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JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

Hi,

Let us slow down a little bit---. Pak military is also in awe of western product---if it could have procured western stuff---it without restraints or even with restraint---it would have gone for it---.

So---please don't bash the Arabs for no reason---.

ir order for them to buy from us---we will have to prove our goods---.

A seller has to prove the quality of his merchandise for the buyer to be interested---.

Don't just wing it left and right and make hate speech against the arabs---.

The Arabs are a Tier 1 product buyers---. get close to that tier---and they will come running---. They have no love lost for west---.

Give them a reason to come to you---.



Hi,

It is all talk---wait till the product hits the deck---. You will find the surprise---.
Firstly it aint a hate speech.. Secondly whereas i did start by mentioning buying from us but if u re read my post i clearly state from alternate sources. You cant say chinese or russians are inferior in every field. They come under alternate sources.
Its a mentality bro, trying to get the best is absolutely fine but not questioning what ever comes out of their mouth and just melting away infront of them or taking every other source as rubbish is the problem. Let me give u an example whch may help u get to my point ... since i aint from defence industry hence i may not use the rt terminology. A few years back a GCC country tht a senior uncle and a friend (x paf) lives in told me tht it was making a new airbase or runway, the vendor given the task of runway had also sublet to another company as is the case usually. There were fortnightly progress meetings attended by the head who was a native. On a few of the meeting the native sent him on his behalf. To his uttermost surprise the vendor was chairing the progress meeting and was calling the shots there along with the sub vendor. If that was not enough amongst other things he found was that the runway being made, it strength was adequate for the current aircrafts but was way below the tender figures and future aircrafts with higher weight wont land there. When he told tht to his manager he wouldnt listen saying tht the vendor know the best and he told him tht it was a adequate etc etc and refuted his claim whch he did prove in next few days by doing wht he was doing all his life in pakistan. U can say its a problem with a vendor or a particular project but same way there are tons of examples where wht is said by gora is harf-e-akhir. I agree tht over the years they have developed a reputation of being credible but boy do they milk these arabs or what. They usually go to any extent to keep their defense industry active which is no doubt one of the best if not the best too.
The same attitude of being in awe or overwhelmed tht i wrote is prevalent in other fields too. Some that i have personally experienced too.
My take on this is... The arabs hav been unfortunately brainwashed over years the same way pakistanis were and probably are narrow minded in their approach. Amongst our reasons were lust for filling our personal pockets, taking shortcut by buying from other and the oppressed approach or mentality due to being ruled by britishers. Just like us the arabs also can not see at anything other than the easy way out. We were taught a few lessons by 71, pressler and esp f16 saga but we still made a fiasco of the mirage and thunder deals but eventually ended up with a more than decent jf17. Arabs need to be treated the same way to get out of this mindset. All their investments, property, weapons are in us or eu. They need a gud few kicks on their behind to look elsewhere and especially to look within.
 
Hi,

No one wants to buy a weapon from a brand weapons manufacturer---because there is NO REPUTATION to back the product---.

Paf is fortunate to have the backings of the chinese industrial complex---plus their own image in the arab world to make the Arabs interested in this product---.

And they have shown more interest in this nascent product due to our air force's reputation than they would have to anyone else---.

Next---the product has to have certain goodies to attract picky buyers---. Most pakistanis are ecstatic & happy with a Suzuki Mehran---so what would most pakistanis know about luxuries in automobile---when their biggest car is a Toyota corolla---which is a lower tier model for those with money----.

So---our BLK 3 should be getting us to that higher attractive tier---.

So---please let us not insult those who just saved our arse from a financial meltdown---.
Not to mention PAC really needs to work on their presentation skills and have a dedicated fixed team instead of rotational PAF assignments....people don't know who to talk to that they don't know....
 
I think the author is talking about age rather than the capabilities of the Mirage.
Doesn't make much difference , JF-17 should have been a true replacement of Ageing or Capable Mirage, however the author puts it. While JF-17 is newer and more capable apart from carrying Ra'ad.
 
Firstly it aint a hate speech.. Secondly whereas i did start by mentioning buying from us but if u re read my post i clearly state from alternate sources. You cant say chinese or russians are inferior in every field. They come under alternate sources.
Its a mentality bro, trying to get the best is absolutely fine but not questioning what ever comes out of their mouth and just melting away infront of them or taking every other source as rubbish is the problem. Let me give u an example whch may help u get to my point ... since i aint from defence industry hence i may not use the rt terminology. A few years back a GCC country tht a senior uncle and a friend (x paf) lives in told me tht it was making a new airbase or runway, the vendor given the task of runway had also sublet to another company as is the case usually. There were fortnightly progress meetings attended by the head who was a native. On a few of the meeting the native sent him on his behalf. To his uttermost surprise the vendor was chairing the progress meeting and was calling the shots there along with the sub vendor. If that was not enough amongst other things he found was that the runway being made, it strength was adequate for the current aircrafts but was way below the tender figures and future aircrafts with higher weight wont land there. When he told tht to his manager he wouldnt listen saying tht the vendor know the best and he told him tht it was a adequate etc etc and refuted his claim whch he did prove in next few days by doing wht he was doing all his life in pakistan. U can say its a problem with a vendor or a particular project but same way there are tons of examples where wht is said by gora is harf-e-akhir. I agree tht over the years they have developed a reputation of being credible but boy do they milk these arabs or what. They usually go to any extent to keep their defense industry active which is no doubt one of the best if not the best too.
The same attitude of being in awe or overwhelmed tht i wrote is prevalent in other fields too. Some that i have personally experienced too.
My take on this is... The arabs hav been unfortunately brainwashed over years the same way pakistanis were and probably are narrow minded in their approach. Amongst our reasons were lust for filling our personal pockets, taking shortcut by buying from other and the oppressed approach or mentality due to being ruled by britishers. Just like us the arabs also can not see at anything other than the easy way out. We were taught a few lessons by 71, pressler and esp f16 saga but we still made a fiasco of the mirage and thunder deals but eventually ended up with a more than decent jf17. Arabs need to be treated the same way to get out of this mindset. All their investments, property, weapons are in us or eu. They need a gud few kicks on their behind to look elsewhere and especially to look within.

Hi,

Is Pakistan going to accept to be a replacement of western security in the arab countries---. You know it is just not the weapons only that the Arabs need and want---.

Pakistan failed miserably when the Arabs asked for security---they were ready to hand over everything to us for their security and that also with the west's permission---.

Allah gave us the Arab domain---and out of sheer stupidity---we fckd it all up---.

You are looking for peanuts---they were giving us the whole plantation and scertain religious pakistanis and certain media affiliated with certain religious group screwed pakistan over just to please Iran---.

Youngman---they gave it to us all on a platter---it is we who rejected it---.
 
Hi,

Is Pakistan going to accept to be a replacement of western security in the arab countries---. You know it is just not the weapons only that the Arabs need and want---.

Pakistan failed miserably when the Arabs asked for security---they were ready to hand over everything to us for their security and that also with the west's permission---.

Allah gave us the Arab domain---and out of sheer stupidity---we fckd it all up---.

You are looking for peanuts---they were giving us the whole plantation and scertain religious pakistanis and certain media affiliated with certain religious group screwed pakistan over just to please Iran---.

Youngman---they gave it to us all on a platter---it is we who rejected it---.
Oh bhai...
I hear what you are saying. But i neither contested it nor even disagreed .
My point was that the arabs wont buy block 3 for the very same reason they won't buy su35 or T90MS, K2 etc. They cant look beyond uncle sam and his gang in eu.
The susupension of refueling for yemen war should be a small wake up call but from what i have read against house of sauds it aint gonna happen. I expect a new defence deal or new lollipop in the form of aramco IPO or something similar.
 
Hi,

Is Pakistan going to accept to be a replacement of western security in the arab countries---. You know it is just not the weapons only that the Arabs need and want---.

Pakistan failed miserably when the Arabs asked for security---they were ready to hand over everything to us for their security and that also with the west's permission---.

Allah gave us the Arab domain---and out of sheer stupidity---we fckd it all up---.

You are looking for peanuts---they were giving us the whole plantation and scertain religious pakistanis and certain media affiliated with certain religious group screwed pakistan over just to please Iran---.

Youngman---they gave it to us all on a platter---it is we who rejected it---.

Sir i agree that this is the opportunity but we have to be careful ... this could be a big trap as well ... middle east is bojnd to burn ... if not today then within a decade ... the way iran and ksa are behaving they will eventually burn each other to ashes ... we should provide them all the training and equipments but actively engaging in middle east confress can be suicidal ...

This is opinion ... could be right or wrong as no one knows the future ... we have to play our cards very carefully ... while engaging in gcc security matters but to keep ourselves out of reginal conflict will require alot of efforts ...

Presence of Pakistan should act as detterrent of war but the moment things gets out of our control we should have an exit strategy as well
 
Some insider news,

The JF-17 Block-3 is set to make a flight in August 2019 possibly on Pakistan independence Day.
The J-10C is without a doubt a very hi-tech platform and was the highlight of the exercise. But what is more intriguing is the fact that the Chinese had brought a PL-10 on the J-10C as well. Among the most lethal AAM of its class and if mated with the helmet on Block-3 JF it will wreak havoc . The folks also checked out its Eletro-Optical and IR sensor which again is being considered to be incorporated in Block-3. If both these add-ons are incorporated in Block-3 then any enemy edge is significantly blunted.
Block-3 will play a major role in a deal with Jordan and other Arab countries are waiting anxiously.
PAA is acquiring 60 ATAK gunships in two batches of 30.
but how do u know?
 
Sir i agree that this is the opportunity but we have to be careful ... this could be a big trap as well ... middle east is bojnd to burn ... if not today then within a decade ... the way iran and ksa are behaving they will eventually burn each other to ashes ... we should provide them all the training and equipments but actively engaging in middle east confress can be suicidal ...

This is opinion ... could be right or wrong as no one knows the future ... we have to play our cards very carefully ... while engaging in gcc security matters but to keep ourselves out of reginal conflict will require alot of efforts ...

Presence of Pakistan should act as detterrent of war but the moment things gets out of our control we should have an exit strategy as well

Hi,

Fruit is on the branch and not the tree trunk---.

Tree trunk is a safe place to hold---the branch---.

Britain did not build its fortunes by playing safe---.

And neither did the muslims---who build empire from the west to the east---.

Fortunes of nations are not built on playing safe---.
 
Hi,

Fruit is on the branch and not the tree trunk---.

Tree trunk is a safe place to hold---the branch---.

Britain did not build its fortunes by playing safe---.

And neither did the muslims---who build empire from the west to the east---.

Fortunes of nations are not built on playing safe---.
Agree i am not in favor of not taking any risk but calculated risk ... where we have success stories of taking risks but we have terrible failure stories as well ...

Again its a matter of opinion ... i forsee that nobody can stop middle east from destruction ... this is bound to happen but i could be wrong ...

If we can save them then we can get a huge fortune in return but i thinm middle east is beyond savings now ...

Lets agree to disagree ...
 
Isn't the Mirage expected to be retired over the next few years?
ROSE mirages are like Indian Jaguars..they will stay till 2025 or till 2030 if no replacement is found for strategic nuclear role ..
next in line are non upgraded older mirage5 and than f7PG followed by ROSE Mirages
F7p are all retired
 
ROSE mirages are like Indian Jaguars..they will stay till 2025 or till 2030 if no replacement is found for strategic nuclear role ..
next in line are non upgraded older mirage5 and than f7PG followed by ROSE Mirages
F7p are all retired
In another thread on PDF, I came across...supposedly the PAF and the Chinese are trying to convince the Pak government to go for J10. Depending on the financial situation, J10 can serve as a replacement for the Mirages...I don't think the Chinese would put any restrictions on it being used for strategic nuclear role.
CH-7 interest and PAK Military updates
 
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In another thread on PDF, I came across...supposedly the PAF and the Chinese are trying to convince the Pak government to go for J10. Depending on the financial situations, J10 can serve as a replacement for the Mirages...I don't think the Chinese would put any restrictions on it being used for strategic nuclear role.
CH-7 interest and PAK Military updates

New airframes are surely better than old ones.

Even if it only means ease of maintanance.

Of course the J-10 in all probability confer alot more advantages than that.

I don't see why PAF just doesn't bite the bullet and build a J-10 fleet to outright replace the nearly half a century old Mirages.
 
New airframes are surely better than old ones.

Even if it only means ease of maintanance.

Of course the J-10 in all probability confer alot more advantages than that.

I don't see why PAF just doesn't bite the bullet and build a J-10 fleet to outright replace the nearly half a century old Mirages.
It would certainly rid PAF of the nightmare of maintaining various different assortment of Mirage fighters(Mirage 3s, 5s, ROSE and non ROSE).

However after decades of mismanagement by one government after another, ballooning debt(bcuz of mismanagement/corruption), fast depleting reserves(bcuz of massive debt), declining exports(again mismanagement which caused things like chronic power shortages), and a net trade deficit(more imports than exports) has brought Pak to a belt tightening situation. All of that in addition to a WoT that's been going on for almost two decades now...which is a big strain as well. So Pak has to be very careful about priorities rn. An honest cost analysis should be done of maintaining the old/mix of Mirage fleet compared to acquiring just as many J10Cs. The decision should be based on that and the funds available.
 
ROSE mirages are like Indian Jaguars..they will stay till 2025 or till 2030 if no replacement is found for strategic nuclear role ..
next in line are non upgraded older mirage5 and than f7PG followed by ROSE Mirages
F7p are all retired

I suppose the JF-17 Block 3 will be available in enough numbers to replace the Mirages now.
 

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