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Japan's Growing Naval Power: Japan building more Atago Class GM Destroyers

Their ASW capability was provided by the US.

Without the US support, their ASW capability is practically null.

BTW, do you truly think that the JMSDF alone can fight PLAN or Russian navy without the US support?

My friend, I believe you need to some research in regards to technology transfers and reverse engineering processes. Surely, China's own defense industry was greatly aided by Russian and (American) technology through certain -- procurement processes.

As for ASW:

Kawasaki XP-1 Maritime Patrol Aircraft - Naval Technology
 
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Whether you like it or not, the Americans serve a purpose of stabilizing the region. For the time being, their presence aligns with our interests.

Stabilizing force, so without America, Asia would be back into war? I never got that. Americans weren't the ones that stopped us from going into war, we are.

That's when we perfected the art of strongly worded letters. Let ISIS do something stupid and see those letters flying their way.
 
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My friend, I believe you need to some research in regards to technology transfers and reverse engineering processes. Surely, China's own defense industry was greatly aided by Russian and (American) technology through certain -- procurement processes.

As for ASW:

Kawasaki XP-1 Maritime Patrol Aircraft - Naval Technology

China has borrowed some Russian technologies in the early years, but later we have fully absorbed it.

Unlike Japan, Russia does not control China's inventory, unlike the US has done to Japan.

The Kongo/Atago is basically an Arleigh Burke clone with full of American technologies, while China's Type 052C/D is fully indigenous.

Do you see the difference here? China is not a P5 nation for nothing.
 
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Well, the air superiority of the aircraft carrier or the destroyer/nuclear sub to equip with the lethal anti-ship missiles are the real offensive naval capability.

What you read is limited, lol. You think we reveal even 20% of what we have in our inventory ?

As for hypersonic missiles, we already arm our fighters with the XASM-3, hypersonic anti-ship missile, travels at over mach 3. These babies can take out any carriers, destroyers, frigates, cruisers that comes...too close. Heck, we easily develop technology to have these launched from ship base systems. lol.




xasm-3[1].jpg



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China has borrowed some Russian technologies in the early years, but later we have fully absorbed it.

Unlike Japan, Russia does not control China's inventory, unlike the US has done to Japan.

The Kongo and Atago is basically an Arleigh Burke clone with full of American technologies, while China's Type 052C/D is fully indigenous.

Do you see the difference here? China is not a P5 nation for nothing.

Dude, have you taken any mechanical engineering courses at all? There is no such thing as indigenous development , any national defense technology is constitutive of adopting an already developed idea and technology. Why, even the Chinese "AEGIS" destroyers, draws inspiration on the AEGIS systems developed by the United States.

Our BMDs draws inspiration from the AB class , as do the ROKN's own Sejong the Great class and Yi Sun-sin class are based on this AEGIS platform. However, we have modernized it, modified it to our individual designs.

Comprende, amigo?
 
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My friend, I believe you need to some research in regards to technology transfers and reverse engineering processes. Surely, China's own defense industry was greatly aided by Russian and (American) technology through certain -- procurement processes.

As for ASW:

Kawasaki XP-1 Maritime Patrol Aircraft - Naval Technology

Chinese advanced technology especially their Air and Naval technology system largely came from French and German companies, just look at their inventory some missile resembles of Exocet, their helicopter fleet is indeed a licensed version of Dauphin and Panther and Frelon too, their modern AA gun is licensed build of 35 mm Oerlikon Skyguard, their gas and diesel powered turbine engine for their ships either came from MTU germany or Ukraine, they even licensed some Thompson and advanced Thales build system. They still need advanced technologies from Western European nations to modernize their weapon platform. Heck even they still importing machine from Russia and Ukraine for their fighter and Airlift aircraft. Japan surely has the upper hand when it came to heavy industries and advancement engineering technologies when compared to China.
 
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Chinese advanced technology especially their Air and Naval technology system largely came from French and German companies, just look at their inventory some missile resembles of Exocet, their helicopter fleet is indeed a licensed version of Dauphin and Panther and Frelon too, their modern AA gun is licensed build of 35 mm Oerlikon Skyguard, their gas and diesel powered turbine engine for their ships either came from MTU germany or Ukraine, they even licensed some Thompson and advanced Thales build system. They still need advanced technologies from Western European nations to modernize their weapon platform. Heck even they still importing machine from Russia and Ukraine for their fighter and Airlift aircraft. Japan surely has the upper hand when it came to heavy industries and advancement engineering technologies when compared to China.

Precisely said. The lecture that @ChineseTiger1986 is trying to give about Japanese military dependency is silly. Since the PLAN is , in itself, heavily influenced by foreign technology and of course through nefarious means of technology acquisition ergo, violation of IP rights and through , ehem, cyber-security infarction. Let's not be too politically correct in stating the reality.
 
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Chinese advanced technology especially their Air and Naval technology system largely came from French and German companies, just look at their inventory some missile resembles of Exocet, their helicopter fleet is indeed a licensed version of Dauphin and Panther and Frelon too, their modern AA gun is licensed build of 35 mm Oerlikon Skyguard, their gas and diesel powered turbine engine for their ships either came from MTU germany or Ukraine, they even licensed some Thompson and advanced Thales build system. They still need advanced technologies from Western European nations to modernize their weapon platform. Heck even they still importing machine from Russia and Ukraine for their fighter and Airlift aircraft. Japan surely has the upper hand when it came to heavy industries and advancement engineering technologies when compared to China.

Japan manufacturing sites not only locate in Japan land.
MHI.png
 
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Stabilizing force, so without America, Asia would be back into war? I never got that. Americans weren't the ones that stopped us from going into war, we are.

That's when we perfected the art of strongly worded letters. Let ISIS do something stupid and see those letters flying their way.

They have a stabilizing effect, for the time being. Their presence negates the necessity of Japan completely remilitarizing to be able to engage and cover any threats from any power. Quite frankly, Japan's defense doctrine is quite weak -- compared to what it should and could be. If the United States were to leave, hypothetically, then this would necessitate Japan to raise defense spending level to 3% of our GDP. That's around $150 Billion per annum. This would also necessitate Japan to develop --- her own nuclear capabilities (and, yes we do have the ability to do so currently, just that we don't need to with Sammy close by, lol)

;)
 
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Chinese advanced technology especially their Air and Naval technology system largely came from French and German companies, just look at their inventory some missile resembles of Exocet,

Really, what about the new missiles specially made for J-20 and J-31? Also imported from French and German companies that have no equivalent?

As to anti ship missiles, all PLAN missiles have been standardized to be able to fire from any canister, so unless we have taken every missile available to them, and no available to them, then I don't know where this comes from.

their helicopter fleet is indeed a licensed version of Dauphin and Panther and Frelon too,
Helicopters, yes that needs work, but at this point only the exterior resembles the first licensed production ones, they have been completely upgraded to modern standard, for example the Z-18, a licensed production of the French Dauphin, has now the capability of reaching 9000m, something the Dauphin cannot do.

their modern AA gun is licensed build of 35 mm Oerlikon Skyguard,

AA guns, you mean the ones used by our reserves? Don't know, probably Russian.

their gas and diesel powered turbine engine for their ships either came from MTU germany or Ukraine, they even licensed some Thompson and advanced Thales build system.

So the engineer lied when he said since Type 52D, all turbines are home made, and also that no imported turbine can power 12,000 ton destroyer?

They still need advanced technologies from Western European nations to modernize their weapon platform. Heck even they still importing machine from Russia and Ukraine for their fighter and Airlift aircraft.

You mean engines? Sure that's a weak spot, but the J-20s are being tested with domestic, though not the final production versions of the engine, just heavily modified 4th gen engines.

As to everything else, what else are we importing?

Japan surely has the upper hand when it came to heavy industries and advancement engineering technologies when compared to China.

In a lot of fields sure, but you need better examples. This is a defense forum with a Chinese presence, it's not a "secret."


They have a stabilizing effect, for the time being. Their presence negates the necessity of Japan completely remilitarizing to be able to engage and cover any threats from any power. Quite frankly, Japan's defense doctrine is quite weak -- compared to what it should and could be. If the United States were to leave, hypothetically, then this would necessitate Japan to raise defense spending level to 3% of our GDP. That's around $150 Billion per annum. This would also necessitate Japan to develop --- her own nuclear capabilities (and, yes we do have the ability to do so currently, just that we don't need to with Sammy close by, lol)

;)

On defense spending, first you do realize China is twice the size of Japan's economy and is increasing by the year, so any discussion on POTENTIAL spending is never going to faze us.

Second, yea, Japan can develop nukes, even North Koreans can, and if history is to be believed, probably could have during WW2.

But if that were the case, and we were really at each other's throats, we would simply try to one up each other, and based on cold war experience the one with more cash usually wins, or always wins, and wouldn't you know it, is us.



I forget what was this thread about? How the hell did we get here.
 
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I forget what was this thread about? How the hell did we get here.

In the spirit of East Asian rivalry, we ended up doing a d!ck measuring contest. I say let's zip it back in , and get back to the subject.

LOL.
 
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Dude, have you taken any mechanical engineering courses at all? There is no such thing as indigenous development , any national defense technology is constitutive of adopting an already developed idea and technology. Why, even the Chinese "AEGIS" destroyers, draws inspiration on the AEGIS systems developed by the United States.

Our BMDs draws inspiration from the AB class , as do the ROKN's own Sejong the Great class and Yi Sun-sin class are based on this AEGIS platform. However, we have modernized it, modified it to our individual designs.

Comprende, amigo?

We had been inspired by the US Aegis.

However, Japan is totally dependent on the US technology.

The things like SPY-1D, MK41, LM2500 are definitely the US technologies, while China doesn't need any foreign technology to build its own navy.
 
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In the spirit of East Asian rivalry, we ended up doing a d!ck measuring contest. I say let's zip it back in , and get back to the subject.

LOL.

This is a defense, men fight, that's why we make weapons, and that's why this is a defense forum and not a cake making forum, though to be honest I'll own you all in that.

So I say we dive right back, and continue, but I got to go troll on some Indonesia fishing boat thread first, I'll be back.

Edit: I forgot Indonesia was blowing up fishing boats, I mean their navy, just so there is no confusion.
 
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