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India's Naval Massive Modernization Program

If I were you, I wouldn't believe the propaganda on stealth frigates.

Frigates are very large ships. When they move, they leave a wake. This can be seen. Furthermore, large naval vessels have massive engines. They generate a lot of heat and should be easily detectable in infrared.

See You defeated your own argument! (1st page)
Even a non AESA equipped Ship Can Detect other ships from pretty good range!
IN got brahmos to finish the job
 
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At WetShirtContest, Chinese SSNs total 4.

There are two Type 093 Shang-class submarines and two Type 095s are undergoing sea trials.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_095_submarine

"The Type 095 (Chinese designation: 09-V) is a proposed class of third generation nuclear-powered attack submarines for the People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) of the People's Republic of China. Two were launched by the end of 2010 and they started their sea trials around the summer of 2011."

ME4WO.jpg

The uppermost picture is a conceptual illustration of the hydrodynamic third-generation Type 095 nuclear attack submarine. The bottom two pictures depict the next-generation Type 096 ballistic missile submarine (e.g. the successor to the Type 094 Jin-class SSBN).

poGP1.jpg

Type 093 Shang-class nuclear attack submarine (SSN)
 
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If I were you, I wouldn't believe the propaganda on stealth frigates.

Frigates are very large ships. When they move, they leave a wake. This can be seen. Furthermore, large naval vessels have massive engines. They generate a lot of heat and should be easily detectable in infrared.


Stealth Frigates and Destroyers Armed with Hypersonic and The Most Accurate Anti Ship Missiles (Brahmos 2, HSDTV, Shaurya) can Come Undetected within the Range of Most of the Warships Out There and Attack with with Hypersonic Speeds Thus Defeating the AEGIS. India Conceptualizes and Then Comes up with It's Own Solution. While Chinese Only Blindly Follow the Rest of the World and Copy them.
 
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Five indigenously-built nuclear-powered submarines - $2.9 billion.
six diesel-electric submarines - $11 billion ? :woot:

JOKING?

next antony will say as MMS is saying these days "ill quit public if found guilty" as if he is going to stay in public life after next general elections, its for sure sonia mata will kick him out as she will have to crate space for rahul baba, and on top of it MMS if ur proven guilty uill be in jail and not in public life so please dont do a favour to us saying that ill quit ..

on topic mark my words this will be the next big defence scam
 
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Chinese submarines are not noisy.

The anti-Chinese propaganda gets annoying. I will put up my post on Chinese Song submarines and I will claim near-Western performance unless you can identify a clear technical deficiency.

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Top 6 reasons why Type 039G Song-class submarine is very quiet

JFogd.jpg

"Chinese Type 039G Song-class No. 314 naval submarine docks at the Ngong Shuen Chau naval base in Hong Kong."

1. Modern teardrop hull shape

2. Engine mounted on shock absorbers

3. Anechoic tiles. "Internet-source photos of Type 039s under construction also show Chinese mastery of advanced multi-layer rubber/polymer hull coatings that greatly reduce hull-radiated noise while also limiting the effectiveness of active-sonar detection."

4. "Large asymmetrical seven-bladed skewed propeller" to reduce cavitation

5. Diesel-electric engine design "insulates the noisy diesel engines from the pressure hull, making the submarine quieter." A diesel-electric submarine can "operate virtually silently while on battery power."

6. Tight tolerances during manufacturing by using advanced Chinese 7-axis machine tools. "It probably should be noted that blade noise among Soviet/Russian submarine types dropped dramatically after Japanese electronics company Toshiba and Norwegian company Kongsberg sold advanced milling machinery and control equipment to the USSR in the mid 1980s."

References:

a. Type 039 submarine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [1,2,3]

b. International Assessment and Strategy Center > Research > Top Ten Chinese Military Modernization Developments (see section VIII) [3; second sentence]

c. Chinese Navy [3,4]

d. Supercavitating Propeller [4; reduce cavitation]

e. Submarine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [5; first sentence]

f. http://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=445936 (p. 29) [5; second sentence]

g. HarpGamer > Tactics 101: Anti-Submarine Warfare - Part 3 (see Target Identification) [6; second sentence]

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From my April 14, 2011 post:

China's CKX5680 Digitally Controlled 7-axis Contour Milling Machine

qPmQH.jpg


The Wuhan Heavy Industry Corp. just made a breakthrough in an 863 Project. This is the CKX5680 Digitally Controlled 7-axis Contour Milling machine. This is significant as it is specialised in building ship propellers, like this one, for aircraft carriers and submarines. It is much more precise than 5-axis machines.

[Note: Thank you to "pugachev_diver" for the post.]

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n6JQ8.jpg
Type 039 Song-class submarine with asymmetric seven-bladed skewed propeller to reduce cavitation

You a PLAN Insider ? NO
posting links of multiple independent sources makes you credible ? NO

What's so special ? even IN Upgraded Kilo Class is as advance as this. And you think Chinese Sub's can Sink IN

P-8I Neptune will hunt them down! (specially PLAN nuke powered SSk's ) conventional sub's are useless in IOR

Edit I mean seriously 6 SsN's total :lol:
 
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The extensive modernization of India’s navy represents its desire to become not only a major regional player, but a major global one as well. Throughout most of the 20` century, India’s naval priorities were essentially focused on containing Pakistan and securing the maritime approaches to Indian territorial waters.

This kept India’s naval outlook confined to its own waters. The expansion of India’s economy since the late-1990s, along with its growing domestic interests and desire to be a regional power has, however, led it to expand its outlook to the wider Indian Ocean region.

Since 2002, India has undertaken a major naval modernization program, with the overall aim of upgrading its military in a 15-year timeframe. The US$40 billion that the Indian Government plans to spend between 2008 and 2013 forms part of this modernization program.

Numerically, the plan intends to make the Indian Navy the third-largest fleet in the world. It currently stands as the fifth-largest, with 171 vessels and around 250 aircraft. In January 2011, India’s Defense Ministry released the Defense Procurement Procedure 2011 (DPP-2011), which contains separate guidelines for government-owned and privately-owned shipyards to promote competition and increase the efficiency of indigenously-built ships.

The centerpiece of the Indian Navy’s modernization scheme revolves around the acquisition of aircraft carriers and nuclear-powered submarines. Presently, India has allocated funds for the acquisition of three aircraft carriers. The first, INS Vikramaditya (formerly the Russian Navy’s Admiral Gorshkov), has been in the process of retrofitting in Russia since 2008.

After considerable delays, it is expected to be delivered in 2012. The Vikramaditya will carry 16 MiG-29K aircraft. India’s other two aircraft carriers are locally built — the first, INS Vikrant, is due to enter service by 2014 and the second carrier is due in 2017 and is expected to carry 29 MiG-29K aircraft. These aircraft carriers would essentially make India a true blue-water navy and consolidate its force projection capability over a far greater portion of the Indian Ocean.

In 2009 India launched the INS Arihant; its first indigenously-built nuclear submarine, with the intention of commissioning it in late-2011. This will give India a nuclear triad (land and sea-based ballistic missiles and bombers carrying nuclear-tipped bombs/missiles), a capability currently only possessed by the United States, China and Russia.

The Arihant will carry Shaurya missiles, which are capable of carrying a 1-tone nuclear warhead with a range of 750 kilometers and designed specifically for submarines. The vessel will also contain 12 Sagirika missiles, which have a range of up to 1,900 kilometers. Five indigenously-built nuclear-powered submarines are planned for the next decade at a total cost of $2.9 billion. The allocation of $11 billion for six diesel-electric submarines featuring improved land-attack capabilities has also recently been approved.

While aircraft carriers and submarines dominate the naval modernization program, there are other elements. In 2010 India signed a contract with the Pipavav Shipyard to build five patrol vessels. It has also built three multi-role, stealth-featured Shivalik-class frigates, with the first of these, INS Shivalik, being commissioned in April 2010.

Three Russian-built Talwar-class frigates have also been acquired, with the first, INS Teg, to be commissioned later in 2011 and the remainder due to start service in 2012. These will double the number of Talwar-class frigates, with the INS Talwar, Trishul and Tabar having already been commissioned in the last decade.

In addition to such measures, which are consistent with India’s expanding Indian Ocean profile, India has sought to establish either bases or listening stations in many of the Indian Ocean islands.

Among the most significant of these was the establishment of a listening post in northern Madagascar in 2007, giving India a naval position near southern Africa and the sea lines of communication from that area. India has also sent a naval patrol vessel, along with a Dornier-228 maritime reconnaissance aircraft to the Seychelles, reportedly to control piracy in the region.

The Indian Navy has also regularly assisted Mauritius in conducting hydrographic surveys, thus ensuring a near-constant naval presence in that country. India has acquired berthing rights in Oman, following joint military exercises in 2006 and a subsequent defense agreement between the two countries. Such initiatives have allowed India to obtain a naval influence in the western Indian Ocean from the Middle East to south-eastern Africa.

Defence News - India's Naval Massive Modernization Program

Indian navy will be a dominant force in Indian Ocean for sure.
 
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I will assign a lower effective rating to the Israeli system. The American Aegis-system has been tested and upgraded over decades. The Israeli system sounds completely new and is likely unreliable.

The Aegis is the gold standard. The Israeli system sounds like a cheap unproven knockoff. I think India went with the lowest bidder.

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Aegis Combat System - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The Aegis Combat System is an integrated naval weapons system developed by the Missile and Surface Radar Division of RCA, and now produced by Lockheed Martin. It uses powerful computers and radars to track and guide weapons to destroy enemy targets.

Initially used by the United States Navy, Aegis is now used also by the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force, Spanish Navy, Royal Norwegian Navy, and Republic of Korea Navy. Over 100 Aegis-equipped ships have been deployed in five navies worldwide. The Royal Australian Navy has selected the Aegis system for placement on its new Air Warfare Destroyers."

how many wars did the chinese systems fight and have proven themselfs??atleast Israelis are able to market and sell their hardware in huge huge numbers and in most cases to worlds top 15 militaries..heck they even sell loads of stuff to china, now how many stuff does china sell to others and how does chinese hardware become better than Israeli if validation is the criteria??
 
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Stealth Frigates and Destroyers Armed with Hypersonic and The Most Accurate Anti Ship Missiles (Brahmos 2, HSDTV, Shaurya) can Come Undetected within the Range of Most of the Warships Out There and Attack with with Hypersonic Speeds Thus Defeating the AEGIS. India Conceptualizes and Then Comes up with It's Own Solution. While Chinese Only Blindly Follow the Rest of the World and Copy them.

1. Chinese satellites or aircraft will detect the ship's wake or infrared signature before India will be aware of Chinese ships. Firstly, China has over 30 military satellites. India has none. Chinese sensor and overall technology are also far superior to India's.

2. Chinese anti-ship, surface-to-surface, or cruise missiles have greater range than Indian missiles. Brahmos is fast but only has 290km range. Some Chinese cruise missiles have 4,000km range.

In conclusion, China has better detection and greater range.
 
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Why are we seeing pics of chinese tubs in a thread about the Indian Navy??? :drag:
 
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Why are we seeing pics of chinese tubs in a thread about the Indian Navy??? :drag:

Many Indian members wanted to know the number of Chinese submarines and their technical specifications/performance.

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Anyway, I don't mind if you disagree with my objective opinion on the ranking of the Indian Navy. After all, you guys are biased and can't see past your nationalist chest thumping.
 
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Many Indian members wanted to know the number of Chinese submarines and their technical specifications/performance.

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Anyway, I don't mind if you disagree with my objective opinion on the ranking of the Indian Navy. After all, you guys are biased and can't see past your nationalist chest thumping.

Who the Hell is chest thumping here?? except you!!!
 
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I want to thank everyone for an interesting debate. We should do this again sometime in the future.
 
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oh god again another new troll.....^^^^^.....

(About 70 per cent of the fake electronic microchips were traced as being produced in China; the rest came from Canada and Great Britain.

The investigation revealed a scheme whereby large-scale producers bought counterfeit electronic chips from subcontractors who have established links with pirates.

Electronic counterfeit is a multibillion business in China. This has led to counterfeit electronic parts flooding the market and being traded openly.)


can you assure J-20 is made with without any counterfeit equipment.... please train your dragon(how to swim)......
 
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