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How many Pakistani members on this website respect Ahmadis?

Do you respect Ahmadis as Pakistanis?

  • Yes

    Votes: 45 67.2%
  • No

    Votes: 22 32.8%

  • Total voters
    67
I respect people because of personality.

Among Pakistanis, I respect people who are Pakistani first and anything else later on.

As for Ahmediyas. I respect and feel pity for them as they have been punching bag for far too long.

Though my favourite are always Atheists/Agnostics (like myself). ;)

Among Muslims, I have much more respect for Quranists than anyone else because these are the people who have atleast studied the book thoroughly which they believe unlike others and till try to find hidden gems/meanings from there.
People who do wish to give equal rights to Ahmad's are scared I mean Hamza Ali Abbasid dared to comment on that and got death threats the day after
 
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well they are Pakistani non muslim minority i respect them!
 
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I've noticed a lot of the liberal Pakistanis on this website showing love for Christians, Sikhs, and Hindus that are Pakistani. Do you guys share the same love for Ahmadis?

I personally don't consider Ahmadis as Muslim and have a certain disdain for them since they understand the basics of Islam, yet I respect them as Pakistanis. I just consider them as misguided people. But I find it ironic when a lot of you people show all of this love to minority religions, but then go on to insult and criticize them.

Maybe it's time for a lot of you brain dead sheep to either accept that you follow western trends or follow the basic principles of your religion.

Common Ahmadiyyas are not the issue. Every citizen of Pakistan is a Pakistani, it’s a given.

It is the leadership of Ahmadiyyas abroad and their vehement anti-Pakistanism which is the problem, be it Israel, Canada, US, or UK.
 
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Ahmadis are by far the most persecuted religious minority in Pakistan.

I, for one, agree with Jinnah and believe that we should not be the ones deciding/declaring who is a Muslim or who is not ... That authority/judgment lies with Allah alone... He doesn't need, nor has he asked us, our "opinion" in matters related to him.
He sent down an entire book filled with His opinions telling us exactly who a muslim is n who aint. Read it when u have time n kindly refrain from passing half assed fatwas.
 
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He sent down an entire book filled with His opinions telling us exactly who a muslim is n who aint. Read it when u have time n kindly refrain from passing half assed fatwas.

I am not issuing any Fatwa,
just expressing my opinion.
Almost every Mullah believes that those who do not follow his own sect are heretics. Why single out Mirza Ghulam Ahmed?
Read Munir's Report of 1954 when you have time.
And kindly refrain from quoting me again.

Regards
 
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Apart from the seal of prophet issue I was once told by my class mates some of whom were Wahabi/Deobandis and Brelvis that one of the reasons we don't like Ahmadis is because you declare Jihad is over, they said killing Kafirs is part of Islam, they were pretty annoyed at the fact that Ahmadis in UK ran a campaign for peaceful and coexistence Islam with ads on buses and media. I mean if this is the Islam mainstream Sunnis are inviting us towards then no thank you, I'm h
I am not issuing any Fatwa,
just expressing my opinion.
Almost every Mullah believes that those who do not follow his own sect are heretics. Why single out Mirza Ghulam Ahmed?
Read Munir's Report of 1954 when you have time.
And kindly refrain from quoting me again.

Regards
No its not about sectarianism and no they may call each other heretics in anger but no fatwa has ever been issued by a collective council of ulema of any sect terming another sect as kafirs. The problems between sects are trivial matters and not even religious in full body but somewhat political, the major difference between shias and sunnis for example is that one side believes in the right to rule of one fa.ily while the other side believes the rule of caliphs were legitimate, this is a political matter not religious. The thing with ahmadis is that they deny the finality of prophethood and by clear cut principles laid down by Allah and His messenger, no man who refutes the seal of prophethood can be a muslim. This is Allahs decree, do u think the decree of Allah is open for opinions of trivial human biengs like us. Some matters are open to opinion, some are not, there is a red line no sect has ever crossed, the ahmadis did it. There is clear consensus between every sect and every school of thought in the world of Islam that Ahmadis are not only the worst kaffirs but heretics.
 
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I've noticed a lot of the liberal Pakistanis on this website showing love for Christians, Sikhs, and Hindus that are Pakistani. Do you guys share the same love for Ahmadis?

I personally don't consider Ahmadis as Muslim and have a certain disdain for them since they understand the basics of Islam, yet I respect them as Pakistanis. I just consider them as misguided people. But I find it ironic when a lot of you people show all of this love to minority religions, but then go on to insult and criticize them.

Maybe it's time for a lot of you brain dead sheep to either accept that you follow western trends or follow the basic principles of your religion.



I love and respect ALL Pakistanis. I couldn't care less about religion or non-Pakistani Muslims. afghans, bengalis and indian so called "Muslims" are suppose to share our faith yet hate us with a greater passion than non-Muslims, Jews, Europeans etc, do. If an Ahmadi is a very patriotic and nationalistic Pakistani, then I will love him or her. They can believe whatever they want to, it's not my business. I rather love them than the treacherous, retarded, low IQ religious nut jobs who have done more damage to Pakistan than india could ever have done.
 
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No its not about sectarianism and no they may call each other heretics in anger but no fatwa has ever been issued by a collective council of ulema of any sect terming another sect as kafirs.
Wait what?
Watch from 17:00-17:21 min mark and this is just a tiny example of takfir that Muslins make on other believing Muslims not from their sect.
@M. Sarmad
 
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Wait what?
Watch from 17:00-17:21 min mark and this is just a tiny example of takfir that Muslins make on other believing Muslims not from their sect.
@M. Sarmad

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Takfir or the condemnation of a Muslim by another Muslim as a kafir is strictly prohibited in the Quran, the Hadith, and the writings of many eminent Muslim authorities. This section presents quotes from the Quran, Hadith, and Muslim theologians on the prohibition of Takfir (calling a Muslim as a kafir). Also, the view held by Muslim theologians' that a person cannot be called kafir on the grounds that he differs with a commonly-accepted interpretation of some religious point. One chief argument advanced by our opponents is that Ahmadis are kafir because the leaders of various Muslim groups have issued fatwas (rulings) against them, describing them as kafir. But the fact is that all these sects have also issued fatwas of the same sort against each other. Their fatwas declare Muslims to be kafir on the most trivial grounds. Therefore by this argument, every Muslim in the world can be proved to be a kafir! Ghulam Ahmad Pervez of Lahore is a well-known Pakistani Islamic thinker and writer, representing the Ahl-i Quran tendency, and founder of the Idara Tulu`-i-Islam (Institute of the Dawn of Islam). In the monthly journal of this institute, entitled Tulu`-i-Islam, dated August 1969, there is an extensive article headed Fatwas of Kufr (Rulings of Heresy) quoting fatwas of various Sunni groups condemning one another as kafir. All but the first two and the last section are taken from this article.

"``The non-conformist (ghair muqallid) sect, whose distinctive outward manner [of prayer] in this country is saying Amen aloud, raising the hands [during the prayer], folding the arms on the chest, and reciting the Al-Hamd behind the Imam, are excluded from the Sunnis, and are like other misguided sects, because many of their beliefs and practices are opposed to those of the Sunnis. It is not permissible to pray behind them. To mix with them socially and sit with them, and to let them enter mosques at their pleasure, is prohibited in Islamic Shari`ah.''

(This bears the seals of nearly seventy Ulama. Reference the book: Arguments with regard to the expulsion of Wahabis from mosques, p. 8.)
``He who calls conformism (taqlid) as prohibited, and conformists as polytheists, is a kafir according to Islamic Shari`ah, and in fact a murtadd [apostate].''
(Book: Discipline of mosques with regard to the expulsion of mischief-makers from mosques)
``It is obligatory upon the Ulama and Muftis that, by merely hearing of such a thing, they should not hesitate to issue fatwas of heresy and apostasy. Otherwise, they themselves would be included among the apostates.''
(ibid.)

Ahmad Raza Khan, the Barelvi leader, has quoted the beliefs of all sections of the non-conformists, and given the fatwa:

``All these groups are murtadd and kafir. He who doubts their being kafirs, is himself a kafir.''
(Book Hisam al Haramain)"

(Tulu'-i-Islam, August, 1969)

"``Question: What say the Ulama and the Muftis regarding the conformist (muqallid) group, who follow only one Imam [i.e. Hanafis]. Are they Sunnis or not? Is it valid to pray behind them or not? Is it permissible to allow them into mosques, and to mix with them socially?

``Answer: Undoubtedly, prayers are not permissible behind conformists because their beliefs and practices are opposed to those of the Sunnis. In fact, some of their beliefs and practices lead to polytheism, and others spoil prayers. It is not correct in Islamic Shari`ah to allow such conformists into mosques.''

(This bears the seals of nineteen priests. (Reference the book: Collection of Fatwas, pp. 54,--,55)

The late Nawab Siddiq Hasan Khan wrote:

``The word polytheist can be applied to conformists, and polytheism can be applied to conformism. Most people today are conformists. The Quranic verse, `Most people believe not, they are but polytheists', applies quite well to them.''

(Iqtarab as-Sa`a, p. 16)

Not only Hanafis, but all of them:

``The followers of all the four Imams and the followers of the four Sufi orders, viz. Hanafi, Shafi`i, Maliki, Hanbali, Chishtiyya, Qadiriyya, Naqshbandiyya and Mujaddidiyya are all kafirs.''

(Jami al-Shuhood, p. 2)"

(Tulu'-i-Islam, August 1969)

"Fatwa of three hundred Ulama against Deobandis

``The Deobandis, because of their contempt and insult, in their acts of worship, towards all saints, prophets, and even the Holy Prophet Muhammad and the very Person of God Himself, are definitely murtadd and kafir. Their apostasy and heresy is of the worst kind, so that anyone who doubts their apostasy and heresy even slightly is himself a murtadd and kafir. Muslims should be very cautious of them, and stay away from them. Let alone praying behind them, one should not let them pray behind one, or allow them into mosques, or eat the animal slaughtered by them, or join them on happy or sad occasions, or let them come near one, or visit them in illness, or attend their funerals, or give them space in Muslim grave-yards. To sum up, one must stay away from them completely.'' (See the Unanimous Fatwa of Three Hundred Ulama, published by Muhammad Ibrahim of Bhagalpur)

Deobandis should be declared non-Muslim minority

In March 1953, a poster was put up on walls in Karachi titled:

``Demands: Deoband sect should be declared a separate minority''.

Among other things it said:

``Just as Sikhs originated from Hinduism, but are not Hindus, and Protestants came from Roman Catholicism, but are not Catholics, similarly, the Deobandi sect originated in the Sunni community, but are not Sunnis. The representatives of this minority sect are Mufti Muhammad Shafi, Sayyid Sulaiman Nadawi, Ihtasham-ul-Haqq, and Abul Ala Maudoodi, etc.''

After this it was demanded that this sect be declared a non-Muslim minority. It was signed by 28 persons

(see Tulu`-i-Islam, May 1953, p. 64).

Fatwa of Deobandis against Barelvis

Maulavi Sayyid Muhammad Murtaza of Deoband has, in his book, tried to show that Ahmad Raza Khan, the Barelvi leader, was a kafir, a great kafir, Anti- Christ of this century, murtadd, and excluded from Islam.

(See the booklet Radd at-Takfir ala-l-fahash at-Tanzir.)
The opposite side

Ahmad Raza Khan (Barelvi) has noted the beliefs of Muhammad Qasim Nanotavi (founder of the school at Deoband) and Rashid Ahmad Gangohi (of Deoband), and then added:

``They are all murtadd [apostate] according to the unanimous view (ijma) of Muslims.''

This fatwa bears the signatures and seals of Ulama of Makka and Madina, and other Muftis and Islamic judges. Three reasons have been given for calling them kafir :

1.They deny the finality of prophethood;

2.They insult the Holy Prophet;

3.They believe that God can tell a lie.

Hence it is written about them:

``He who doubts that they are kafirs, is himself a kafir.''

(Hisam al-Haramain, pp. 100 and 113)"

(Tulu'-i-Islam, August 1969)

"You will have seen that all the sects, whether Hanafis, Ahl-i Hadith, Deobandi, or Barelvi, and all the Sufi orders such as Chishtiyya, Qadiriyya, etc., have had fatwas of heresy and apostasy pronounced against them. And not only sects, but the prominent men of these sects have had fatwas directed against them individually.

Maulana Nazir Husain of Delhi (Ahl-i Hadith) was called disputant, doubter, follower of base passions, jealous, dishonest and alterer (of the Quran).

Maulavi Muhammad Husain Batalavi, along with the above Maulana, was called devil, atheist, stupid, senseless, faithless, etc. This fatwa bears the seals of 82 Ulama of Arabia and elsewhere.

(Book Nazar al-Haq)

Maulana Sana-Ullah of Amritsar (Ahl-i Hadith) had fatwas directed against him which were obtained in Makka. It is written about his commentary of the Quran:

``It is the writing of a misguided person, one who has invented new doctrines. In his commentary he has collected beliefs such as re-incarnation and the doctrines of the Mu`tazila [an early extreme Muslim sect]. It is neither permissible to obtain knowledge from Maulana Sana-ullah, nor to follow him. His evidence cannot be accepted, nor can he lead prayers. There is no doubt regarding his heresy and apostasy… His commentary deserves to be cut to pieces. In fact, it is forbidden to see it except for the purpose of refuting it.''

(Faisila Makka, pp. 15--20)

Maulana Husain Ahmad Madani (Deobandi):

Referring to an article of his, the weekly Tarjuman Islam of Lahore carried the following extract in its issue for 10 November 1961:

``Maulana Husain Ahmad Madani, Deobandi, was a first-rate scholar and servant of Quran and Hadith. He needs no introduction. But one was very shocked by a letter of his which contained the grotesque idea of the denial of Hadith. This concept goes beyond the Mu`tazila, and breaks the records of the ideologies of Chakralvi and Pervez.''

All those whose record is said to be broken by Husain Ahmad Madani, have had fatwas of kufr directed against them. This makes it clear that Maulana Madani too is considered a kafir.

Maulana Maudoodi:

Abul Ala Maudoodi and his party have been the subject of fatwas by Ulama of nearly every sect.

1. Mufti Muhzar-ullah, of Jami Fatehpuri in Delhi, wrote in his fatwa:

``On the very face of it, these things [beliefs of Maudoodi's party] exclude a Muslim from the Sunnis, and lead to divisions among the believers, and is the basis of making a new sect. But looking closely, these things take one to heresy. In this case, they do not make a new sect, but result in one's entry into the group of apostates.''

2. Maulana Hafiz-ullah of Aligarh has written:

``Whatever was the position of the Zarar mosque, similar is the position of this [i.e. Maudoodi's] party.''

[Note: The Zarar mosque was a mosque built by some hypocrite Muslims in Madina during the Holy Prophet's time for the purpose of conspiring against Islam].

The word kufr is used about the Zarar mosque in the Holy Quran. Hence the same word applies to these people.

3. Maulana Izaz Ali, Deobandi, wrote in his fatwa:

``I consider this [i.e. Maudoodi's] party to be even more harmful for the faith of the Muslims than are the Ahmadis.''

4. Mufti Sayyid Mahdi Hasan, President-Mufti of the theological school at Deoband, writes in his fatwa:

``If an Imam of a mosque agrees with the views of Maudoodi, it is a hateful matter to pray behind him.''

5. Maulana Husain Ahmad Madani (Deobandi) wrote in a letter to Maudoodi:

``Your `Islamic' movement is against the righteous tradition in Islam. It is like the [extremist] sects of old such as Mu`tazila, Khwarij and Rafiz. It resembles modern sects such as Qadiani, Chakralvi [deniers of Hadith], Naturi [rationalist], and Baha'i [i.e. the Baha'i religion]. It seeks to make a new Islam. It is based on principles, beliefs and practices which are against the Sunnis and Islam.''

6. The Committee of Ulama of Maulana Ahmad Ali wrote in a poster against Maudoodi:

``His reasoning is devilry against the Quran.''

It is then added:

``May God save all Muslims from Maudoodi and the evil and deceit of his so-called Islamic Party.''

Sir Sayyid Ahmad Khan [prominent Muslim modernist leader and founder of the Aligarh University for Muslims, d. 1898]:

In his biography Hayat-i Jawaid by Maulana Hali, the storm of condemnation and takfir against Sir Sayyid is fully detailed. Read some of these lines:

``Sir Sayyid was called atheist, irreligious, Christian, nature-worshipper, anti-Christ, and many other things. Fatwas that he was a kafir were prepared, and signatures of Maulavis of every town and city were obtained. Even those who remained silent against Sir Sayyid as regards takfir, were called kafir.''

(p. 623)

``All the Muslim sects in India, be they Sunni or Shiah, conformist or non-conformist, the seals and signatures of the known and unknown Ulama and priests of all these are on these fatwas.''

(p. 627)

A fatwa was obtained from Makka, bearing the seals of Muftis of all the four schools, in which it was written:

``This man is an heretic, or he was inclined to unbelief (kufr) from Islamic law in some aspect…If he repents before he is arrested, and turns away from his misguided views, and there are clear signs of repentance from him, then he should not be killed. Otherwise, it is obligatory to kill him for the sake of the faith.''

(p. 633)

Jinnah and Iqbal [revered in Pakistan as fathers of the nation]:

Sir Sayyid had at least expressed views on religious matters. But these people also called Jinnah as ``the great kafir''. Even a true believer like Iqbal had a fatwa of kufr directed against him."

(Tulu'-i-Islam, August 1969)

Ghulam Ahmad Pervez, founder of the movement which publishes Tulu`-i-Islam, from which the last five sections were taken, was himself the subject of fatwas such as these two quoted below:
1. ``Ghulam Ahmad Pervez is a kafir according to Islamic Shari`ah, and excluded from the pale of Islam. No Muslim woman can remain married to him, nor can a Muslim woman enter into marriage with him. His funeral prayers cannot be said, nor is it permissible to bury him in a Muslim grave-yard. This applies not only to Pervez, but to every kafir. It also applies to any person who is a follower of his in these heretic beliefs. As he has become an apostate (murtadd), it is not permitted by the Shari`ah to have any kind of Islamic relations with him.''

``Signed: Wali Hasan Tonki, Mufti and teacher,

``Muhammad Yusuf Banori, Shaikh al-Hadith,

``Madrasa Arabiyya Islamiyya, New Town, Karachi.''


2. An organ of Maudoodi's Jama`at-i Islami gave the following fatwa about Pervez's followers:

``If they say that Shari`ah is only that which is contained in the Quran, and all that is besides this is not Shari`ah, then this is clear heresy. It is the same kind of heresy as the heresy of the Qadianis. In fact it is worse and more extreme than that.'' (article by Maulana Amin Ahsan Islahi, in the daily Tasneem, Lahore, 15 August 1952, p. 12)


One of the most famous public documents in the history of Pakistan is known commonly as the Munir Report, its official title being: Report of the Court of Inquiry constituted under Punjab Act II of 1954 to enquire into the Punjab Disturbances of 1953. The disturbances referred to were instigated by a number of religious leaders (ulama) in pursuance of their demand that the government officially classify Ahmadis to be a non-Muslim minority community, and take certain other actions against members of this movement.
The disturbances were eventually quelled by the authorities, and a public court of inquiry appointed with Justice Muhammad Munir as president and Justice Kayani as member to investigate the causes of the trouble. The inquiry went into the underlying issues behind the events, carrying out an incisive analysis of the ulama's concept of an Islamic state. Its 387-page Report, which soon became a historic document, was presented in April 1954.

Referring to the ulama's call for Pakistan to be run as an official `Islamic' state, and to their demands against Ahmadis, the Report says:

``The question, therefore, whether a person is or is not a Muslim will be of fundamental importance, and it was for this reason that we asked most of the leading ulama to give their definition of a Muslim, the point being that if the ulama of the various sects believed the Ahmadis to be kafirs, they must have been quite clear in their minds not only about the grounds of such belief but also about the definition of a Muslim because the claim that a certain person or community is not within the pale of Islam implies on the part of the claimant an exact conception of what a Muslim is. The result of this part of the inquiry, however, has been anything but satisfactory, and if considerable confusion exists in the minds of our ulama on such a simple matter, one can easily imagine what the differences on more complicated matters will be. Below we reproduce the definition of a Muslim given by each alim in his own words.''

(p. 215)

There then follow in the Report the answers given by various ulama to the question, What is the definition of a Muslim. At the end of the answers, the Report draws the following conclusion:

``Keeping in view the several definitions given by the ulama, need we make any comment except that no two learned divines are agreed on this fundamental. If we attempt our own definition as each learned divine has done and that definition differs from that given by all others, we unanimously go out of the fold of Islam. And if we adopt the definition given by any one of the ulama, we remain Muslims according to the view of that alim but kafirs according to the definition of every one else.''

(p. 218)

After this, under the heading Apostasy, the Report refers to the belief held by the ulama that, in an Islamic state, a Muslim who becomes a kafir is subject to the death penalty. The Report says:

``According to this doctrine, Chaudhri Zafrullah Khan, if he has not inherited his present religious beliefs but has voluntarily elected to be an Ahmadi, must be put to death. And the same fate should befall Deobandis and Wahabis, including Maulana Muhammad Shafi Deobandi, Member, Board of Talimat-i-Islami attached to the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan, and Maulana Daud Ghaznavi, if Maulana Abul Hasanat Sayyad Muhammad Ahmad Qadri or Mirza Raza Ahmad Khan Barelvi, or any one of the numerous ulama who are shown perched on every leaf of a beautiful tree in the fatwa, Ex. D.E. 14, were the head of such Islamic State. And if Maulana Muhammad Shafi Deobandi were the head of the State, he would exclude those who have pronounced Deobandis as kafirs from the pale of Islam and inflict on them the death penalty if they come within the definition of murtadd, namely, if they have changed and not inherited their religious views.

``The genuineness of the fatwa, Ex. D.E. 13, by the Deobandis which says that Asna Ashari Shias are kafirs and murtadds, was questioned in the course of enquiry, but Maulana Muhammad Shafi made an inquiry on the subject from Deoband, and received from the records of that institution the copy of a fatwa signed by all the teachers of the Darul Uloom, including Maulana Muhammad Shafi himself which is to the effect that those who do not believe in the sahabiyyat of Hazrat Siddiq Akbar and who are qazif of Hazrat Aisha Siddiqa and have been guilty of tehrif of Quran are kafirs. This opinion is also supported by Mr Ibrahim Ali Chishti who has studied and knows his subject. He thinks the Shias are kafirs because they believe that Hazrat Ali shared the prophethood with our Holy Prophet. He refused to answer the question whether a person who being a Sunni changes his view and agrees with the Shia view would be guilty of irtidad so as to deserve the death penalty. According to the Shias all Sunnis are kafirs, and Ahl-i-Quran, namely, persons who consider hadith to be unreliable and therefore not binding, are unanimously kafirs, and so are all independent thinkers. The net result of all this is that neither Shias nor Sunnis nor Deobandis nor Ahl-i-Hadith nor Barelvis are Muslims and any change from one view to the other must be accompanied in an Islamic State with the penalty of death if the Government of the State is in the hands of the party which considers the other party to be kafirs. And it does not require much imagination to judge of the consequences of this doctrine when it is remembered that no two ulama have agreed before us as to the definition of a Muslim. If the constituents of each of the definitions given by the ulama are given effect to, and subjected to the rule of `combination and permutation' and the form of charge in the Inquisition's sentence on Galileo is adopted mutatis mutandis as a model, the grounds on which a person may be indicted for apostasy will be too numerous to count.''

(p. 219)
 
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So you're pointing out the hypocrisy of many Pakistanis, but I'm sure anyone by now is aware that hypocrisy is one ingredient that our society does not lack.

I have observed the same two face nature:

1) Many Pakistanis will bad mouth Shias and Ahmedis. In fact i have even heard some people say to NEVER drink water from a Shia's home.

2) But these same people will fall head over heels to prove to foreigners how "tolerant" and "diverse" Pakistani society is. Are Ahmedis and Shias not a part of this "diversity"?

Foreigners should start playing pranks on these people by pretending to be Shias or Ahmedis and propose for marriage with their son or daughter. Then we will see their true "tolerance".


It's all about viewership and subscriber base to generate an income. This is the social media generation and they will do anything on screen to make money. You can give thanks to globalization for this.
Islam says to respect everybody.

I respect Ahmedis as human beings, but Ahmedis are Kafir.
 
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The thing is that I follow pure Islam, and I see Ahmadis as heretics. I go by what my father said regarding Ahmadis during the time he served in the PAF. He said that they are good people and are the same as us, but they are just misguided people.

The issue I have with new Pakistani Muslim generation is they are willing to sit at Sikh gurdhwaras and throw powered color at each other for hindu holidays, yet treat Ahmadis negatively. Why the hypocrisy? At least I am up front in my beliefs. But these new wishy washy liberals of today are just munafiqs that don't even follow their deen. They are no different to the averge hindus of india.

Even the people of Hunza and Northern areas are more heretical than you Ahmedis. They are really not Muslim by any means because they are Ismaelis, but when it comes to sharing pictures of Pakistan's Northern Areas and the people to the world, they forget their biases. Ismaelis are not even your average Shia, they are literally heretics. I mean honestly, how fake can you be?

So what I wanted to ask people is that do you truly respect your minorities and their religions or no? I don't respect religion of Ahmadis but I don't disregard them as a people. I've recently seen videos of Pakistanis going into gurdhwaras and hindu temples, but I've yet to see people vlogging Ahmadis. So why the hypocrisy?

See, at the end of the day, religious disputes and disagreements are something mature people can look beyond when it comes to treating people like human beings. I respect you for not budging on your religious principles unlike the ones you've mentioned, however, I think some people are just very afraid of sticking up for Ahmadis due to the backlash from certain quarters. That's a problem of intolerance.

I remember certain clerics themselves going to visit Christians during anti Christian riots in Punjab a few years ago. The same clerics regularly support conferences that calls for killing of Ahmadis. Ahmadis seem to be a special target for some. Atleast, that's why I think some people are hesitant.

As for religious dissension and heretics, the opinions of different sects about each other is not hidden. That's a completely different facet of discussion, which this forum doesn't really allow. Every sect/religion, considers itself as the saved one. It's up to people to use their own judgement and follow the one that finds acceptance in their hearts.

Well if some Ahmadis can please share with us what the Mr Ahmadi Leader (Massiah) of Muslims has done for Muslims in Pakistan would love to know?

a) Where was he in Kashmir wars
b) Where was he in Afghan refugee crisis
c) Where was he in Iraq - Libya - Syrian wars
d) Where was he is situation floods came to Pakistan
e) Where was he when there was famine in Somalia
f) Where was he when Sudan went thru sanctions etc
g) What did he do during WOT in Pakistan
h) Why is he not present in Palestine doing his stuff

Why do you put the burden of proof on Ahmadis, when it is you, who is saying this?

I am sure you're not stupid, and there really isn't any excuse for ignorance in the 21st century with internet available to all. Maybe you can research these above yourself?

I'll help start you off. For Kashmir cause, and role of Ahmadis. Start with the induction of Kashmir committee, i.e. who was the first president of it. Then move on to Furqan Battalion. My own grandfather also fought in Kashmir and later served in AJKF. Another hint, my DP is also of an Ahmadi shaheed of PAF.

Goodluck.
 
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Sunni / Shia ~ 100% Muslim as they believe the core Teachings for Religion, they mostly differ in certain interpretations and how certain members of society in their time existed and were respected. I personally do not find Shia to be any different in their devotion.


However.....
  • Ahmadis invent their own Guy who is suppose to be special and then run a hierarchy a chain of command of their own, and he is a prominent figure in their case, their views are contested and frowned upon by main stream Islam

It is up to government to re-educate such folks Re-training is needed
 
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Jahalat , should not be allowed to grow , when you have wisdom of knowledge in hand.
 
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Yep it's a lie people keep telling others and themselves that there is "harmony among these sects" and there are just little political differences between them it's all hogwash. Truth is these sects since their inception have been calling each other kafirs the guy whose video i posted is an ex Barelvi but now he just calls himself Muslim and has been doing a really great job of exposing these sects since last 9-10 years i mean he really have exposed them bit by bit. Do watch his video "Masal'ah 71b" you will find it interesting.

Btw you should watch it from 11:00-14:00 min mark you really have to
 
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