Jamaat terms Hakeemullah a ‘martyr’

[Jazzbot]

@Secur - You are Junior TT Vice Chairman, so I'm sure that you are definitely batter than that. Either you are not upto date or you are just ill informed about PTI's stance, no offense intended friend.

I posted a video in reply to your previous post, and I'm posting it here again. Watch it, and then I will reply to whatever you said regarding PTI:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10202221242434696

-------------------------

Basically you are talking about 2 different things, so for the sake of arguments, let me split your post into two:


First of all, PTI hasn't called anyone from TTP a martyr. Prove me wrong with a news source or something substantial. If anyone else did this, then you cannot pinch its blame on PTI just because they are political allies in a provincial govt, in which PTI holds more than 85% authority. Either prove me wrong on this, or stop repeating it again and again..

Secondly:

Well mate doesn't appear like that seeing how you support it all - the process inspite of Taliban carrying out acts of terrorism even after you decided to negotiate . What does it tell you ? Is bending over backwards to these animals and wanting the talks to succeed "at all costs" any use? Why am i seeing this apologetic and extremely cautious attitude ? Why hasn't the PTI condemned this statement yet? This terming of 64000 terrorist as a martyr is a slap on the face of nation .

As of now, only a decision was made to start peace talks with TTP, no ceasefire agreement was reached. So TTP killed army personnel and did blasts, and similarly PA took actions against them wherever possible and killed them. What's the big deal about it?

About condemning this "martyr statement", I'm with you, PTI should have condemned this statement loud and clear to avoid such false propaganda against PTI..

Yeah and we all saw how terrorists were kept at bay during that time , their propaganda wasn't allowed to flourish like today and how they weren't making a mockery of the state by their ridiculous demands like now !

Swat peace agreement is not a perfect example, because it was a provincial govt who did that agreement with TTP and they didn't had any solid support from rest of the political leadership. It wasn't even an agreement, ANP just surrendered to TTP in Swat to save their own sorry arses because they were too incompetent to deal with this issue at that time. This is why army finally intervene and took control of Swat, and kept it under army control till new govt came into power. There was a solid reason why army was reluctant to hand over Swat to incompetent ANP provincial govt.

The Swat,Buner,Lower Dir,Bajaur,Khyber Agency,Mohmand,Orakzai and Kurram agency were cleared and the terrorists were confined to two Wairistan , learn something about our successes too instead of " we are all gonna die and are helpless " stance . Yes you will have to fight them sooner or later , the terrorists have signed and broken many peace deals till today , all they want is their enforcement of twisted interpretation of Sharia throughout Pakistan , a new constitution , maybe even a flag and what not . They will not stop or honor any deal unless you agree to this. Fighting them has become a necessity . Lets see when the nation wakes up to that fact .

We have been fighting with them since past 9 years and they have grown stronger, forget about eliminating them in 9 long years. From their perspective, they are doing Jihad against Pak Army as they consider us US ally. So, you kill one and he will be replaced with 10 new ones because there is no shortage of idiots in our country who wanna die in Jihad without thinking about it for even once. IK is the only leader we have, who is being vocal about removing this narrative of Jihad by dis-engaging from US WoT and then fight with them on our own. The day we'll take firm stance against drone strikes, things will start to change. Even recent statement from TTP after Hakimullah's killing was something like: "Revenge will be taken from US puppets and its allies"...

 

[Hyde]

JI should be termed Terrorist organisation and banned for any movement for terming the terrorist and disloyal people of Pakistan as Shaheed

 

[Secur]

@Jazzbot

None taken , you see I never said that anyone from PTI or Imran Khan himself has called this terrorist a " martyr " , that credit remains with your ally for now . I was just talking about the tone of the statements and attitudes coming from the political leadership - specially the two biggest parties in the Govt which is saddening and heart breaking and extremely worrying . I have been talking about the apologetic and cautiousness being shown by the political leadership and the desire to make the talks succeed " at all costs " which believe me , can get more dangerous than you can imagine . Now , that is general . Did you see the media and all the leaders which portrayed the nation as if in mourning , grief stricken and sad ? You may not have seen but your leaders aren't even ready to condemn the recent statement by your ally , they aren't ready to call the terrorists as such and worse of all , they are justifying the actions of Taliban * Read IK's Taliban didn't take responsibility of some blasts * , what should I gather from it ?

As of now , all military operations have been suspended whilst the terrorists are acting with impunity , doing whatever they want . The Pakistan Army isn't carrying out any operation against Taliban as of now . So , what should I call this " one sided romance " ? I know the TTP uses this pretext of " no ceasefire has been announced yet " but why do not our political leadership use the same and ask the military to soften the terrorist outfit before deciding to talk with it ? Taliban would be more willing to listen then . Thanks for admitting that " not condemning " the " martyr " statement which is nothing short of a slap on the whole nation and stomping on the graves of our martyrs is wrong .

Swat peace deal is a perfect example , mate , yes the provincial Govt signed the deal with Taliban because they weren't able to deal with it , that is a fact , but does the provincial Govt not have enough authority to do so , even worse the deal was later ratified by the Central Govt . Yes , it was an agreement between the state and the terrorist outfil , please do not try to neglect " facts " here . What happens afterwards ? Do the terrorists honor the deal ? No they do not . A few days later , they capture Buner , Shangla and Lower Dir , kill a few soldiers and the army has to go in , to finish the job . Today , you can see the terrorism and terrorist free Swat , isn't it ? Wouldn't you call it a success instead of imposing a barbaric ideology over our people ? The Swat deal isn't the first that the terrorist have signed and broken , a couple others had been signed in tribal areas too - research a little about it .

I am not denying the presence of " radicalized masses " in the country ready to fight against their own because of a twisted interpretation of Islam brought during the so called " Afghan Jihad " . They haven't grown stronger , they just have no shortage of brainwashed Madarsa kids , it seems . Otherwise , how much area do they even control , just the tribal areas , right ? Even there , besides Waziristans , they are kept at bay . The terrorists will always opt for " hit and run " strategy since they cant fight the Pakistani war machine . The question is " What are you aiming for , with the terrorists ? " . Do you expect to find a common ground since well they do not even accept our constitution ? Even if you fail , there is little hope that radicals will listen to your stance of " terrorists broke the deal again " , you saw the reaction after Red Mosque Siege , you saw what happened there too . All this will again be blamed on you , the extremist propaganda is powerful and influential . The Americans are leaving soon and with them , the drone strikes will most probably end and the extremists will not be able to provide the justification of " infidel army " siding with U.S. Lets see what you can get by " talks with these people " , time will tell , though if the past is any indication , it doesn't look good .

 

[rockstar08]

 

[JanjaWeed]

I seldom hear them condemning any terror attacks in Pakistan perpetrated by TTP... but are quick to term a dead terrorist as martyr. Oh well.. just goes to show where do their loyalties really lie.

 

[Malang Badshah]

Personally I also feel that at this time Mehsud was ready for negotiations ....... 


You are only one who was rejoicing on those incidents in whole Islamic world ... Don't you see even on PDF almost all Pakistanis are condemning to this mad leader of JI ... I think you are just trying to troll this thread ...........

Brother the problem with most of the people (though not all) on this forum is that this PDF forum is being dominated by the people who adhere to the ideology called nationalism. As per this ideology no matter how much unjust or unfair your country is, no matter how much injustice your country does the nationalist never ever accepts the wrongdoing of his country. He always support his country no matter what and in this support he becomes totally blind to the truth.

Similarly the nationalists here are not willing to accept any wrongdoing or injustice or zulm on the part of the Pakistani state because they have been blinded by the unislamic and prejudiced ideology of nationalism.

Let me give you an example. If these nationalists are asked as to who is more worthy of being the leader of Muslims between Mulla Omar and Jinnah I can assure you that these nationalists will all vouch for Jinnah to be more worthy of leadership even though all of us know that Jinnah was an irreligious man and as per shariah he would qualify as a fasiq ie open sinner while Mulla Omar is a great mujahid, an alim, extremely pious man in short he can be called a Wali Allah but these nationalists will prefer Jinnah more worthy of leadership just because of the biased and prejudiced ideology of nationalism. Had these nationalists believed in the Islamic ideology they would never ever prefer Jinnah as a leader over a true Muslim and mujahid like Mulla Omar.

This is the reason why nationalism has been condemned in Islam because it gives preference to the so-called nation state and fellow countrymen over Islam and Muslim Ummah.

 

[Star Wars]

Brother the problem with most of the people (though not all) on this forum is that this PDF forum is being dominated by the people who adhere to the ideology called nationalism. As per this ideology no matter how much unjust or unfair your country is, no matter how much injustice your country does the nationalist never ever accepts the wrongdoing of his country. He always support his country no matter what and in this support he becomes totally blind to the truth.

Similarly the nationalists here are not willing to accept any wrongdoing or injustice or zulm on the part of the Pakistani state because they have been blinded by the unislamic and prejudiced ideology of nationalism.

Let me give you an example. If these nationalists are asked as to who is more worthy of being the leader of Muslims between Mulla Omar and Jinnah I can assure you that these nationalists will all vouch for Jinnah to be more worthy of leadership even though all of us know that Jinnah was an irreligious man and as per shariah he would qualify as a fasiq ie open sinner while Mulla Omar is a great mujahid, an alim, extremely pious man in short he can be called a Wali Allah but these nationalists will prefer Jinnah more worthy of leadership just because of the biased and prejudiced ideology of nationalism. Had these nationalists believed in the Islamic ideology they would never ever prefer Jinnah as a leader over a true Muslim and mujahid like Mulla Omar.

This is the reason why nationalism has been condemned in Islam because it gives preference to the so-called nation state and fellow countrymen over Islam and Muslim Ummah.

And just like nationalism there is something called religious extremism where you support one group and their wrong doings no matter how many children they shoot, girls schools they blow, women they kill ... the entire stupidity of sitting inside a tiny box called religion and making an outcast of every god damn person on this planet just because he was born to a different place and religion and believes ion a different ideology just amazes me... how the hell can you call some moron like Mullah omar who has blood in his hands to actually be pious righteous angel from heaven ? now are you going to look at my argument alone or are you going to look at the argument in terms of me being a Hindu ?

Its interesting how people like you blatently ignore posts where they ask you,...

WHAT JUSTIFICATION TO YOU GIVE FOR KILLING WOMEN AND CHILDREN ???

 

[Malang Badshah]

The Taliban never kill innocent women and children. Its all the dirty work of satanic intelligence networks like
CIA / Blackwater contract killers etc.

 

[Zabaniyah]

Its all the dirty work of satanic intelligence networks like
CIA / Blackwater contract killers etc.

If they truly wanted to, they can kill all Afghans.

Let me ask you something: What kind of future do you want for your country? Honestly.

 

[Informant]

The Taliban never kill innocent women and children. Its all the dirty work of satanic intelligence networks like
CIA / Blackwater contract killers etc.

How about they openly admitting to bomb blasts in mosques and markets. Is it CIA when the Taliban openly accept bomb attacks. Fucking munafiq.

 

[Malang Badshah]

How about they openly admitting to bomb blasts in mosques and markets. Is it CIA when the Taliban openly accept bomb attacks. Fucking munafiq.

Show me their statements where they have owned it. Don't do this hawai fires without any evidence to back it up.

 

[Dillinger]

Brother the problem with most of the people (though not all) on this forum is that this PDF forum is being dominated by the people who adhere to the ideology called nationalism. As per this ideology no matter how much unjust or unfair your country is, no matter how much injustice your country does the nationalist never ever accepts the wrongdoing of his country. He always support his country no matter what and in this support he becomes totally blind to the truth.

Similarly the nationalists here are not willing to accept any wrongdoing or injustice or zulm on the part of the Pakistani state because they have been blinded by the unislamic and prejudiced ideology of nationalism.

Let me give you an example. If these nationalists are asked as to who is more worthy of being the leader of Muslims between Mulla Omar and Jinnah I can assure you that these nationalists will all vouch for Jinnah to be more worthy of leadership even though all of us know that Jinnah was an irreligious man and as per shariah he would qualify as a fasiq ie open sinner while Mulla Omar is a great mujahid, an alim, extremely pious man in short he can be called a Wali Allah but these nationalists will prefer Jinnah more worthy of leadership just because of the biased and prejudiced ideology of nationalism. Had these nationalists believed in the Islamic ideology they would never ever prefer Jinnah as a leader over a true Muslim and mujahid like Mulla Omar.

This is the reason why nationalism has been condemned in Islam because it gives preference to the so-called nation state and fellow countrymen over Islam and Muslim Ummah.

@Armstrong @Secur @Aeronaut Got to love this guy, so yaaron what do you think of our own Madaani? He'd be a nice fit for Pakistan- he's VERY pious.

 

[Aamna14]

This is called as silent majority, who silently supports this. Not even the victims have protested. 

The whole islamic world was rejoicing over 9/11, 26/11. They were mourning for Osama Bin Laden and Kassab, Dr. Afia. Isn't this enough proof that terrorists come from a particular background?

Call you're biased views just that, views don't twist them into facts. Secondly you might have not seen or deliberately attempted to not notice but i commented on the fact that the likes of him can never be martyrs. And the majority even on the forum are saying this i don't know why you keep using this "the majority is always silent" slogan to prove how you are the only peace loving person that exists on planet earth and therefore stand on a higher moral ground.

 

[Informant]

Show me their statements where they have owned it. Don't do this hawai fires without any evidence to back it up.

http://tribune.com.pk/story/487447/walking-through-terror-and-tragedy-in-lahore/

Read it and weep.

Choke on this too

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tehrik-i-Taliban_Pakistan#Claimed_and_alleged_attacks

 

[Malang Badshah]

I didn't asked for news clippings. I asked you to show me the official statements of the Taliban where they have accepted the responsibility for attacks in the markets and on common people but instead you brought this Jewish affiliated newspaper clippings for me. Nonsense.