India’s Super Sukhoi Vs China’s Su-35: Who has the better Aircraft?

[Dillinger]

@BLING @he-man Add to that, I'll give anyone who names the MRAF which will hold the 35s in the eventuality that they are purchased a lollipop- start digging.

 

[BLING]

@BLING would you be kind enough to elucidate upon the PLAAF tier command and assets in the relevant MRAF that is responsible for Xizang? It might help you. IF and it is indeed an IF, the 35s are procured-

1) They will not bother us.

2) The super-MKI upgrade, in time, will match them toe to toe and in terms of sensor capabilities beat them.

3) For the love of god, if you are not cognizant of the role being played by the Rafale in the IAF op. doc. then refrain from engaging in comparisons- that goes for EVERYONE.

With all respect to u brother ... I agree Rafale role in IAF is unique .. and very diffrent ffrom Su 30 or Su 35 .. I understand that . But once cannot say that rafale is better than Su 35 as the GREAT HEMAN as claimed . Which was very silly and Pathetic . Su 35 clearly out perform Rafale atleast on Paper . . . Hope by now u should had understood my view on Su 35 vs Rafale .

On Super Sukoi ~ It is pre mature to claim that Super sukoi will match Su 35 . Su 35 which developed and Flying with pride and made news all over the World as UFO FIGHTER ! Example We are Upgrading Mirage 2K with Some rafale Specs for huge cost ... Mirage 2k Upg will be advanced than mirage 2k . But How it will be equal to RAFALE ? Same goes with Super too . We are upgrading Super for diffrent reason but not as a fighter to figt Su 35 . Super program is mainly to reduce the RCS of Su 30s , upgraded radar and to have Bramos capability .. On other hand Chinese will get Su 35 fro 2014 itself. There are huge scope for Upgrades in the future . Which will make this beast into a Killer Beast !

So my ponit is that we need to upgrade not just 40 but all Su 30 MKIs into Super ... At the same time we must buy few 35s for special role like Group Leader or Elite Fighter Sq ... We Must buy rafale too as its for multi ops . Thank You !

China wont just stop with 20 or 40 Jets .. there will be follow on or Copied verson of Su 35 or they will use it tech to their 5th Gent fighter programs . IAF must not just be happy with Super .. We must ink Rafale deal ... Atleast 60~ 120 with 40+ Su 35 and Mass produce Tejas MK 1 and MK 2 .... It will be best way to survive till 2020-22 ... From then on we will be getting our FGFA and AMCA hopfully ... Till then We need to fast track defence deals

 

[Dillinger]

With all respect to u brother ... I agree Rafale role in IAF is unique .. and very diffrent ffrom Su 30 or Su 35 .. I understand that . But once cannot say that rafale is better than Su 35 as the GREAT HEMAN as claimed . Which was very silly and Pathetic . Su 35 clearly out perform Rafale atleast on Paper . . . Hope by now u should had understood my view on Su 35 vs Rafale .

On Super Sukoi ~ It is pre mature to claim that Super sukoi will match Su 35 . Su 35 which developed and Flying with pride and made news all over the World as UFO FIGHTER ! Example We are Upgrading Mirage 2K with Some rafale Specs for huge cost ... Mirage 2k Upg will be advanced than mirage 2k . But How it will be equal to RAFALE ? Same goes with Super too . We are upgrading Super for diffrent reason but not as a fighter to figt Su 35 . Super program is mainly to reduce the RCS of Su 30s , upgraded radar and to have Bramos capability .. On other hand Chinese will get Su 35 fro 2014 itself. There are huge scope for Upgrades in the future . Which will make this beast into a Killer Beast !

So my ponit is that we need to upgrade not just 40 but all Su 30 MKIs into Super ... At the same time we must buy few 35s for special role like Group Leader or Elite Fighter Sq ... We Must buy rafale too as its for multi ops . Thank You !

You've got the MKI upgrade project scope wrong-

and the design differences between the two is minimal, the vertical stabilizers on the 35 has been changed for the better though among other things- otherwise they are both derived from the the granddaddy T-10, UNLIKE the example of the Rafale and Mirage which are two different platforms altogether with negligible commonality.

We will not be procuring the 35s, not now and not in the future, we don't need to.

 

[BLING]

claims there is no air to air missile with >100 km range

When did i claimed there is no 100 km Missile ? It was about Rafale ..As u claimed rafale can Kill Su 35 at 140 km

is laughing at name of rbe2aa aesa??

?

You've got the MKI upgrade project scope wrong-

and the design differences between the two is minimal, the inlet shaping on the 35 has been changed for the better though among other things- otherwise they are both derived from the the granddaddy T-10, UNLIKE the example of the Rafale and Mirage which are two different platforms altogether with negligible commonality.

We will not be procuring the 35s, not now and not in the future, we don't need to.

It will be good if u can post more info on Su 30 vs Super upgrade ! I know what u just said . But i need more info on its upgrades . . . Its worth debating on Super 's upgrade than rafale vs Su 35 ...

 

[Dillinger]

When did i claimed there is no 100 km Missile ? It was about Rafale ..As u claimed rafale can Kill Su 35 at 140 km

?



It will be good if u can post more info on Su 30 vs Super upgrade ! I know what u just said . But i need more info on its upgrades . . . Its worth debating on Super 's upgrade than rafale vs Su 35 ...

Will do so when I get the time, a little loaded at the moment.

The Rafale will be more survivable than the 35, specially if it is armed with the meteor- that AAM is a beast- sustaining its complete lateral-g performance at the very edge of its operational envelope. A platform, which is to be implemented in the manner in which the Rafale is intended to be used, with the on board ECM assets which the Rafale has and armed with the Meteor will give tough competition to the 35. Specially as its sensors operate in an interleaved manner and the Irbis chugs along in sequential operation.

 

[BLING]

Guys pls calm down and stop it. Both Rafale and Su-35 have some advantages and disadvantages over each other.

U are Secular Bhai

 

[he-man]

U are Secular Bhai

We can fit any missile on rafale after we get it..........and atleast r-27 with 130 km range

On another point ur analysis is totally wrong

1)Both have a chance at each other only at sub 150 km or i would say 120-130 km

2)At this range rafale has 3 unique advantages

a)It has an aesa radar,so it has a unique low probability of interception radar.......................su-35 has irbis-e without
any such feature and it can be jammed,while aesa will be very diff to jam
b)Rafale has spectra passive detection,,,,,,,su-35 has nothing as such
c)rafale irst has a range of 140km while su-35 has 90 max

 

[BLING]

Comparison between SUPER SUKHOI(INDIA) & SU-35M(CHINA)

SUPER SUKHOI------'

1. FLY by wire (FBW) with quadruple redundancy.

2. Displays include a highly customized version of the Israeli Elbit Su 967 head-up display along with bi-cubic phase conjugated holographic displays and seven liquid crystal multifunction displays.

3. Forward-facing NIIP N011M Bars (Panther); a powerful integrated passive electronically scanned array radar that can function in air to-air and air-to-land/sea mode simultaneously while being tied into a high-precision laser-inertial or GPS navigation system.

4. It is equipped with a modern digital weapons control system as well as anti-jamming features

5. N011M has a 400 km search range and a maximum 200km
tracking range, and 60km in the rear hemisphere. The radar can track 15 air targets and engage 4 simultaneously. These targets can even include cruise missiles and motionless helicopters.

6. Make flights in all weather,day and night conditions.

7. The aircraft is fitted with Israeli-made LITENING targeting pod that is used to target laser guided munitions.

SUKHOI SU-35M..........

1.Based on SU-27M Airframe & has service life to 6,000 hours, 30 years of operation...

2. The use of a new integrated control system (developed by MNPK
Avionika Moscow-based Research and Production Association) simultaneously performing functions of several systems – remote control, automatic control,limiting signals system, air signals system, chassis wheels braking system –will enhance the fighter’s handling capability and maneuverability.

3. The aircraft’s chassis has been reinforced to increase the takeoff and landing weight of the aircraft and bears two wheels in addition for the same purpose.

4. Its improved radar stealth reduces the reflectance of the Su-35 in
the X radio waveband and in the angle range of 60 degrees.

5. The engines are the upgraded AL-31F production engines employing fifth-generation technologies.

6. The aircraft features include a suite of new on-board equipments including the information management system (IMS), which integrates functional, logical,informational and software subsystems into a single complex that ensures the interaction between the crew and equipment.

7. The IMS includes two centraldigital computers, commutation and information devices and an indication system built on the “all-glass cockpit” concept.

https://www.facebook.com/TheIndianArmyFans/posts/581750111882608?comment_id=89660658&offset=0&total_comments=7&notif_t=feed_comment

We can fit any missile on rafale after we get it..........and atleast r-27 with 130 km range

On another point ur analysis is totally wrong

1)Both have a chance at each other only at sub 150 km or i would say 120-130 km

2)At this range rafale has 3 unique advantages

a)It has an aesa radar,so it has a unique low probability of interception radar.......................su-35 has irbis-e without
any such feature and it can be jammed,while aesa will be very diff to jam
b)Rafale has spectra passive detection,,,,,,,su-35 has nothing as such
c)rafale irst has a range of 140km while su-35 has 90 max

Network Busy please try again LATER ! ! !

Guys -------------------- Debate moved on from Rafale vs Su 35 to Super's Upgrades ... Please share something usefull

 

[Indo-guy]

It should be Dassualt Rafale vs sukhoi-35. Btw its funny a country who building 5th generation jet fighter buying Su-35.... And than they accuse india of importing weapons. To be honest everything china got today its due to Russia. From weapons to space technology. Russians is the most easy people to take under control. They just need cash for alcohol. Ask anyone what russia famous for? They will say russian brides. Anyone can buy them.... Sad indeed.

In 1990's after collapse of USSR, Russian arms industry was in dire straits after having badly hit by the division of its assets and reduction in demand and budget cuts and so also was the Russian economy that was in tatters ( the most important reason for fall of USSR ) . Russia had no choice but to shift to a Arms Supplier -Seller policy. Countries like China and India took maximum advantage of this precarious Russian situation . We could lay hand over several state of the art technology just because Russia put it for sale .

Russia's role in China's technological rise is undeniable . I have two separate threads devoted for that . anyway
Russia is not to be blamed for what it did . It was necessity of time for Russian arms industry to survive huge budget cuts amidst sinking economy . Several giant projects were had to be shelved midway ...

So don't blame Russia for what happened ... You would put everything to sale if it comes to survive through your teeth .

It did what it had to stay afloat just like anybody else could or would have done !!!

 

[BigDaddyWatch]

Useless thread because China is not going to get the SU-35. The Russian government say they don't want to sell and the Chinese government say they don't want to buy. I don't know why the Russian media keep turning out these stories about China wanting to buy the SU-35.

 

[Fattyacids]

It should be Dassualt Rafale vs sukhoi-35. Btw its funny a country who building 5th generation jet fighter buying Su-35.... And than they accuse india of importing weapons. To be honest everything china got today its due to Russia. From weapons to space technology. Russians is the most easy people to take under control. They just need cash for alcohol. Ask anyone what russia famous for? They will say russian brides. Anyone can buy them.... Sad indeed.

LOL, sour grapes. What we have now are mostly indigenous. We did not accuse India of importing most of its weapons. It is fact.

 

[Jade]

SU 35 is the better one though SU 30MKI is close.

 

[he-man]

https://www.facebook.com/TheIndianArmyFans/posts/581750111882608?comment_id=89660658&offset=0&total_comments=7¬if_t=feed_comment



Network Busy please try again LATER ! ! !

Guys -------------------- Debate moved on from Rafale vs Su 35 to Super's Upgrades ... Please share something usefull

read it and don't waste anyone's time here if u urself have nothing to post

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/275107-happy-times-iaf-ahead-options-galore.html

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/274117-maks-2013-indian-angle.html

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...robable-engine-super-sukhoi-if-we-change.html


and yes i started all 3 threads just 2 weeks ago
@WebMaster @Aeronaut

pls permit me to post on su-30 engine forum from which i was banned last week

 

[klub]

@HeMan Spectra is good but Su 35 doesnt have the worst ... It has very advanced suit too .. ur are discribing su35 suit as 2nd or 3rd gen !


No its not ! Super Sukoi is not su 35 !

Yes it is, AESA radar needs higher power thus new engines must. PKS has it all there. The SU 30 MKI, SU 35 has same TVC technology. Only thrust and radar are need to be different. The deal was signed in Putin's 2012 december visit!

Comparison between SUPER SUKHOI(INDIA) & SU-35M(CHINA)

SUPER SUKHOI------'

1. FLY by wire (FBW) with quadruple redundancy.

2. Displays include a highly customized version of the Israeli Elbit Su 967 head-up display along with bi-cubic phase conjugated holographic displays and seven liquid crystal multifunction displays.

3. Forward-facing NIIP N011M Bars (Panther); a powerful integrated passive electronically scanned array radar that can function in air to-air and air-to-land/sea mode simultaneously while being tied into a high-precision laser-inertial or GPS navigation system.

4. It is equipped with a modern digital weapons control system as well as anti-jamming features

5. N011M has a 400 km search range and a maximum 200km
tracking range, and 60km in the rear hemisphere. The radar can track 15 air targets and engage 4 simultaneously. These targets can even include cruise missiles and motionless helicopters.

6. Make flights in all weather,day and night conditions.

7. The aircraft is fitted with Israeli-made LITENING targeting pod that is used to target laser guided munitions.

SUKHOI SU-35M..........

1.Based on SU-27M Airframe & has service life to 6,000 hours, 30 years of operation...

2. The use of a new integrated control system (developed by MNPK
Avionika Moscow-based Research and Production Association) simultaneously performing functions of several systems – remote control, automatic control,limiting signals system, air signals system, chassis wheels braking system –will enhance the fighter’s handling capability and maneuverability.

3. The aircraft’s chassis has been reinforced to increase the takeoff and landing weight of the aircraft and bears two wheels in addition for the same purpose.

4. Its improved radar stealth reduces the reflectance of the Su-35 in
the X radio waveband and in the angle range of 60 degrees.

5. The engines are the upgraded AL-31F production engines employing fifth-generation technologies.

6. The aircraft features include a suite of new on-board equipments including the information management system (IMS), which integrates functional, logical,informational and software subsystems into a single complex that ensures the interaction between the crew and equipment.

7. The IMS includes two centraldigital computers, commutation and information devices and an indication system built on the “all-glass cockpit” concept.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...-who-has-better-aircraft-5.html#ixzz2eVGUJxKz

Above is SU 30 MKI Capabilities!

 

[BLING]

read it and don't waste anyone's time here if u urself have nothing to post

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/275107-happy-times-iaf-ahead-options-galore.html

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/274117-maks-2013-indian-angle.html

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...robable-engine-super-sukhoi-if-we-change.html


and yes i started all 3 threads just 2 weeks ago
@WebMaster @Aeronaut

pls permit me to post on su-30 engine forum from which i was banned last week

Plzdont revoke his BAN ! @WebMaster ,... Save others from self Glory BORE

Better u hemans should avoid debating with inferior Human ! Start ur own Forum ...And post about urself ... How great u r ... THE GREAT HEMAN IS