MMA govt proposes new name for NWFP

[Awaaz]

Quaid's the father of our nation, it is the ideology that has earned you the right to name a land in todays time or else you'd be just another slave race under the British or worse.

If you've met stupid Pakistanis who called you Afghani then that's just your hard luck. You would be equally stupid if you are ready to denounce your Pakistanihood and prove those idiots in Jhelum right.

What about the ideology of people like khan abdul ghaffar khan, and bugtis? or they have no space in in history of pakistan?

 

[Awesome]

What about the ideology of people like khan abdul ghaffar khan, and bugtis? or they have no space in in history of pakistan?

Why associate all Bugtis with Nawab Akbar Bugti has a space in History. Space for a traitor. I don't say that Balochistan shouldn't have its own army but he was an individual with an army. An army dedicated to bomb and kill Pakistanis.

Nawab Akbar Bugti got what he deserved for his treachery.

 

[Awaaz]

Look we all have differences, bugtis killed, but so has the federal goverment killed so many pakistanis, you dodged my question so do you believe that khan abdul ghaffar kahn has no place in history of pakistan, a man who is worshipped as the the father of the qom by pushtoon people.

Balochistan should have its own army to make them feel more pakistani, we all want pakistan to progress and be united but what is the goverment doing to make people to feel pakistani rather then baloch, pushttoon, punjabi and sindhi. In my opinion nothing, stero typical views and favouritism is what is going to be the down fall, democratic views and freedom of speech in pakistan?

Asim bahi i respect you regardless what you say, but in truth is there really freedom of speech in pakistan?

 

[Awaaz]

Does anyone else here believe that khan abdul ghaffar khan has no place in history of pakistan? Comeon let the truth come out, dont hide your feeling be brutttaly truthful.

 

[Awaaz]

Do we have some baloch nationals here, lets hear your views and opinions, do you feel that death of Akbar bugti was benificial for musharrif or people of balochistan. What are your views and opinions regarding this matter, lets make this forum a truly independent and free forum where all can express their views and opinions without being hated or labelled as traitors etc.

 

[Awaaz]

Who else thinks akbar bugti got what he deserved, and why did akbar bugti resort to violence in first place?

 

[Awesome]

In reality there are a lot of things wrong with Pakistan but only a weak person shies away from fighting a problem. If Punjabies couldn't bring about freedom of speech, why don't the Pashtuns do something about it?

I'm from a family that comes part from India and part from Kashmir, but my allegiance to Pakistan is strong despite whichever piece of dirt my ancestors may have come from. Because being a Pakistani doesn't mean allegiance to any piece of land/dirt/soil. It means holding allegiance to the idea of Pakistan - thats it. First, second - last. We are not tied together through our Religion since there are millions of Pakistanis who are not Muslim either. We are tied together as long as there are more people that believe in the idea of Pakistan than the lands, the patches of dirt, that make up Pakistan.

Akbar Bugti went violent because unlike BB, NS and all the previous rulers from the time when he helped the government squash the 70s uprising, Musharraf wouldn't pay him up. Akbar Bugti had previously helped squash baloch tribes himself when the center had greedy rulers. The center had Bugti had a an alliance. They would pay leaders like him some money while not provide resources to the rest of Balochistan. Nawab Khush, Hakoomat khush.

Musharraf put a stop this. He was the first one who dared to do something like this. Don't you find it weird that the Nawab went violent at a period when the funding of Balochistan was at an all time high? Because Balochistan government was being funded and not the Nawab.

During the Nawab's time as a Chief Minister he was given a lot of projects to complete. But the federal government and him both made a deal. Where a road would cost 5 lakhs he would get the job done in 1 lakh. The government paid him 2 lakhs for the project and pocketed the rest.

This went on till Musharraf's time.

You do also know about the countless Balochis that were trapped for decades within the underground dungeons of Deira Bugti? You also know the countless people he murdered of his own. Heck you could have gotten killed just because you turned your back on that guy. It was an insult. If you wanted to exit a room you had to walk backwards.

This is the sort of man who got what he deserved.

 

[Marathaman]

Hey I remember Khan Abdul Ghaffar khan...he was called "frontier gandhi" or something rite? He used non-violent protests and stuff?

 

[roadrunner]

why wait for tomorow when you can do it today, i think they should change the name to any appropriate one chosen by the nwfp public and not any other group. More autonomy for province of nwfp where prosperity and development can increase, and mass poverty can be eliminated.

I wouldnt go for more autonomy to increase development. NWFP should remain under the writ of the central government. It is stupid to weaken the federation anymore with this dumbass notion that more autonomyequals more development. Has FATA developed more than non FATA NWFP areas? No.

As far as feeling a pakistani, i dont think anyone in nwfp feels pakistani, you may differ but its true speak to people in rural areas as well as most major cities, one of the reasons for this is the ignorance of other pakistani groups, as pathan people are labelled afghanis and not pakistanis by the public. in my time in jehlum people called me afghani when i am from sarhad, in their mentality a pakistani is he who speaks punjabi and urdu.

Some Punjabis can be as narrow minded as Pathans. Wow, quit looking at others when you have the same problem yourself. And there's many people from NWFP that consider themselves Pakistani. If they felt remotely Afghan, or if it mattered to them, they would be voting AMP.

This makes the people of nwfp feel as outsiders and therefore are not patriotic or passionate about pakistan.

A lot of Pakistani Army is made up of Pathans, especially from the officer rank above. You think they're not patriotic? Why does Pakistan Army recruit from NWFP if they're not so patriotic?

Other issue is that lack of recognition of pathan people and leaders, i was reading some articles here posted by democrat pak, very extreme in my opinion, but they did higlight some truth, where balouch and people of nwfp have been neglected and for years and years, his comments about quaid e azam were extreme but absoultely right, though i belive he could have expressed them without insulting the man.

Neglected is bullshyt. Ayub Khan ruled Pakistan, Yahya Khan did, there's lots of Pathan officers in the Army. If you're saying the province itself is negected, do a quick calculation of the budgets for each province and then see what percentage of the population the each provincial population makes up. You're living in an older time it seems, there's huge development going on in Balochistan right now. On a scale I would say it's probably getting more than Punjab.

Can we please stop forcing the ideology of quaid e azam and allama iqbal on people as i feel its wrong, that creates an atmosphere where other ethnic groups feel that their leaders are not remembered for their hard work.

Shouldnt matter what Quaid's ethnic group is, this makes you as narrow minded as the others you whinge on about. What do you not like about his ideology, aside from his ethnic group?

 

[roadrunner]

Does anyone else here believe that khan abdul ghaffar khan has no place in history of pakistan? Comeon let the truth come out, dont hide your feeling be brutttaly truthful.

Dude, Bacha Khan was an idiot. He was a Gandhi following docile fool. He was even against Partition, which would have made him stay Bharati, such was his love for Gandhi.

 

[Wounded Healer]

we are discussing different topics simultaneously.......the name of the province should not be changed into "afghania" as it will only incite the non-pushto speaking people of N.W.F.P., who, by the way, are the indeginous people of this great land...Damn it, why cant they just go for Khyber, as all parties agree to it except the ruling MMA.

as far as provincial autonomy goes, well i am all for it........N.W.F.P. produces 98% of tobacco in Pakistan......the federal government gained a net profit of Rs.48 billion last year......from which this province gets a percentage.......why cant we sell our own tobacco to other provinces, just as punjab sells its agricultural products through out pakistan.

 

[roadrunner]

Oh yes, a tobacco based economy. You must have graduated with first class honours from the "Madrassah of Department of Writer" to think a tobacco based economy will be able to compete with any surrounding economy, not to mention the strengths of combining all the provincial econoies!

 

[Awaaz]

Dude, Bacha Khan was an idiot. He was a Gandhi following docile fool. He was even against Partition, which would have made him stay Bharati, such was his love for Gandhi.

Now if i called quaid an idiot most likely chance is i be banned and hated by the rest of the community, yet you insult a legend of pushtton people and it seems permissable, there is no need to use insulting language as we are all civilised and can express our feelings in a civilised way, he may be an idiot to you, but majority pashtton people think otherwise.

You may not like his ideology because it was for mostly for pashtton ethnic group rather then all of pakistani ethnic groups. Though i dont agree with majority of his viewsetc, does not mean that i distance my self from the great man, though i can distance my self from his extreme views.

My final words are we all have our differences which is a good thing not a bad thing, as long as we dont let those differences seperate us and our goals and objections reagrdless of ethnic group.

 

[Awaaz]

if the poeople want the name to be afghania then be it, it doesnt make me feel any different from what i have felt for past 27 years of my life a proud muslim and a pakistani.

 

[roadrunner]

Now if i called quaid an idiot most likely chance is i be banned and hated by the rest of the community, yet you insult a legend of pushtton people and it seems permissable, there is no need to use insulting language as we are all civilised and can express our feelings in a civilised way, he may be an idiot to you, but majority pashtton people think otherwise.

Well, I'm Pashtun myself, and that's what i think about him. I don't speak for the majority of Pashtuns and neither do you, so we have a difference of opinion. Again, you attack the messenger instead of dicussing my point that he was uncreative. He actually modelled his ideologies on gandhi and became a hermit pacifist instead of greats Pashtun leaders like Khushal Khan Khattak and the other warrior leaders. If you think he was so great, you are going against what most people in the NWFP thought when they rose up to fight the British and Bharatis. Those people had the real fighting spirit, not your hermit warrior who reminds me of a Bharati.

Even in the referendum in which he opposed the formation of Pakistan, noone voted for him. he lost by 9 votes for every one of his. That's a huge loss, and these were pashtuns voting against him.

You may not like his ideology because it was for mostly for pashtton ethnic group rather then all of pakistani ethnic groups. Though i dont agree with majority of his viewsetc, does not mean that i distance my self from the great man, though i can distance my self from his extreme views.

His ideology was copied of Gandhis and that is why he was so unpopular! He had nothing in his ideology that was even remotely Pashtun. He's a sell-out.

My final words are we all have our differences which is a good thing not a bad thing, as long as we dont let those differences seperate us and our goals and objections reagrdless of ethnic group.

I'm not talking about that. i'm just arguing against you being a mouthpiece for people of the NWFP. You're using your own experiences and think everyone will be the same. One can see what the general thinking is in the NWFP by polls, elections, and they definitely don't seem to care about nationalism or autonomy or any of these things (not to mention ludicrous ideas about a tobacco-based economy).