Interesting political poll

[krash]

Na yaar Gujranwala has a lot of Sheikhs who are Kashmiri origin claiming faland dimkan was from different regions of Kashmir. I mean its right next to Sialkot which has a historical connection with Kashmir

Thanks, never knew that. Makes sense too.

Btw nice explanation and sorry for going offtopic again

Haha, we are both guilty.

 

[litman]

the incoming budget will decide the fate of pti government.most likely the budget will be disastrous for lower and lower middle class people. the opposition will make full use of it for their own vested interests. with foreign support they will try to mobilize the masses against the government and to create chaos in the country and to further cripple the economy. pak is about to become next venezuela . the only difference is that in pak military is united behind the government unlike venezuela. pti has failed and with few exceptions most of the team players are incompetent including the team leader. extremely tough times ahead for pakistan.
now i have no doubt that 92 cup was just a fluke just like ct 17. IK is stubborn, impulsive with dreams but have no plans how to realize the dreams.

 

[Crusher]

Haha, we are both guilty.

Most of the kashmiris who moved to punjab in dogra times were "kammis" or "weavers" of kashmir who moved outside of Kashmir and became whatever they wanted to become, the only non-kammi non-weaver kashmiri migrants that moved to punjab were peasant agriculturists from the villages of kashmir valley and they were not much in numbers compared to kammis/weaver kashmiris. Kashmir valley has always been 85% rural and in rural villages of kashmir there were only two classes of people farmers/agriculturists which are called in kashmiri language as "Greest" for plural and "Greesay" for singular, the non-agriculturist kammis/menials which are callled "Naangaar". Kashmiri Greest castes/krams are mainly Lone, Dar, many Batt/Butt (not all), Mir, Malik, Rather, Ganai/Kanai, Tantray, Magray, Baba, War, Trag etc. People have just really created a "hype" around kashmiri ancestry in punjab when there is nothing special about it. The most prestigious kashmiri Greest clans are Mir and Malik as they are descendants of Kashmiri military commanders and noble men of past kashmiri muslim kingdoms, but after the fall of Kashmir muslim kingdoms most of them just degraded to Greest/cultivator status.

@Zibago , @krash
For more information ask this Kashmiri Greest/Gresay Lone guy from rural areas of Kashmir valley on twitter he exposes his own "kashmiri society" in various articles and his tweets, he will answer you about the "validity" of your claims,

https://twitter.com/aleemudasir

The top tweet on his profile is about his articles that he published in his blogpost about "casteism" in kashmir valley and how it works there.
Casteism in Kashmir: My observations and experiences
Casteism in Kashmir: My observations and experiences (Part 2)

The famed Srinagar city is the most mixed up city and "kashmiris" living there are mix of indigenous kashmiri Greest/Nangar and various iranian, middle eastern and central asian migrant muslims. The above articles written by a peasant/Greest Kashmiri guy prove that Kashmiri valley rural society is nothing but a mirror image of rural society of neighboring Punjab across the pir panjal range. Not a surprise that majority of kashmiris who fled from kashmir valley settled in the villages of central punjab as the mindset and social rules (even the slurs) in rural punjabi society were no different than back home in the villages of kashmir valley.

 

[Zibago]

the incoming budget will decide the fate of pti government.most likely the budget will be disastrous for lower and lower middle class people. the opposition will make full use of it for their own vested interests. with foreign support they will try to mobilize the masses against the government and to create chaos in the country and to further cripple the economy. pak is about to become next venezuela . the only difference is that in pak military is united behind the government unlike venezuela. pti has failed and with few exceptions most of the team players are incompetent including the team leader. extremely tough times ahead for pakistan.
now i have no doubt that 92 cup was just a fluke just like ct 17. IK is stubborn, impulsive with dreams but have no plans how to realize the dreams.

One budhet isnt enough to run a government down buddy
As long as pti keeps its hold on the under 30 demographic its is a safe spot

 

[Kabira]

Most of the kashmiris who moved to punjab in dogra times were "kammis" or "weavers" of kashmir who moved outside of Kashmir and became whatever they wanted to become, the only non-kammi non-weaver kashmiri migrants that moved to punjab were peasant agriculturists from the villages of kashmir valley and they were not much in numbers compared to kammis/weaver kashmiris. Kashmir valley has always been 85% rural and in rural villages of kashmir there were only two classes of people farmers/agriculturists which are called in kashmiri language as "Greest" for plural and "Greesay" for singular, the non-agriculturist kammis/menials which are callled "Naangaar". Kashmiri Greest castes/krams are mainly Lone, Dar, Mir, Malik, Rather, Ganai/Kanai, Tantray, Magray, Baba, War, Trag etc. People have just really created a "hype" around kashmiri ancestry in punjab when there is nothing special about it.

@Zibago , @krash
For more information ask this Kashmiri Greest/Gresay Lone guy from rural areas of Kashmir valley on twitter he exposes his own "kashmiri society" in various articles, he will answer you about the "validity" of your claims,

https://twitter.com/aleemudasir

The top tweet on his profile is about his articles that he published in his blogpost about "casteism" in kashmir valley and how it works there.
Casteism in Kashmir: My observations and experiences
Casteism in Kashmir: My observations and experiences (Part 2)

The famed Srinagar city is the most mixed up city and "kashmiris" living there are mix of indigenous kashmiri Greest/Nangar and various iranian, middle eastern and central asian migrant muslims. The above articles written by a peasant/Greest Kashmiri guy prove that Kashmiri valley rural society is nothing but a mirror image of rural society of neighboring Punjab across the pir panjal range. Not a surprise that majority of kashmiris who fled from kashmir valley settled in the villages of central punjab as the mindset and social rules (even the slurs) in rural punjabi society were no different than back home in the villages of kashmir valley.

Very interesting blog posts and it exposes zobago and krash internet knowledge about Kashmiris lol

So it seem like sheikh was adopted by equivalent of kammi community in Kashmir. Actually more like equivalent of mussalis in Punjab.

 

[Musafir117]

So according to survey
30% are yuthias
And remain 70% are Patwari Traitors donkey etc.
@Zibago

 

[Zibago]

So according to survey
30% are yuthias
And remain 70% are Patwari Traitors donkey etc.
@Zibago

Pop under the hood buddy look at the figure for young people and graduates
Future doesnot look so bad after all

 

[Musafir117]

Pop under the hood buddy look at the figure for young people and graduates
Future doesnot look so bad after all

That’s what am saying the 30% are youth ias

 

[SIPRA]

That’s what am saying the 30% are youth ias

30% are Youthias.
70% are Chutiyas.

How is the above verse?

 

[Musafir117]

30% are Youthias.
70% are Chutiyas.

How is the above verse?

Correct
Add on
70% are Patwari Traitors Doneky and what you said

 

[Crusher]

Very interesting blog posts and it exposes zobago and krash internet knowledge about Kashmiris lol

So it seem like sheikh was adopted by equivalent of kammi community in Kashmir. Actually more like equivalent of mussalis in Punjab.

No "Sheikh" has different meaning in different parts of Kashmir, in Srinagar and other bigger cities of Kashmir valley it is indeed associated with business class people just like in Punjab cities. But in villages it is associated with what you call musalli in punjab. In fact even in punjab also in many village areas musalli are called "muslim sheikh". The kammis are called "Naangar" which means "landless" or having non-agricultural social status.

You know I had been doing research about the society of Kashmir valley and its caste dynamics and always relied on british and indian brahmin sources until I found the tweet handle of this Kashmiri "Lone" guy who has some special grudge againt Brahmins of Kashmir as well as Syeds/Peer/Peerzada/Molvis of Kashmir which he considers the muslim equivalent of hindu Brahmins in case of Kashmir valley villages. What I noticed from his tweets and blogs is that Kashmir village society is no different than village societies of particularly multan and some areas of interior sindh where we also see the same phenomenon of Peer/Syed/Makhdoom having the top position in the society and agriculturist clans (confused jatt/rajputs) having a secondary position. In case of Kashmir valley the agriculturist clans are called "Greest" or "Gresay" depending on different areas, Kammis are called "Naangar" in kashmiri language, chura/chamar are called Watal/Watul/Batal etc. though they are also called "sheikh" and just like in case of punjab villages these Watal/sheikh used to live on the outskirts of the villages.

What I couldn't learn in last 20 years about kashmir society/castes from library books, I learnt it from just one angry guy of Greest Lone caste in just two articles . This guy often gets into fights on twitter with "pandits" and "kashmiri hindu brahmins" for trying to claim as if kashmir belongs to them when in reality it is 80% Greest/Naangar population just like in Punjab rural areas. Now I have learnt that nothing can beat first hand knowledge from the ground, one can read books or other secondary writings but first hand knowledge is always superior and to the point.

 

[Zibago]

That’s what am saying the 30% are youth ias

The under 30 are the biggest voting block the party that controls them has a high chance of getting a 2/3rd next elections

 

[SIPRA]

No "Sheikh" has different meaning in different parts of Kashmir, in Srinagar and other bigger cities of Kashmir valley it is indeed associated with business class people just like in Punjab cities.

Off topic:

I think that in another thread, which I don't recall now, I responded to your post. In that response, I said that Syed Waris Shah has not mentioned Ahmad Shah Abdali in his poetry. I made a mistake, he has in fact alluded to him. I just wanted to correct my mistake and apologize.

 

[Crusher]

Off topic:

I think that in another thread, which I don't recall now, I responded to your post. In that response, I said that Syed Waris Shah has not mentioned Ahmad Shah Abdali in his poetry. I made a mistake, he has in fact alluded to him. I just wanted to correct my mistake and apologize.

That topic is finished for me now anyway, I was just giving reality check to the OP guy on his "imaginary" internet based claims about kashmiris, I am already done with that. And yes Waris Shah was an admirer of Mughal administration of his time, he wasn't happy with weakening of mughal administration in Lahore either by sikh rebels or afghan/abdali raiders.

 

[Kabira]

No "Sheikh" has different meaning in different parts of Kashmir, in Srinagar and other bigger cities of Kashmir valley it is indeed associated with business class people just like in Punjab cities. But in villages it is associated with what you call musalli in punjab. In fact even in punjab also in many village areas musalli are called "muslim sheikh".

You know I had been doing research about the society of Kashmir valley and its caste dynamics and always relied on british and indian brahmin sources until I found the tweet handle of this Kashmiri "Lone" guy who has some special grudge againt Brahmins of Kashmir as well as Syeds/Peer/Peerzada/Molvis of Kashmir which he considers the muslim equivalent of hindu Brahmins in case of Kashmir valley villages. What I noticed from his tweets and blogs is that Kashmir village society is no different than village societies of particularly multan and some areas of interior sindh where we also see the same phenomenon of Peer/Syed/Makhdoom having the top position in the society and agriculturist clans (confused jatt/rajputs) having a secondary position. In case of Kashmir valley the agriculturist clans are called "Greest" or "Greesay" depending on different areas, Kammis are called "Naangar" in kashmiri language, chura/chamar are called Watal/Watul/Batal etc. though they are also called "sheikh" and just like in case of punjab villages these Watal/sheikh used to live on the outskirts of the villages.

What I couldn't learn in last 20 years about kashmir society/castes from library books, I learnt it from just one angry guy of Greest Lone caste in just two articles . This guy often gets into fight with "pandits" and "kashmiri hindu brahmins" for trying to claim as if kashmir belongs to them when in reality it is 80% Greest/Naangar population just like in Punjab rural areas.

Yeah this is what I was going to say that it seem like its bit more similar to south punjab but overall similarities are eye opening. It shouldnt be surprising though, expecting casteless society in this region was foolish. It just get less coverage because caste system in gangaland is much worse because there these marginalised communities like mussalis/watal are vast majority. Combined with religion that promote this.

I remember reading on internet how everyone in Kashmir is basically brahmin. Lol