Indian nuke subs game-changer in next war : Pak analyst

[Abingdonboy]

The Arihant won't be "chasing" anything. The Arihant class are SSBNs who are meant to deliver a credible detterant/second-strike capabilty and their torpedos and such are meant for purely defensive purposes. Yes the Arihant is a "game changer" in the sense that Pakistan's nuclear blackmail is now less potent as India's nuclear triad is almost up and running.

A few more things in the pipeline are really going to hurt- Larger SSBNs following the Arihant class, Indian designed and made SSNs and new SSKs with Brahmos-launch capabilty.


In reality though the Arihant is aimed to counter China more than Pakistan.

 

[Dillinger]

The Arihant won't be "chasing" anything. The Arihant class are SSBNs who are meant to deliver a credible detterant/second-strike capabilty and their torpedos and such are meant for purely defensive purposes. Yes the Arihant is a "game changer" in the sense that Pakistan's nuclear blackmail is now less potent as India's nuclear triad is almost up and running.

A few more things in the pipeline are really going to hurt- Larger SSBNs following the Arihant class, Indian designed and made SSNs and new SSKs with Brahmos-launch capabilty.


In reality though the Arihant is aimed to counter China more than Pakistan.

Someone got confused between a SSBN and a SSN. And seriously what will the K-15/K-4 be used for in an actual operational context against Pakistan- a decapitation strike- we're hip deep in the NFU posture.

our akulas are lame without any long range missiles so second strike capability will solely rest on arihant

Akulas are NOT supposed to have LACMs! Why does everyone want to shoehorn everything into a single platform? The Akula is a huunter killer period, it is not meant to cross operate like a Virginia SSN.

 

[he-man]

The Arihant won't be "chasing" anything. The Arihant class are SSBNs who are meant to deliver a credible detterant/second-strike capabilty and their torpedos and such are meant for purely defensive purposes. Yes the Arihant is a "game changer" in the sense that Pakistan's nuclear blackmail is now less potent as India's nuclear triad is almost up and running.

A few more things in the pipeline are really going to hurt- Larger SSBNs following the Arihant class, Indian designed and made SSNs and new SSKs with Brahmos-launch capabilty.


In reality though the Arihant is aimed to counter China more than Pakistan.

akulas are just for training i think,,,,,,,,,,,,and maybe even detection purposes as they are very silent and have good sensor suite................apart from that they just have low range missiles only

Someone got confused between a SSBN and a SSN. And seriously what will the K-15/K-4 be used for in an actual operational context against Pakistan- a decapitation strike- we're hip deep in the NFU posture.



Akulas are NOT supposed to have LACMs! Why does everyone want to shoehorn everything into a single platform? The Akula is a huunter killer period, it is not meant to cross operate like a Virginia SSN.

russian akulas have both dude,,,,thats why!!

 

[Dillinger]

akulas are just for training i think,,,,,,,,,,,,and maybe even detection purposes as they are very silent and have good sensor suite................apart from that they just have low range missiles only



russian akulas have both dude,,,,thats why!!

Russian Akulas have torp tube launched CM, which is useless in India's context, who's going to sell India a 1000km ranged CM? As far as the IN is concerned the Akula is meant to slink around the deeper waters and interdict any shipping traffic or dash out from its home port to start hunting other subs.

 

[he-man]

Russian Akulas have torp tube launched CM, which is useless in India's context, who's going to sell India a 1000km ranged CM? As far as the IN is concerned the Akula is meant to slink around the deeper waters and interdict any shipping traffic or dash out from its home port to start hunting other subs.

we cannot fit even nirbhay in future on this platform,,,,so yes it is a downgraded unit

 

[Dillinger]

we cannot fit even nirbhay in future on this platform,,,,so yes it is a downgraded unit

We are not going to fit Nirbhay in an Akula, we NEVER intended to. The IN hasn't even projected the need for a SSGN and won't do so either till the next decade. Things work according to the projected requirements, the IN isn't even looking at any overwhelming land attack capability for its primary surface combatants at the moment.

 

[Abingdonboy]

akulas are just for training i think,,,,,,,,,,,,and maybe even detection purposes as they are very silent and have good sensor suite................apart from that they just have low range missiles only
!

I think there is certainly a case for the 1st Akula being for training purposes but apparently the IN is in talks for a second and maybe even third hull and one has to conclude that these most certainly aren't being procured with "training" in mind. Also with there apparently being a clause in the 10-year lease giving India first refusal/the option to buy the boat at the end of the contract then obviously the IN will put the sub to work in a capacity over than training.

Someone got confused between a SSBN and a SSN. And seriously what will the K-15/K-4 be used for in an actual operational context against Pakistan- a decapitation strike- we're hip deep in the NFU posture.

Regarding the NFU policy, I can't remember where but I heard this NFU mission statement was actually incredibly broad and even under this NFU policy, India can actually conduct pre-emptive nuclear strikes if there is a PERCEPTION that India is facing a legitimate nuclear threat from a nation. As such, as you noted, these Indian SSBNs with K-15/4 would be the ideal delivery system to decimate Pakistan.


Let's just hope it never comes to that but better to have and not need than need and not have

 

[he-man]

We are not going to fit Nirbhay in an Akula, we NEVER intended to. The IN hasn't even projected the need for a SSGN and won't do so either till the next decade. Things work according to the projected requirements, the IN isn't even looking at any overwhelming land attack capability for its primary surface combatants at the moment.

yaar again u are twisting stuff..............where does the question comes of our navy's wishes??We just can't under the treaty,,,,,and believe me if we could we would

But yes when we have 3 akulas by 2025 we don't have any worry as all will have 4 k4 each and hopefully some with mirv too!!

 

[Dillinger]

I think there is certainly a case for the 1st Akula being for training purposes but apparently the IN is in talks for a second and maybe even third hull and one has to conclude that these most certainly aren't being procured with "training" in mind. Also with there apparently being a clause in the 10-year lease giving India first refusal/the option to buy the boat at the end of the contract then obviously the IN will put the sub to work in a capacity over than training.





Regarding the NFU policy, I can't remember where but I heard this NFU mission statement was actually incredibly broad and even under this NFU policy, India can actually conduct pre-emptive nuclear strikes if there is a PERCEPTION that India is facing a legitimate nuclear threat from a nation. As such, as you noted, these Indian SSBNs with K-15/4 would be the ideal delivery system to decimate Pakistan.


Let's just hope it never comes to that but better to have and not need than need and not have

Actually its NFU against non-nuclear states, must you let the cat out of the bag.
Shivshankar Menon at NDC (Speech)

The active op role for the Chakra is very much there, Otherwise the IN would be treating it like it does any other sub which goes off for firing trials of its torp launched munitions- with inert warheads- which is not the case with the Akula. So either the IN is departing from SOP or somethings up.

yaar again u are twisting stuff..............where does the question comes of our navy's wishes??We just can't under the treaty,,,,,and believe me if we could we would

But yes when we have 3 akulas by 2025 we don't have any worry as all will have 4 k4 each and hopefully some with mirv too!!

No we would NOT! And nor can we EVEN IF any deal allowed it- UNLESS YOU WANT TO MANUFACTURE A LACM that fits inside a 533mm torp tube, the Ex-Nerpa ONLY has 533mm tubes.

 

[Thorough Pro]

but obviously no match for you......LOL at 3/4 in maintenance.

The analyst looks like a stupid . Too much inaccuracy in his post .

Advocating the use of a SSBN in the role of a SSN .

I still remember with pride our naval supremacy in the 1965 war. It was primarily due to the presence of PN submarine Ghazi that the entire Indian fleet was forced to stay in harbour ..... and not because three fourth of IN was in maintenance .

 

[he-man]

Actually its NFU against non-nuclear states, must you let the cat out of the bag.
Shivshankar Menon at NDC (Speech)

The active op role for the Chakra is very much there, Otherwise the IN would be treating it like it does any other sub which goes off for firing trials of its torp launched munitions- with inert warheads- which is not the case with the Akula. So either the IN is departing from SOP or somethings up.



No we would NOT! And nor can we EVEN IF any deal allowed it- UNLESS YOU WANT TO MANUFACTURE A LACM that fits inside a 533mm torp tube, the Ex-Nerpa ONLY has 533mm tubes.

i got fu ck ed here................fu ck,,,,,lol

 

[Abingdonboy]

The active op role for the Chakra is very much there, Otherwise the IN would be treating it like it does any other sub which goes of for firing trials of its torp launched munitions- with inert warheads- which is not the case with the Akula. So either the IN is departing from SOP or somethings up.

I think for the first 4-5 years maybe even the entire 10 year lease, the Chakra will be used almost purely as a training platform to get enough nuke sub crews up to scratch. However once the S1 to S5 is in service the need for a dedicated training platform in the form of the Chakra will be seriously diminished so the IN either gives the boat back or exercises the option to buy it outright and operate it as an offensive SSN. There can be no doubt though that the talks for a second and possibly even third hull are not seeking more training boats but full-blown SSNs.

 

[Armstrong]

@Dillinger - Oi saleiii tou mujhe par Bumb pheenkeiii gaaa ?

Tereiii Northern India kei liyee tou apnaa @Hyperion hi kaafiii haiiii.....one full blast of a Hypie Fart is more deadly than whatever the Iranians or Saddam could come up with !

 

[Dillinger]

@Dillinger - Oi saleiii tou mujhe par Bumb pheenkeiii gaaa ?

Tereiii Northern India kei liyee tou apnaa @Hyperion hi kaafiii haiiii.....one full blast of a Hypie Fart is more deadly than whatever the Iranians or Saddam could come up with !

No one is nuking you. IF it came down to it a DTSLBM like the K-15 can only be optionally used for a decapitation strike- so IF and WHEN we go genocidal and are willing to embrace MAD then you can worry. Although the K-4 indeed can be used for the bread and butter deterrence.

 

[Armstrong]

No one is nuking you. IF it came down to it a DTSLBM like the K-15 can only be optionally used for a decapitation strike- so IF and WHEN we go genocidal and are willing to embrace MAD then you can worry. Although the K-4 indeed can be used for the bread and butter deterrence.

Pataaa nahin kaun kaun seii Acronyms use kar rahaa haiii !

DTSLBM - Deferred Tax....kiyaa ?