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Indian muslim :Javed Akhtar's India & Pakistan

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Well, if you live in a country, you have to face the same pain and challenges that others face.
Economically muslims in pakistan could be better off, and bangladesh worse off. Nobody is denying that.
But recent security situation balances it a bit.
So, pakistan is not exactly heaven for South asian muslims.
 
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@Bilal

The contention was Indian Muslims "hate" Pakistan for no reason. That is how I responded. And let me be clear that this is about GoP policies and establishment policies and not the average Pakistani people.

Indian Muslims hate the Pakistani govt. and establishment and those PAkistanis that support their wrong actions. It is becuase of the GoP and their establishment that Islam and Muslims are being shamed. What is worse is that there is no jutification of their actions being Islamic but still they use Islam and create wrong impressions among rest of non-muslims. Then you have Pakistani establishment actively trying to create Hindu-Muslim conflict. And I am not making this up. There are quotes from Pakistani journalists about the establishment officers and bearcrats saying this.

Just two quotes should be enough
Nawabzadaa Nabiullah Khan (a confidant of and adviser to the leader of one of the prominent Pakistani Islamic militant outfits, Jamaat-e-Islami) justifies such an attitude when he says “........ this is one of the serious problems of living in non-Muslim countries. ...... Yet knowingly these so-called Muslims live in India. Again, all the Muslims who migrate to other countries and US are non-Muslims. Only the Muslims who intend to come back are Muslims not the ones who decide to stay in such countries. Hence we do not care if such Indian Muslims die in the riots

Kuldip Nayar, an ardent promoter of Pakistan-India friendship states (Pak newspaper DAWN-8 FEB2003--CROSSING THE BAR) “My purpose of visiting Pakistan a few weeks ago was to tell Pakistani how their policy of cross-border terrorism had strengthened the BJP on the one hand and harassed Muslims on the other. I found very few responsive ears. At the government level, I suspected a fiendish satisfaction over the emergence of Hindu fundamentalism in India. In any case, what Indian Muslims might face because of Pakistan's policy was not a factor in the reckoning of Islamabad”!

So although you and a large number of people around you don't have ill willings against Indian muslims. The leadership of GoP andthe establishment do try their best to undermine communal harmony in India so that they can be satisfied that they are in Pakistan. Because if Indian muslims are doing better than Pakistani muslims, they feel that the raison d etre of creating Pakistan is gone.
 
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Just a decade and a half ago, Pakistan used to be in such a better position when compared to India that when people from Pakistan used to visit India, they used to come back with a smile and stories of their poverty and absolute abysmal state. My father used to visit and travel through India for a number of reasons and back then Pakistan and India were incomparable, Pakistan was simply better.

Pakistanis visiting India till the mid-eighties came back very smug. They told us about India's slums, and that there was nothing to buy except handicrafts and saris. Then Pakistanis could say with justifiable pride that nobody slept hungry in their country. But now, not only do people sleep hungry in both the countries, they also commit suicide because they see nothing but a lifetime of hunger ahead.

Ten myths about Pakistan - Page 3 - Times Of India

You know what’s the difference between Delhi and Lahore?” said Salman Taseer, as he stood on the terrace of a glittering dinner party. “They are the cars parked on the street below! Back home, there would have been rows of BMWs, Land Cruisers, but you still have your Marutis and Ambassadors,” he laughed.

www.outlookindia.com | A Lahore Boy In Delhi

But since the dark days of Zia and later the deadly combo of Benazir-Sharif, Pakistan suffered terribly in the economics department. We had something called the poverty bomb which went off. As the nation was concentrating on inane issues, the real problems of poverty, extremism and social injustices magnified to unseen levels. Don't get me wrong, people in Pakistan are still very rich and if the situation is controlled, it can bounce up again to exceedingly high levels. Unfortunately the economy is poor and because of poor leaders, we have failed at rectifying our image.

Coming to this Akhtar guy, he has a sinister motive behind all his verbiage that he barks out. There is a tinge of bitterness and anger that does not come across well, I mean I would not become an expert at matters that don't concern me and would rather opt for giving my well wishes where required.

One thing you have to remember is that the people who have a lot of power in Pakistan now were the ones who opposed it. Take for example the Islamic parties, they hated the idea of Pakistan and today they are the reason why we are in a mess. These Jamaati, Ahrari/Nabuwat, tableghi and other Deobandi menace should not have been allowed to enter Pakistan. That was a mistake and we are paying for it today, but remember, just like how Pakistani's were smug a couple of decades ago, things just might change again.
 
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Bihar, UP, jharkand......now these are all among the most backward and downtrodden states in India. The situation is not so different when you consider the Hindus from the same region.
 
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I am neither rich nor poor and i hope you excuse a new member for saying this. I have no positive view about Pakistan. There is nothing about Pakistan that would make me want to support your nation. I am always an Indian first. Even if some do maintain positive views, you have to understand this is the older population.

Regards,

Ask me and i hate indian Muslims more than indian hindus- they make me sick- they are the most illiterate and backward people in whole of india- only thing they excel at is- producing Bhais- gangsters- and fake khans- yeah expect a few countable exceptions from millions- to me they are a burden on developing Indian society- their way of living helps stereotyping the whole Muslims else where- and they have to constantly bash Pakistan to prove their loyality as an indian- Javed Akhtar is one such individual who has to bash Pakistan just to get a flat in hindu dominated area Juhu-The only Pakistanis who to some extent like indian muslims are the ones who have some relatives in india-

Regards-
 
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You know what’s the difference between Delhi and Lahore?” said Salman Taseer, as he stood on the terrace of a glittering dinner party. “They are the cars parked on the street below! Back home, there would have been rows of BMWs, Land Cruisers, but you still have your Marutis and Ambassadors,” he laughed.

Could even a single person make an honest living and afford these in Pakistan at any point after partition?

With a per capita income of less than 700-800 dollars, it would always be a small landed or powerful corrupt elite that could have afforded those cars. While in India, the smaller cars were bought by the real middle class, working in their offices and small businesses.

These kinds of things are so absurd, they are not even worth contradicting. May be Pakistan had a slightly better per capita income, it was still poor throughout. It still had its hungry and it still had a bad infrastructure.

May be the pathetic Indian infrastructure stood out more and our slums were larger but after our land reforms we don't have the 22 families controlling the country.

That laugh (if it was real) was very superficial indeed!
 
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I have a problem with Pakistanis trying to prove that Indian muslims are discriminated against . Why do they care ? To validate their state's existence ? Even the anchor in the show said the same thing in the first video ... " Dekha isliye hum alida ho gaye".

If you really beleive Pakistan was for the better of Indian muslims than why the constant need to prove discrimination in India ?

Instead why dont you improve your own condition in such a way that outsiders look and say 'Hey Pakistan was a indeed a good idea for Indian muslims' , instead most Pakistanis try to prove how living in India was not a good idea for muslims just to feel good about their own nation's existence . Why ?
 
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Ask me and i hate indian Muslims more than indian hindus- they make me sick- they are the most illiterate and backward people in whole of india- only thing they excel at is- producing Bhais- gangsters- and fake khans- yeah expect a few countable exceptions from millions- to me they are a burden on developing Indian society- their way of living helps stereotyping the whole Muslims else where- and they have to constantly bash Pakistan to prove their loyality as an indian- Javed Akhtar is one such individual who has to bash Pakistan just to get a flat in hindu dominated area Juhu-The only Pakistanis who to some extent like indian muslims are the ones who have some relatives in india-

Regards-

i suppose you got all that from your trusty crystal ball. How is it that our way of living detrimental to the Indian social fabric? We are Indians just like any other. India is a country of extreme diversity.

Muslims have contributed heavily to the Indian economy and technical fields. But i suppose as a Pakistani , you would prefer to ignore such details.

It must be hell living in your mind.....lol....
 
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Could even a single person make an honest living and afford these in Pakistan at any point after partition?

With a per capita income of less than 700-800 dollars, it would always be a small landed or powerful corrupt elite that could have afforded those cars. While in India, the smaller cars were bought by the real middle class, working in their offices and small businesses.

These kinds of things are so absurd, they are not even worth contradicting. May be Pakistan had a slightly better per capita income, it was still poor throughout. It still had its hungry and it still had a bad infrastructure.

May be the pathetic Indian infrastructure stood out more and our slums were larger but after our land reforms we don't have the 22 families controlling the country.

That laugh (if it was real) was very superficial indeed!

This is another one of those myths that Indians have that its only feudals or land owners who are rich in Pakistan.

Salman Taseer was not from a rich family, he was a self made man. His father died when he was very young and his mother raised him herself, he went to England for his education where he payed for it through employment.

He worked hard to create an empire worth hundreds of millions, I see you always get a little jumpy when you hear such things about Pakistan.

Half the people in my neighborhood were self made and they reached the levels of the feudals that lived next to us. A lot of people did well for themselves after the creation of Pakistan, after all we started with literally nothing reaching globally respected levels by the 60's.

Yes. Yes, you read right. The roads. I used to live in Mumbai and now I live in Delhi and, yes, I think good roads are a great, mammoth, gargantuan luxury! Face it, when did you last see a good road in India? Like a really smooth road. Drivable, wide, nicely built and long, yawning, stretching so far that you want zip on till eternity and loosen the gears and let the car fly. A road without squeeze or bump or gaping holes that pop up like blood-dripping kitchen knives in Ramsay Brothers films. When did you last see such roads? Pakistan is full of such roads. Driving on the motorway between Islamabad and Lahore, I thought of the Indian politician who ruled a notorious —, one could almost say viciously — potholed state and spoke of turning the roads so smooth that they would resemble the cheeks of Hema Malini. They remained as dented as the face of Frankenstein's monster. And here, in Pakistan, I was travelling on roads that — well, how can one now avoid this? — were as smooth as Hema Malini's cheeks! Pakistani roads are broad and smooth and almost entirely, magically, pot hole free. How do they do it; this country that is ostensibly so far behind in economic growth compared to India? But they do and one of my most delightful experiences in Pakistan has been travelling on its fabulous roads. No wonder the country is littered with SUVs — Pakistan has the roads for such cars! Even in tiny Bajaur in the North West frontier province, hard hit by the Taliban, and a little more than a frontier post, the roads were smoother than many I know in India. Even Bajaur has a higher road density than India! If there is one thing we should learn from the Pakistanis, it is how to build roads. And oh, another thing, no one throws beer bottles or trash on the highways and motorways.

The Hindu : Columns / Hindol Sengupta : Affluenza: With love from across the border
 
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I have a problem with Pakistanis trying to prove that Indian muslims are discriminated against . Why do they care ? To validate their state's existence ? Even the anchor in the show said the same thing in the first video ... " Dekha isliye hum alida ho gaye".

If you really beleive Pakistan was for the better of Indian muslims than why the constant need to prove discrimination in India ?

Instead why dont you improve your own condition in such a way that outsiders look and say 'Hey Pakistan was a indeed a good idea for Indian muslims' , instead most Pakistanis try to prove how living in India was not a good idea for muslims just to feel good about their own nation's existence . Why ?

What is wrong with you?

An Indian started this thread and you are blaming Pakistani's for trying to prove that Indian Muslims are discriminated against, well the fact is that I and many others do not care what happens to Indian Muslims, they are in control of their own destiny.

What I do have a problem with is that some of these people do not have a lot of manners, I guess they take after the likes of Maududi and other such bastards India produced. I would not stand it when some coward uses foul language and disrespects Pakistan especially when they do it so they can affirm their allegiance to India.

Look at what that prick I banned wrote:

lol i never used MC and BC words to describe pakistan(actually i never use those words for anyone)...but my friends(not only hindus) where using those words for pakistan in every sentence when we were watching WC semi-final

Shame and humility is something that does not exist in some.
 
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i suppose you got all that from your trusty crystal ball. How is it that our way of living detrimental to the Indian social fabric? We are Indians just like any other. India is a country of extreme diversity.

i have heard that exactly from people who are apologetic to their existence in india- precisely indian Muslims-

Muslims have contributed heavily to the Indian economy and technical fields. But i suppose as a Pakistani , you would prefer to ignore such details.

We as a nation have prospered alot- the down fall came just recently- and we as a nation will rise again in our free/ independent country- where we will have every right and opportunity to contribute for this free Muslim country- but to keep a mindset one has to ignore such facts- isn't it?- So like you- ignored-

It must be hell living in your mind.....lol....
Living in denial- or contrary ignorance is a bliss- The discrimination in your supposedly home country is clear for all to see- i mean its not some hundred years ago when you Muslims were butchered and your mosque was destroyed- just to quote a few reminders that is- i can understand the hell inside of you trying desperately to blend in the society historically you do not belong to-
and yeah.. lol... if it helps-
 
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What is wrong with you?

An Indian started this thread and you are blaming Pakistani's for trying to prove that Indian Muslims are discriminated against, well the fact is that I and many others do not care what happens to Indian Muslims, they are in control of their own destiny.

What I do have a problem with is that some of these people do not have a lot of manners, I guess they take after the likes of Maududi and other such bastards India produced. I would not stand it when some coward uses foul language and disrespects Pakistan especially when they do it so they can affirm their allegiance to India.

Look at what that prick I banned wrote:



Shame and humility is something that does not exist in some.

T-FaZ look at how the journalist was talking . she kept trying to prove how muslims are discriminated against . Look at this thread and other threads on defence.pk . look at your media as well . They always try to prove India is not secualr and is secular only in name . why ? to validate their own existence as a separate country ?

About wether Pakistanis care or not . We clearly see how many times Pakistanis keep talking about Gujrat and babri and other issues in India and how closely your media follows them .

The journalist in this interview as well stated that whenever a news of discrimination of muslims in India comes out Pakistanis say " Dekha , isliye hum alaida ho gaye" . Why ?
 
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@glorious resolve

A society i dont belong to? This is my country, my people......how is it that i "dont belong"?

I remember in school we always began with the pledge, which starts like this : "india is my country, all Indians are my brothers and sisters......"

Now they never asked me to recite something different back then because i was muslim. I am at a loss as to how you came to that conclusion.
 
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i have heard that exactly from people who are apologetic to their existence in india- precisely indian Muslims-



We as a nation have prospered alot- the down fall came just recently- and we as a nation will rise again in our free/ independent country- where we will have every right and opportunity to contribute for this free Muslim country- but to keep a mindset one has to ignore such facts- isn't it?- So like you- ignored-


Living in denial- or contrary ignorance is a bliss- The discrimination in your supposedly home country is clear for all to see- i mean its not some hundred years ago when you Muslims were butchered and your mosque was destroyed- just to quote a few reminders that is- i can understand the hell inside of you trying desperately to blend in the society historically you do not belong to-
and yeah.. lol... if it helps
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You see T-FAz this is the desperation to prove that Indian muslims are discriminated against that i am talking about and this is widespread in Pakistan . Even when Indian muslims themselves say its not bad here , You guys still continue with it . Why ? To validate your state's existence ? Sorry for repeating but i had to .
 
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