JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 3]

[PakShaheen79]

I think this HMS/HMD thing will also adopted on per batch basis by Pakistan. First with Chinese HMS/HMD with Chinese avionics and Western one with Western Avionics.

Interesting thing is which WVR West can offer to work with Wesern HMS/HMD system?

 

[wild peace]

http://pacdg.free.fr/pages/missions... sur le pont, pare a etre catapulte (web).jpg

Sir Raffale has 14 hard points. Is it like this

OR like this
http://i889.photobucket.com/albums/ac95/ISI_1990/Rafale/6412_101010923245126_10000008655010.jpg

 

[wild peace]

USA pilots have incorporated a new helmet that features the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System, a system which improves breathing and radio communication as well as better head protection.

http://www.f-16.net/modules/Gallery...wnloadItem&g2_itemId=211787&g2_serialNumber=2

The upgrade, which runs at around $1,000 per helmet, also holsters a camera and a projector that assist pilots with air operations.

The camera is embedded in the helmet and sits over the left eye, allowing ground personnel to see exactly what the pilot sees, said Staff Sgt. Jeremy Burton, 18th FS aircrew life support technician. The projector at the top of the helmet displays information on the inside of the visor over the right eye.

"It increases combat capability by quite a bit," Sergeant Burton said. He explained that with the new helmet, pilots won't have to look at their head-up display as often. The stationary HUD, located front and center in the cockpit, displays flight and target information for pilots.

The advantage of having this new system, said Capt. Jeremy Wimer, 18th FS F-16 pilot, is the holographic image that is displayed wherever the pilot looks.

"The JHMCS has three main assets," Captain Wimer said. "It gives cueing to our flight members to let them know who the friendly forces are on their radar, it shows who the enemies are and it also allows us to see ground targets or our sensor point of interest."

Another feature that will soon be implemented in these new helmets is the capability to employ high off-bore sight with air-to-air missiles, said the captain, who has four years experience flying F-16s.

"This means we will have the capability to not only point the aircraft at the enemy to shoot them, but also be able to shoot at him no matter what direction we're pointing--I could cue the missile to a target over my right shoulder if I needed to."

Captain Wimer noted the cutting-edge technology upgrade's added improvement to the human factor of flying.

"The best thing so far is the instant situational awareness it gives pilots," Captain Wimer said. "I will always know where my flight members are located."
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:...ibrary/budget/fy2001/dot-e/images/01jhmcs.jpg

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:04vdsDz9rBqf3M:http://www.vsi-hmcs.com/images/jhmcs_image.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:...tic.flickr.com/3301/3609595681_632b139a00.jpg

 

[Arsalan]

http://pacdg.free.fr/pages/missions... sur le pont, pare a etre catapulte (web).jpg

Sir Raffale has 14 hard points. Is it like this

OR like this
http://i889.photobucket.com/albums/ac95/ISI_1990/Rafale/6412_101010923245126_10000008655010.jpg

well bro it is like this one:

these are what we call hardpoints, rafale have 14 of them,,

and as far as this pic is concerned:

they are called multiple pylons. you can carry more then one weapon on a single hard point by using this system, in case of the picture you posted, the pylon is carrying three bombs using a single hard point.

i hope you got it!!

regards!

 

[PakShaheen79]

@ wild peace

To inform you Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System is included in Pakistan's new F-16 contract and are also part of MLU of existing systems.

 

[Arsalan]

USA pilots have incorporated a new helmet that features the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System, a system which improves breathing and radio communication as well as better head protection.

http://www.f-16.net/modules/Gallery...wnloadItem&g2_itemId=211787&g2_serialNumber=2

The upgrade, which runs at around $1,000 per helmet, also holsters a camera and a projector that assist pilots with air operations.

The camera is embedded in the helmet and sits over the left eye, allowing ground personnel to see exactly what the pilot sees, said Staff Sgt. Jeremy Burton, 18th FS aircrew life support technician. The projector at the top of the helmet displays information on the inside of the visor over the right eye.

"It increases combat capability by quite a bit," Sergeant Burton said. He explained that with the new helmet, pilots won't have to look at their head-up display as often. The stationary HUD, located front and center in the cockpit, displays flight and target information for pilots.

The advantage of having this new system, said Capt. Jeremy Wimer, 18th FS F-16 pilot, is the holographic image that is displayed wherever the pilot looks.

"The JHMCS has three main assets," Captain Wimer said. "It gives cueing to our flight members to let them know who the friendly forces are on their radar, it shows who the enemies are and it also allows us to see ground targets or our sensor point of interest."

Another feature that will soon be implemented in these new helmets is the capability to employ high off-bore sight with air-to-air missiles, said the captain, who has four years experience flying F-16s.

"This means we will have the capability to not only point the aircraft at the enemy to shoot them, but also be able to shoot at him no matter what direction we're pointing--I could cue the missile to a target over my right shoulder if I needed to."

Captain Wimer noted the cutting-edge technology upgrade's added improvement to the human factor of flying.

"The best thing so far is the instant situational awareness it gives pilots," Captain Wimer said. "I will always know where my flight members are located."
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:...ibrary/budget/fy2001/dot-e/images/01jhmcs.jpg

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:04vdsDz9rBqf3M:http://www.vsi-hmcs.com/images/jhmcs_image.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:...tic.flickr.com/3301/3609595681_632b139a00.jpg

and the best part is we are going to get them with our latest blk 52z and even the MLU include these HMSs and the worts part is,, we have to look toward US to get them ,,
so let us just hope that it goes along smoothly!!

regards!

 

[wild peace]

SIR PakShaheen79 and arsalanaslam123. Thank you very much for your help.

Sir I know the difference of pylons and hardpoint but I am surprised about 14 hardpoints ..is it because of delta wing (provide much space) our JF has only 7 or in near future 9 but think about 14 marvellous....

 

[PakShaheen79]

SIR PakShaheen79 and arsalanaslam123. Thank you very much for your help.

Sir I know the difference of pylons and hardpoint but I am surprised about 14 hardpoints ..is it because of delta wing (provide much space) our JF has only 7 or in near future 9 but think about 14 marvellous....

Yes it has lot to do with Wing area. But more comes from design goals of a fighter means for what kind of missions one fighter is being designed at first place.

 

[Tempest II]

Consider that the Rafale wingspan is 10.8m and the Thunder is 9.45m. That is 1.35m difference which means 650mm extra of space per side. Put that into perspective: A Mk-82 bomb is 273mm in diameter and a Mk-32 is 357mm.

Secondly, consider the wind area, Rafale = 45.7 sqm and Thunder is 24.4 sqm. That is almost double, so more space to fit the pylons and more lift to get them airborne.

Two engine for the Rafale = more power. Also from a physical layout, and spacing of the landing gear, this should offer an advantage the pylon placement.

Fourth, the empty weight: Rafale = 9,500kg. Thunder = 6,411kg. Rafale is 3,000kg heavier. Besides the weight of the extra engine, a good proportion of that 3,000kg will have gone to a strengthened airframe/structure.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

so if any body need the details of hard point of RAFALE,here they are.

 

[Arsalan]

SIR PakShaheen79 and arsalanaslam123. Thank you very much for your help.

Sir I know the difference of pylons and hardpoint but I am surprised about 14 hardpoints ..is it because of delta wing (provide much space) our JF has only 7 or in near future 9 but think about 14 marvellous....

my pleasure,
well it certainy have a lot to do with wing span. it is not only about the length of wings but also there total area that determines how much weight they can carry. as for rafale, the wing span is slighty more then that of JF as explained by tempest, this enable it to carry one extra hardpoint on each wing. for additional hardpoints, the twin engine configration comes handy as they not only generate more power to carry additional weapons but also give more space to accomodate hardpoints. here the pic postd by danger zone may preove helpfull:

the pictures do not show two hardpoints which are present under the fuselage in line with the two missiles shown at the ends of fuselage or engines,,

i hope the issue is resolved.

now as far as JF17 carrying 7 or 9 hgardpoints in comparison with rafale's 14, bro rafale is a twin engine heavier plane. both JF17 and rafale are differnt class and meant for different roles. if JF17 manage to increse number of hardpoints to 9 it will be good enough. here is a slight idea of what JF will be carrying on 9 hard points:
A2A role,
2 WVRAAM on wing tips
4 BRVAAMs two on each wing
with three hardpoints vaccant to accomodate either fuel tanks, or more missiles!

in A2G role it will be like two WVRAAMs, Two BVRAAMs two hardpoints for bombs and using multiple pylons. three hardpoints left again either to cary two fuel tanks and a targetting pod or carry more missiles as required by mission.

in naval earefare duties:
two WVRAAM, two BVRAAM, two AshM and same story for three vaccant hardpoints which in this case are more likely to be accomodated by two fuel tanks for more range required in naval warfare duties and perhaps a targetting pod.

so for me 9 hardpoints will be mor then sufficient for our needs, the oly addition that i can think of is perhaps an additional small harpoint somewhere under cockpit to house the targetting pod in land attack and naval duties so that the plane may carry an extra AshM or land attack cruise missile!

well i hope you guys will agree with this!

regards!

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

well according to diccussion for new hardpoints in jf-17,can i giv my old idea for inducting new hard points under DSI.it would be able to load small bombs,missiles and targeting & FLIR pods.
its doesnt seems to be big deal to me or it could be

 

[zavis2003]

if we compare with Apachee then
The Apache is capable of carrying the following weapons:
Up to 16 AGM-114 Hellfire missiles. The latest AGM-114K has a dual-seeker capability:pulsed radar or semi-active laser guidance and a range in excess of 8 km (5 miles).
Hydra 70 rocket pod carrying up to 1970mm folding-fin aerial rocket (FFAR) unguided rockets.
M 320 30mm ‘chain gun’ located under the chin of the aircraft and capable of carrying up to 1200 rounds of ammunition. The chain gun can be slaved to the pilot/CPG’s helmet sight.
Although there have been test firings of other missiles, including the AIM-9 Sidewinder,
AIM-28 air-to-air stinger (both heat-seeking missiles) and the British laser-guided Starstreak,
none of these has been deployed for operational service.

 

[Arsalan]

well brother what makes you compare a fighter jet with an attack helicopter,,, if it is only about payload then a MBRL can also be in competition or even naval vessels!! lol:

guys, it is not a big deal, 7 hardpoints----yes we need more, 9 hardpoints---- fine enough. dont forget the role that JF will be playing in PAF.

let me again post the possible weapons with 9 hardpoints as posted earlier:

A2A role,
2 WVRAAM on wing tips
4 BRVAAMs two on each wing
with three hardpoints vaccant to accomodate either fuel tanks, or more missiles!

in A2G role it will be like
two WVRAAMs, Two BVRAAMs two hardpoints for bombs and using multiple pylons. three hardpoints left again either to cary two fuel tanks and a targetting pod or carry more missiles as required by mission.

in naval warfare duties:
two WVRAAM, two BVRAAM, two AshM and same story for three vaccant hardpoints which in this case are more likely to be accomodated by two fuel tanks for more range required in naval warfare duties and perhaps a targetting pod.

dont you think it is enough specially considering the class of JF17 and other high tech planes that will be there for support. for me, with this weapon payload, JF wont be bothered even when all on its own,,
i am talking about weapons only!

regards!

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

JF 17 is a small plane---chance are that for

A2A role---only 2 bvr's and 4wvr's

A2G---depends how dedicated the attack is---maybe maybe 2 wvr's andrest ground attack----better chances are that no wvr's at all---only ground attack weapons----

naval version---purely dedicated plane---only 2 ashms if it can carry them---otherwise only one ashm---maybe maybe 2 wvr's---and fuel tanks---extra weapons a extra burden---take the focus away from the primary goal and are cumbersome for the plane---.

The incoming missile hits will be taken by the escorts---the escorst will be fully armed, but will lay down their lives in protecting the primary attack plane---for that reason no weapons on the primary attack plane.