel shame for what he has done some did some dont till date:

And when the girl [who was] buried alive is asked For what sin she was killed [Quran 81:7-8]

“And when the good news is given to any of them of a daughter, His face turns dark and he is filled with grief.” He hides himself from the people because of the ill of which he has been informed. Should he keep it in humiliation or bury it in the ground? Unquestionably, evil is what they decide. For those who do not believe in the Hereafter is the description of evil; and for Allah is the highest attribute. And He is Exalted in Might, the Wise. [quran: 16:58-60]

Don't use islamophobic card here as ALL religions are full of contradictions.

Yet you have not been able to prove one

 

[Dubious]

What phobia? If Hindus, Jews, Sikhs and other migrating religions have easily assimilated in the West, what the heck is wrong with Muslims? Aren't they assimilating because of their rigid and unreformed Islamic faith?

Or maybe thanks to their culture which they value above anything logical? Like habit of debating is one culture that you will find very strong in S.Asian countries another saas bahu enmity ...the need to kill one or the other....nothing to do with Islam....

What prophet did back then like legally marrying a child with "consent" was probably not wrong back then but IT IS WRONG today. Times change. LOL

In context it is still not wrong because back then he married a woman who fit the criteria (age was never a criteria)

sane mind
puberty
consent

 

[fallstuff]

Muslims in Sri Lanka are self-alienating themselves from the mainstream community – Dr Ameer Ali | Asian Tribune

Ameer Ali's son involved in Sex-for-Marks scandal

 

[EasyNow]

Really? How come so many young muslim girls are married off to older men in Islamic way?

Problem actually is culture...And any truth seems like a strawman to you then it is your sheer ignorance!

This was a common excuse about 10 years ago but time has proved it to be a total fallacy.

It's not in our culture to hate other sects. It's not in our culture to hold life as worthless. Our culture does not teach us to question our parents and act like we know what's best for the world. Hundreds of Bengali's are joining ISIS every week and if you hear their ideology their is nothing cultural about it at all.

My friends used to say the same things but today we realise that our culture is what kept us balanced all these years. What is culture really? It's just a way of life adapted over centuries because it works. At least culture adapts to accommodate change, but religion does not.

The incidences you are talking about, like forced marriage, are only a cultural problem when people from one culture refuse to adapt to their new surroundings. In rural Punjab or Sylhet almost every single girl gets arranged married - and it works wonderfully, so in its place the culture is fine. When you try to apply this in a society where a girl does not live in an enclosed place, where every freedom in the world is available to her, where she is highly educated - then it does not work so well.

But if you can understand this and condemn people for not adapting their culture. Why not condemn them for not adapting the religious dogma to the present times?

 

[Developereo]

What's wrong with Jews having their own little state,

There's nothing wrong with Jews or left-handed people or Beyonce fans having their own country.
The issue is how the state of Israel was created -- by colonial diktat and by ethnic cleansing of people already living there.

I would wholeheartedly support a Jewish state in Norway or India or USA -- or anywhere else who are their cheerleader. If the Zionists decide they want Oslo (or New Delhi or Washington) as their capital and evict everyone else living there, you would have to accept it. I could even denounce the Norwegians or Indians or Americans who resists the Jewish invasion and call them fanatical anti-Semites.

It's easy to be compassionate when someone else is paying the price.

LOL. I have met many Norwegian Jews here and they overwhelmingly support Israel. Why wouldn't they?

Because it proves my point that religious fanaticism lives in Jews, Christians and everyone else. These groups are just media savvy enough to use euphemisms like "culture", "historical ties", etc.

Because IQ, religiosity and intelligence of average people is closely related. If you can't understand it, then don't blame me.

Oh, I understand perfectly well that you have a very tenuous grasp of most subjects, including IQ -- barely what one might learn from passively soaking up pop-sci on TV or skimming wikipedia.

How come few hundred thousand Zionist Jews defeated 5 Arab armies in 1947 - 1948? They had no US financial assistance back then or indigenous defense industries?

Again, you demonstrate ignorance.

Israel has been receiving financial and military help from even before it was established. Early money came from France. Early military hardware came from Czechoslovakia.

LOL. Again you blame foreign powers for Muslims extremist attitude?

I am blaming both sides -- both opportunistic thug in the Muslim world, and opportunistic countries abroad.

ISIS biggest recruiters are from Western countries i.e. foreign born Muslims. What kind of law and order issues do they have in stable Europe?

You are proving my point without realizing it.

Extremists can't find an outlet to indulge themselves in the West because of strong law and order, so they go to lawless regions to kill.

As I mentioned, there are all kinds of extremists -- Muslim and non-Muslim -- in Western society but they remain within bounds because the law is strong.

 

[gambit]

The 9 yr old question was in regards to THAT time....And there is no 1 source that tells you Aisha's CORRECT age AT THAT TIME.....Esp when they didnt have birth registration people only estimated ....and the method of estimation BACK THEN was not a sophisticated or solid as today esp since back then puberty was the only measure of marriageable age...

Before jumping in blind do read a few pages back (WHERE This question came from and at what it is addressed)

I would not consent a 9 yr old to marriage...Why 9 yr olds today are not responsible enough...Heck even 30 yr olds today are not responsible enough!

Hope that answers your question!

Here is where you missed the point...

It DOES NOT matter the precise age of Aisha at the time of marriage. What matter is how the Muslims views such a marriage TODAY. If Aisha was interpreted today to be 9 yrs old -- rightly or wrongly -- and if enough Muslims accept that interpretation, then Aisha was nine yrs old at the time of marriage. So now we see girls barely into their teens, some did not even made it, married to men old enough to be their grandfathers.

I have read the arguments and found nothing newly addressed. The fact that you brought up the age disparity between ADULTS tell me you did not understand the criticisms at all.

 

[gambit]

In context it is still not wrong because back then he married a woman who fit the criteria (age was never a criteria)

sane mind
puberty
consent

You better find an alternative to 'sane' because most children are sane -- medically speaking.

 

[Bratva]

You better find an alternative to 'sane' because most children are sane -- medically speaking.

Though entirely off topic, but there are multiple report girl as little as 13 getting pregnant became pregnant in America as well as in some european countries.

Britain's youngest mother is believed to be a girl of 11, who fell pregnant when she was just ten. The world's youngest recorded mother was an eight-year-old from Arkansas in the U.S., who had twins in 1994.

This girl is just 12 and she is pregnant by a boy of 15 | Daily Mail Online



Girls become sexually active as early as 13 or majority at 15. Don't you find that shocking and disgusting as well?

In whole Islamic history, a singular case occurred (please do quote if such incidents in 21st century in Islamic world, It's a challenge) and you feel disgusted while you don't get disgusted by liberal sexual attitudes of your own countrymen is bemusing.

And Did I forget to mention Coitus didn't occured right away after Aisha was married ?

 

[asq]

You are so right in your assessment, any human being will feel the same, but the problem Islam has created is, when they do retaliate it is only done in religious perception, instead of human needs or freedom......

Don't go blaming Islam, treat each case on its merits, it is not right to kill innocent no matter where they are, so blaming Muslims is again is a spin to blame the victim.

 

[asq]

The problem lies with simple as education. When families and there homes are destroyed, in a frantic states these children and family members are pulled in by these radicals who use them for there benefits and violence. Clearly, the age of violence to solve problems is in the past and not working, and end result is killing of more Muslims each day. That realization has to be taken in by Muslims community, but unfortunately I have not seen any Muslim leader that has taken this stance.

I think the greatest challenge to any Muslims country is the problem of separation of church and state. The first Muslim country that implements this concept will be on the road to modernization. The closest I believe is Turkey, but they have not fully implemented it.

stop blaming the victims and start expanding the justice, blaming victims due to education, blah, blah is a smear campaign, so stop blaming the dirty acts and stop killings and destroying their properties and or taking their properties by force.

 

[asq]

Aaha?Why then did thousands of new converts from Europe and america join ISIS?Why did thousands of Muslims from Saudi join the ISIS?In what way were these people oppressed?

did you not read the facts, ;et me open your close eyes due to your hatred for Islam, in Syria almost 200,000 people have been killed and you did not care, so those who families been killed are gone crazy and or may be thousands of people killed in Iraq are gone mental due to their families being annihilated. I do not approve of killing innocents no matter where but than i cannot even feel the pain of those who's families have been destroyed, properties taken by force and children maimed or imprisoned.

Islam does not approve of killing in any case, but if attacked Islam gives you the right to defend. and that is natural for any one to protect their families and properties. it does not matter if one is Muslim or not.

than again there are rumors about these isis as to how they came about, these rumors are spread to confuse the matter further the plight of all including Palestinians, Kashmirs.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

Let me be very clear with this Babe Hun logic -

Just because Jews
Bomb children.
Kill innocent women.
Men
Are land grabbers
Involved in massive money printing
Involved in Jihad wars

Does NOT mean that Judaism needs reform!

It SIMPLY means that the followers need to take a hard look.

Just because Muslims
Bomb innocent
Enslave women
Involved in massive corruption
Can't do anything productive

Does NOT mean that Islam needs reform!

It SIMPLY means that the followers need to take a hard look.

 

[gambit]

Though entirely off topic, but there are multiple report girl as little as 13 getting pregnant became pregnant in America as well as in some european countries.

Britain's youngest mother is believed to be a girl of 11, who fell pregnant when she was just ten. The world's youngest recorded mother was an eight-year-old from Arkansas in the U.S., who had twins in 1994.

This girl is just 12 and she is pregnant by a boy of 15 | Daily Mail Online

We do not look with approval with those young pregnancies, do we ? We do not try to justify them, do we ?

Girls become sexually active as early as 13 or majority at 15. Don't you find that shocking and disgusting as well?

And if the father is an adult man, what do you think we do with him ?

In whole Islamic history, a singular case occurred (please do quote if such incidents in 21st century in Islamic world, It's a challenge) and you feel disgusted while you don't get disgusted by liberal sexual attitudes of your own countrymen is bemusing.

A single case ? Are you kidding me ?

And Did I forget to mention Coitus didn't occured right away after Aisha was married ?

Not right away ? How long after the ceremony was the consummation ? One yr later ? Does that make it more palatable ? I guess so.