Indonesia Defence Forum

[Nike]

Apparently "that guy" said that M113 of our inventory have a very bad maintenance problems to the point where they were rejected from service in the Cavalry and moved to Mechanized Infantry instead. Ofc i'm just simply quoting him and is in no capacity to confirm it.

No lah, the cavalry since beginning want to distinguish themselves with cannon armed vehicles to be added to their inventory, meanwhile M113 since the beginning is exclusive infantry rides even the procurement is being sounded from Infantry school to copes with urban warfare trends and the need of tracked type to supplement Anoa.

 

[Kansel]

Iinm Pindad is developing Tracked APC/IFV variants based from the Harimau Medium Tank.

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Looking at the ig pic above looks like it will be modular.

Thanks! It looks pretty nice for our future tracked vehicle armada

It just if we want to do something like them it will require a big massif funds, Land phase 400 from australia require funds as much as 10-15 billion US dollar as example , in which i vehemently against it. If we can provide such funds much better to allocated such big budget for Airforce and Navy to acquire more fighter and warships in regard for our country geography as Archipelagic country . To me the Army is should be contend with second tier armaments (like Caesar, M109,M113,Leopard 2, Astros, Anoa, Pandur and such) but do that in massive number to compensate the quality and maintaining the edge with their quality tactical and strategic weapons such as land based cruise missiles, land based AAM system, attack helicopter and assault helicopter .

Spitting straight facts right here, thanks for the correction about my opinion,about anoa sebenernya lagi produksi atau gak sih? Atau produksi nya sistem nya kayak what US did with their abrams? 2-3 tanks per month?

 

[Nike]

Thanks! It looks pretty nice for our future tracked vehicle armada


Spitting straight facts right here, thanks for the correction about my opinion,about anoa sebenernya lagi produksi atau gak sih? Atau produksi nya sistem nya kayak what US did with their abrams? 2-3 tanks per month?

Anoa order is always there from Army every years, its only they ordered in small number like 15/20/40 vehicles each year. The reason is quite obvious they do that to support PT PINDAD production line by continuous order and nurtured the supplier of spare parts of PT PINDAD without harming the army budget itself.

 

[NEKONEKO]

South Korean DSME designing DSME 2000 not for their Navy who clearly had ordered kssiii made by Hyundai shipyard to replace Chang Bo go class, but for the requirement of a particular country in the South.

There is not many country in the south that have plans to acquire new submarine.

Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering (DSME) showcased a new diesel-electric attack submarine concept, DSME 2000, for the first time at the International Maritime Defense Industry Exhibition (MADEX) 2019 in Busan.

The product is targeted at the export market, particularly of Southeast Asia and South America.

The submarine has a submerged displacement of 2,180 tonnes and will likely incorporate technologies indigenously developed by Korean original equipment manufacturers that are involved in the KSS-3 programme. Preliminary design work was completed in January 2019, but the final variant can be tailored according to customer requirements.

The 71.1 m-long and 6.5 m-wide single-hulled submarine will be equipped with lithium-ion batteries and an AC propulsion motor. Its design incorporates a seven-mast configuration, including an optronic mast. The model that was showcased also features a towed array antenna in the aft section
https://www.janes.com/article/92161/madex-2019-dsme-unveils-new-submarine-design-for-export-market

M113 still the best bang for bucks for any basic tracked type APC, still hoping to adding more M113 to reinforce any mechanized infantry brigade in Indonesia especially at jungle terrain like in Kalimantan and adding more ANOA to support the arrangement of Army armored wheeled vehicles.

Meanwhile our neighbor SG starting to replace their M113 with more modern and capable Hunter AFV.

 

[Nike]

There is not many country in the south that have plans to acquire new submarine.

Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering (DSME) showcased a new diesel-electric attack submarine concept, DSME 2000, for the first time at the International Maritime Defense Industry Exhibition (MADEX) 2019 in Busan.

The product is targeted at the export market, particularly of Southeast Asia and South America.

The submarine has a submerged displacement of 2,180 tonnes and will likely incorporate technologies indigenously developed by Korean original equipment manufacturers that are involved in the KSS-3 programme. Preliminary design work was completed in January 2019, but the final variant can be tailored according to customer requirements.

The 71.1 m-long and 6.5 m-wide single-hulled submarine will be equipped with lithium-ion batteries and an AC propulsion motor. Its design incorporates a seven-mast configuration, including an optronic mast. The model that was showcased also features a towed array antenna in the aft section
https://www.janes.com/article/92161/madex-2019-dsme-unveils-new-submarine-design-for-export-market


Meanwhile our neighbor SG starting to replace their M113 with more modern and capable Hunter AFV.

Not i am against such techies to be acquire but, if the cost is too great i am more willing to divert them and spend more on Navy and Air force compared to the Army. Instead i am more willing to giving the Army more edge to support the Navy and Air force by acquiring Land based cruise missiles like Brahmos, iskander or Brazillian made and Long range AAM like Patriot , IRIS T, NASAM 2 and such along with increasing their attack helicopter squadron and assault helicopter brigades. For armor and artillery , acquiring second hand M113, M 109, Leopard 2, acquire Anoa and Pandur is more reasonable and costly efficient to me as even the current infantry units many still depend on old vintage trucks for mobilization and oldies ex vietnam war era artillery like M102 to support them.

 

[NEKONEKO]

Orang kaya mereka, full digital.
Kalau kita ya yang sabar aja.

 

[Nike]

Orang kaya mereka, full digital.
Kalau kita ya yang sabar aja.

They already saturated with armor and their Navy and Air forces is already big enough to cater their needs, so they dont have problem with expansion fleets anymore. For the Army as most of their infantry units is already mechanized and well equipped with support units. It just a given if Singkies can afford expenditure to replace their M113 with Hunter.

Meanwhile for us, from 130 more infantry battalion we had, we got only aroun 10 or so units being mechanized and thats not all of them being well supported by heavy support equipment like armored cars, mortar carriage units and such. Thus Army already got plan to made at least 60 percent of infantry units battalion they had is being raider units and half of them got qualified to become either air assault battalion or mechanized infantry brigade thus the homework and expansion fleets is still become a serious issue.

New order regime is clearly made our Armed forces like a bonsai compared to their potential

 

[trishna_amṛta]

The current trend of using touchscreen in combat vehicle and naval vessel is a real worrisome trend in regard of crew effectiveness (and survivalibility) during actual real life combat

 

[Raduga]

Iinm Pindad is developing Tracked APC/IFV variants based from the Harimau Medium Tank.

View this content on Instagram

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Looking at the ig pic above looks like it will be modular.

nice to see there will be IFV and APC variants , can see the engine deck were placed in right side of frontal hull , to free some space for carrying infantry .

 

[Nike]

The current trend of using touchscreen in combat vehicle and naval vessel is a real worrisome trend in regard of crew effectiveness (and survivalibility) during actual real life combat

The interesting thing is, US, China and Russian never play around in this thinking mode as clearly they had developed Electronic disrupted weapons such as EMP weapons to render such toys useless, only newbie and nouveau rich army using such arrangement. Those old monsters only using standard display mode for their Battlefield management systems and enhance their electronic component survival

This is clear example

https://news.usni.org/2019/08/09/na...tles-after-fleet-rejects-touchscreen-controls

 

[Kansel]

Not i am against such techies to be acquire but, if the cost is too great i am more willing to divert them and spend more on Navy and Air force compared to the Army. Instead i am more willing to giving the Army more edge to support the Navy and Air force by acquiring Land based cruise missiles like Brahmos, iskander or Brazillian made and Long range AAM like Patriot , IRIS T, NASAM 2 and such along with increasing their attack helicopter squadron and assault helicopter brigades. For armor and artillery , acquiring second hand M113, M 109, Leopard 2, acquire Anoa and Pandur is more reasonable and costly efficient to me as even the current infantry units many still depend on old vintage trucks for mobilization and oldies ex vietnam war era artillery like M102 to support them.

No, i don't think acquiring brahmos is a great idea, our future potential enemy is china take a look at this screenshot

Acquiring something else is much more suggested maybe NSM coastal defense system? Also we won't get iskander if caatsta still on the field so avibras avtm-300 is what we can afford for now.

 

[NEKONEKO]

take a look at this screenshot

Yeah sure, "A1 information".

our future potential enemy is china

Gak perlu sebut merek.

Land based cruise missiles like Brahmos, iskander or Brazillian made

I am more into air launched standoff weapons (ashm/ alcm).

 

[Raduga]

well ..... all of the western made also started from unproven design too , but they risk too build it .... and improved it later .

the case was same with KCR-60 , when the first variants deemed unstable in high sea environment , and later got improved in 2nd batch

if we still insist on "unproven" and "not battletested" mindset just like what commoners philippines netizen thought , then "kemandirian industri dalam negeri" is just going to be another empty words .

 

[Nike]

Yeah sure, "A1 information".


Gak perlu sebut merek.


I am more into air launched standoff weapons (ashm/ alcm).

I am talking about Army stuff not Air force, but according to someone Indonesia is only facing caveman with rifles so there is no need for stuff like that. Only Tucano in the air, KCR in water and Bela negara trainees is enough.

 

[trishna_amṛta]

The interesting thing is, US, China and Russian never play around in this thinking mode as clearly they had developed Electronic disrupted weapons such as EMP weapons to render such toys useless, only newbie and nouveau rich army using such arrangement. Those old monsters only using standard display mode for their Battlefield management systems and enhance their electronic component survival

This is clear example

https://news.usni.org/2019/08/09/na...tles-after-fleet-rejects-touchscreen-controls

It wasn't due to EMP threat. Mission critical electronic can always be hardened against such attack albeit at the cost of weight and lower computing capability (lower spec CPU + multi layer redundancy). The main reason why I mention the hazard of using touchscreen in combat vehicle is related to "muscle memory" of the crew. When the cabin is on fire there will be thick smoke everywhere, using touchscreen the crew will not be able to see what they were pressing, while using conventional button, knob, switch the crew can "feel" the position of all those controls in the manner if your strip fielding or reassemble your firearm, and hopefully will still be able to carry out their task . Unfortunately I don't think this is something that can be trained using simulator.