JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 2]

[Patriot]

ok a question here someone said that our JF-17 T/W ratio is 0.98 if that is the case ...why can't our plane go straight up i forgot the offical term used for it but what i mean is that once the plane takes off it can go vertically up!! that usually happens when ur T/W ratio is 1 or somewhere close to it.....

max climb..

 

[Munir]

Kinetic energy is very important. Either you transfer potential energy (height) into kinetic energy or you add engine power. If you engine has less thrust then TWR 1 then you will lose energy (and speed) when you go upwards. Besides that engine power adds more agility and you have more ordnance options cause you can conquer more drag.

In normal words... If you have a small suzuki and you add a very powerful engine to it... Would it be more capable then the old one? And do remember that speed is one of the most important factors.

 

[showstopper]

Has anyone heard of different variations of the JF-17? Considering that it's going to form the backbone of the Pakistan Air Force, could a strike/bomber/attack version be in the works? Mabye similar to the F-15 vs. F-15E?

 

[Zob]

I think this video might explain what i am talking about....well there our better videos but i can't seem to find them...and no my friend the actual technical term is neither vertical climb nor maximum climb....and mr.munir u r spot on to what i wanted to say that a TWR less than 1 is not a powerful option for an engine currently given the engines out there in the world.

 

[Munir]

zeuON3eGA0o[/media] - J-10 Vertical Climb At Takeoff - J-10 beats F-22 Raptor

I think this video might explain what i am talking about....well there our better videos but i can't seem to find them...and no my friend the actual technical term is neither vertical climb nor maximum climb....and mr.munir u r spot on to what i wanted to say that a TWR less than 1 is not a powerful option for an engine currently given the engines out there in the world.

Thanks. But do remind. In real combat you want to stay out of the BVR range. If needed you will use HMS and highly agile WVR and avoid loss of kinetic energy. Getting height might be a temp solution but knowing the SAM coverage these days you want to stay low and fast...

Add to that that fueltanks make you go down to max 5g... Add to that BVR and WVR will make you slower... You often see these moves with optimum fuel and zero ordnance... If that happens in real combat you can forget praying cause you are dead within seconds.

 

[mean_bird]

Some export news related to JF-17...We all know it but its just a confirmation

Feb. 14, 2009
Baku. Rachad Suleymanov - APA. The air forces of Azerbaijan celebrate their anniversary February 14.

Formed on 14 February 1992, the Azerbaijani air forces are the highest in the South Caucasus, in terms of number of aircraft and the competence of drivers. Azerbaijani air forces have achieved air supremacy in the South Caucasus, through modernization and doubling of number of aircraft during the last 9 years. Strengthening the air force is expected within 5 years. Over 50% of the body must be replaced by new-generation aircraft by 2010. The new aircraft JF-17 Thunder, SU 27 (NATO code - Fulcrum), SU 30 (NATO code - Flanker) and MiG fifth generation to equip the Azerbaijani army. Development priorities of the air forces of Azerbaijan: Purchase of new aircraft and helicopters; Modernization of existing aircraft; Modernization of command centers and management systems of flights; Modernization of education, training of personnel; Completely the range through local production. A state of war and the terrain is favorable, the installation of Soviet air bases in Azerbaijan, we have an opportunity to develop the air force. Azerbaijan has been authorized for 100 combat aircraft and 50 helicopters, according to the Treaty on Conventional Arms in Europe. The range of the Azerbaijani army is being completed by the Soviet MIG 21 aircraft (NATO code - Fishbed), MIG-23 (Flogger), MiG 25 (Foxbat), SU 24 (Fencer), SU 25 (Frogfoot), the MIG 29 (Russian aircraft of the fifth generation purchased from Ukraine. NATO Code - Fulcrum), the transport aircraft Il 76 (Candid) and Antonov. One can also mention the Soviet strategic bomber TU 16 (Badger). The talks for the purchase of JF-17 Thunder is underway with Pakistan. The Frontier and the Service Club of patriotism have military trainer aircraft L-29 (Delfin), L-39 (Albatros) YAK and manufactured in the Czech Republic and Ukraine. The Soviet and Russian helicopters Mi-28 (Havoc), Mi-8 (Hip) and Mi-6 (Hook) dominate in the Azerbaijani army. The Azerbaijani army has completed its range by the Israeli reconnaissance drone "Orbiter" and "Aerostar". UAVs are demonstrated for the first time in the military parade on 26 June 2008. Command of the army of Azerbaijan is interested in the drones' Hermes' and 'Heron TP, "according to the Israeli press.

Auto-translated from French
APA - Puissance de l?aviation militaire de l?Azerba&#239;djan ? <font color=red>AVIS D?EXPERT</font>

 

[Zob]

i wonder will we ever be ableto sell JF-17s cuz usually all military deals have kickbacks...and i guess we won't be able to give kickbacks...besides anti pakistan lobby i.e. India and Israel will always try and persuade the potential customers to opt for other platforms...let's see what happens....i am optimistic....

 

[aditya_aditya]

thats true . i dont think our country has the right to stop anyone from selling their successful products .

 

[aditya_aditya]

by the way sir i would like to ask how many hardpoints does it have and can it carry western weapons .

 

[PAFAce]

Great news posted above. Let's hope the deal goes through.

i wonder will we ever be ableto sell JF-17s cuz usually all military deals have kickbacks...and i guess we won't be able to give kickbacks...besides anti pakistan lobby i.e. India and Israel will always try and persuade the potential customers to opt for other platforms...let's see what happens....i am optimistic....

That is correct. However, I think that if the the Indians select an American jet for the MRCA role, then Pakistan would have a strong case for selling the JF-17s to any country that the US, India and Israel oppose (Iran, North Korea, etc). This is because, the Pakistanis could make the argument that the US has armed its traditional rival within the region based on a strict unbiased defence sales policy, and so Pakistan is adopting a similar policy of selling to whoever needs the weapon systems.

I don't think this is very realistic, though. If we sign a deal with Iran or any such country, we can wave good-bye to our Block 52s. Any such deal will have to be made between China and the country of interest, because China has nothing to lose by annoying the US a little bit.

 

[showstopper]

by the way sir i would like to ask how many hardpoints does it have and can it carry western weapons .

it has eight hardpoints right now, but that might change in future blocks. it can support either western or chinese weapon systems/avionics.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

I don't think this is very realistic, though. If we sign a deal with Iran or any such country, we can wave good-bye to our Block 52s. Any such deal will have to be made between China and the country of interest, because China has nothing to lose by annoying the US a little bit.

well, cant we sell our JF after F-16 deal is over? 2012-13?

 

[mean_bird]

With regard to selling JF-17 , I would like to state

1. Pakistan won't be in a position to sell them anytime soon. We need to take care of our own air force requirement first. Anyway, the assembly line will be booked for the first 50 batches.

2. Is Iran and North Korea the only country left in the world we want to sell to? We can sell to many other asian or african country that want a fighter with a tight budget or those that want to maintain hi-lo ration.

3. If there is anywhere that politics is a problem, China could step in. If US pressurizes us not to make a deal, China can do the deal.

4. IMO, Chengdu will not have an assembly line unless a very large order is procured. So either way more than 50&#37; of the plane would be made in pakistan anyway regardless of which govt. makes the deal. Remember, they agreed on a 'joint marketing strategy'.

But as I said, other countries will wait till we can fulfill our airforce requirement first and possibly to see all integrations, testing, etc done. China would definitely like to sell their own engine. Considering all the above points, I don't see any deliveries starting before 2012-13 to any potential customers.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Seemingly JF 17 is not for sale. The version available for sale would be FC 1.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Hi,

Seemingly JF 17 is not for sale. The version available for sale would be FC 1.

please dont assume on something you dont know.

AZERBAIJAN is currently negotiating "JF-17" i repeat "JF-17" with "PAKISTAN"!
and btw, you know how many countries showed interest in "JF-17" i repeat "JF-17" in IDEAS-2008?