If it comes down to this, will Pak-Army kill its own people?

[Marshmallow]

actually egyptians should take page out of pakistan's history, army turning guns on it's own people never ends well for the army...


They did it in esat pakistan, what mes you think the "present" are any better!

east pakistan is a history now....and for ur question,i already gave the reasons above....

 

[Marwat Khan Lodhi]

Depend upon what kind of protest will it be. If protests are for separate country then pak army would open fire on 'rebels' even if they are unarmed, may even use tanks.

 

[Bratva]

Depend upon what kind of protest will it be. If protests are for separate country then pak army would open fire on 'rebels' even if they are unarmed, may even use tanks.

Or just put them in jail like bacha khan

 

[mourning sage]

Hi,

It has to----it must.

Care to explain why you think so? come clearly, and please spare me your philosophy

 

[Leader]

goes without saying, oath and actions go in different tangents, while we are at it I hear that doctors also have some similar oath of serving the humanity.

, yes read the oath, recited it and understood it very well, oh by the way, talking about oath its down to the officer how he interprets it. so a commander decided to open fire in Tehrir square and he got the seal of approval from his KSA brothers that Egyptian army has served Islam, saved Egypt and the Arab ideology.

coming back to Pak army, its already in a fight with its own people who are not Indians, Israelis, Ugandan or Zimbabweans but have made a habit of turning schools into human slaughter houses so yes, as far as I know FATA and Sawat are also part of Pakistan so question is outdated, Pak army IS killing its own people whether it is doing the right thing or not depends on who you ask.

If the executive donot do their job, is it right for judiciary to play their role?
If the administration doesnot do their job, is it right for judiciary to poke their nose?

In a system, if one is not functioning its part, other function has no right to assume its role, imagine clerks taking over GHQ, saying these generals are not performing their job, now we will do it for them? similarly military people are incapable to perform the functions of the State (unless ofcourse there is revolutionary leader like Sallahudhen Ayubi or Haider Sultan which is rare historical phenomenon)

but since in third world countries like Pakistan, army is given undue importance, they assume the status of holier than thou. what ever ignorant justifications they may give, they factually damage the State more than anyone else.

we have become prone to international threats and pressure, not because of failure of politicians but because of the holier than thou (read power hungry) attitude of the Generals. just like Saddam Hussain, Qaddafi or Mubarak and Sissi. in the end their countries got screwed, same would be our fate probably if the Generals acted again as holier than thou.

Another fact is taking out a rebellion or militant group is not as same as taking out its own people. my point of question was with reference to a situation created in Egypt, that an elected government is overthrown by military and people of egypt are resisting the coup... God forbid if same happens in Pakistan, and people go out on streets to restore their elected representative (unlike 99 coup and others), will our army open fire like Sissi is doing?

 

[Leader]

No they won't, simple example is the recent lawyer's movement. Some people are are using 71 as an example which obviously is dishonest on their part as there is a difference between armed separatist movement backed by one's enemies and a popular and peaceful protest for change in country's system.

welcome to the forum.

those people using the 71 example are indians, ignore them, they are nothing more than bugs.

and glad that you picked the question in right sense and gave a good example of lawyer's movement.

I am also of the same opinion.

but remember vacuum is very lucrative, for any status quo power house, especially when its attempted to be filled by people's revolution which is prone to failure more than success in diverse societies like ours. so why not crush if necessary, all in the name of holier than thou, as some have already pointed out?

 

[Awesome]

I trust that no general will give such an order, if it comes down to it, the general will quit rather than fire on his own people.

However if the order is given, PA will obey chain of command. But there still looms the possibility of a few disregarding that order. That will be a very dangerous situation for any country.

Hence I trust - no general will give such an order.

 

[Bilal.]

actually egyptians should take page out of pakistan's history, army turning guns on it's own people never ends well for the army...


They did it in esat pakistan, what mes you think the "present" are any better!

Wow! You will simply keep repeating the same thing like a drone and not see a difference between an armed separatist movement backed and cooked by an enemy state and protest for a system change? Twice military rulers have given up power due to popular protests, ie, Ayub Khan and Musharaf.

 

[HariPrasad]

Guy, They have already done worse than this in East Pakistan.

 

[Leader]

Speaking from a professionalism standpoint -- Egyptian Fauj is in a very difficult place between a rock and a hard place; a lot of the people here in Pakistan who blindly rally behind their Muslim Brotherhood brothers dont realize that not all those "protesters" have been peaceful

many regular jawans and even officers (including 2 Cols and a Maj Gen last week) have been killed by violent mobs; in some cases their dead bodies stripped naked and kicked around (HARAM)

but despite all that - the use of lethal force i think has been too heavy handed and many cases where it was not justified (based at least on videos i've seen on YouTube, none of us knows full picture). I know if I were a soldier in a situation like that and a mob were throwing rocks at me or fellow soldiers and in some cases firing live ammunition, i'd either show my rifle and posture ---or if needed, kill the bastard before he killed me. That's just instinct, nothing less!



if --God forbid -- we found ourself in that situation and the most difficult decision (Emergency Rule or Martial Law) was made --- then there would be curfews, any armed individuals would be targeted. Those attacking holy places of worship (including Churches or Shrines) would be shot. Those waving al qaeda black flags would be arrested and/or killed if need be.

That's just the way it is. When and where possible, they should be using non-lethal force. In the west they have shotguns that fire bean-bag bullets, those are very effective. They hurt but they dont kill (though they can kill if they hit you in the wrong place). If someone is clearly un-armed and just in a crowd of people, using bird-shot or sniper ammo on him is excessive.


I hope saner councils prevail in Egypt. The blood-shedding is extremely a heart-breaker. Especially for someone like me who has visited and spent a short time in Egypt (Qahhira and Eskendreyya) and has many friends over there.



Bottom line --> my answer to this thread is "yes"
@Leader

please change the thread title to "Would Pakistan Kill Its Own People In an Egypt-like Anarchy Situation"


the title at the moment is deceiving and would only invite annoying flies (trolls)

The title is fair, its not anarchy in Egypt, its elected govt overthrown by a military dictator, and people of egypt reacting to it, and General Sissi gone brutal on its own people.

yes, this all may lead to a civil war..

 

[Bilal.]

welcome to the forum.

those people using the 71 example are indians, ignore them, they are nothing more than bugs.

and glad that you picked the question in right sense and gave a good example of lawyer's movement.

I am also of the same opinion.

but remember vacuum is very lucrative, for any status quo power house, especially when its attempted to be filled by people's revolution which is prone to failure more than success in diverse societies like ours. so why not crush if necessary, all in the name of holier than thou, as some have already pointed out?

Yeah, I have seen a pattern in their posts already , they keep parroting the same thing no
matter how many times they are countered with logic... Seemingly the motive is not to discuss but to promote their view point no matter what... Check out the above post by hariparasad, exactly what I said

Somebody should remind them of operation blue star and all

 

[Leader]

Yeah, I have seen a pattern in their posts already , they keep parroting the same thing no
matter how many times they are countered with logic... Seemingly the motive is not to discuss but to promote their view point no matter what... Check out the above post by hariparasad, exactly what I said

Somebody should remind them of operation blue star and all

ignore them, they are jahils, they miss no opportunity to speak nonsense. they are mostly BJP supporters, rest you can guess what families they are coming from !

 

[Irfan Baloch]

-----------------------------------------------
Another fact is taking out a rebellion or militant group is not as same as taking out its own people. my point of question was with reference to a situation created in Egypt, that an elected government is overthrown by military and people of egypt are resisting the coup... God forbid if same happens in Pakistan, and people go out on streets to restore their elected representative (unlike 99 coup and others), will our army open fire like Sissi is doing?

NO!!!

it wont. not the way Egyptians have done

 

[K-Xeroid]

Report reveals Pasha?s admission of Pak-US 'understanding' on drones - DAWN.COM

http://www.thefrontierpost.com/article/25865/

 

[Slav Defence]

In this country,army has right according to article 2 B for martial law,in case if civil disobedience takes place,second they know when to make it valid and implement it.
Army will prefer to apply martial law rather then attacking on it's own public.
A country where military professionals like Capt. Waseem study sharia before becoming a part of decisive operation against TTP,then how can you even think of army going against it's own public?
A country where General Kiyani warned president Zardari that he will not go against public,then how could you expect your army to go against subject.
We lack the team of think-tanks within our civil regime,but luckily it is our army who tries to fulfill such lapse of policy making and thinking.

Best Regards,
Slav defence