Fareed Zakaria: Let’s be honest, Islam has a problem right now

[illusion8]

I have said exactly this thing before on PDF. Just as Christianity evolved, so will Islam.

Where is the window open for reforms or evolution? see, it's easy sitting in the safety of non Muslim countries and talk about reforms to Islam - but try doing that in a Muslim country and await the consequences.

The only chance at evolution is if a few non Muslim countries say enough is enough and come together and wipe out considerable number of jihadi/ Islamist groups and the moderate Muslims decide to do the changes.

 

[third eye]

Replies in Red - click to expand.

You need to know the basics before knowing how to know that something is wrong with a car....What do I mean...Have you seen bimbos who cant tell how to open the hood of a car? Lets take a easier example, how many of you go to a butcher when the doctor says you require surgery?

Something is wrong with a car when it - stutters, misfires, emits smoke ,does not start, heats up , gives poor mileage to name a few. This is not rocket science - every user knows / realises this when it happens.

Or the car was designed in a versatile manner one that is above our thinking of how it can adapt to every situation from all alternative sources (solar to using hybrid technology to minimize destruction to the environment) BUT SOME people filled it with Gasoline because of their habit of putting gasoline in everything....Now dont blame the car if someone filled it with the wrong fuel and rammed into the public lamppost...

If a man is in a car that is ' above his thinking - he is in the wrong car or is a misfit for that car ! Wrong fuel does not make a car ram into a lamp post - the car wont start in the 1st place- wrong driver . A driver cannot blame anyone for putting Diesel into a Petrol engine car !! Its his bloody fault.

Or simply the driver needs to be changed and seen as unfit but doesnt mean everyone who drives it will be unfit?
THAT maybe the only key point though!

Yes, if those holding the steering wheel are goofing it up and taking the passengers the wrong way - they need to be changed & the passengers too have an equal responsibility to just not be ' passengers" and be led like sheep. They too must take control of their own lives ( & desitny).

 

[VCheng]

Where is the window open for reforms or evolution? see, it's easy sitting in the safety of non Muslim countries and talk about reforms to Islam - but try doing that in a Muslim country and await the consequences.

The only chance at evolution is if a few non Muslim countries say enough is enough and come together and wipe out considerable number of jihadi/ Islamist groups and the moderate Muslims decide to do the changes.

Think of it this way - the Muslim countries can oppress evolution and progress for only so long before they must submit to their inevitable progress. The wise ones will manage this transition peacefully. The stupid ones (in a majority) will undergo violent changes before they rise again in the proper direction.

 

[Hiptullha]

Some moderate muslims have been doing that. The problem is they get assassinated by the extremists in volatile places like Nigeria, Iraq, Afghanistan & Pakistan.

Hey, people get killed almost everyday in volatile places like Iraq and Afghanistan. Shows that it's got less to do with "moderate" (I hate that word) Muslims and more to do with the location.

 

[Indo-guy]

Orr....

Ever heard of free will...It is the free will of the person to choose to put whatever fuel...If they want to learn they would have from their mistake of putting in the wrong fuel and ramming the first time..But those who dont learn its their fault...

Err ...the great one who is above our thinking ..who made car and drivers ..and not to forget " free will " that decides our will ..

so we drive car made by him with drivers that is us made by him ..with ' free will ' created by him ...
did he or did he not create " Free will " ?

If he did create " free will " we are tied to it ..then it's not ' free ' after all

how is that all comes from him ..and yet he takes no ' blame ' or ' credit ' to what is basically his own ...

and how does his ' good -self ' allows bad to occur out of his design by his won designed ' free will "

May be the basic premise that there is creator is wrong to begin with ..

Orr...

The car is more intelligent than the dumb drivers and the one who designed it designed it so that the driver will learn as a kid learns from experience and that is called free will....otherwise we have tons crying that if god made me not believe how is it my fault well...it is your fault if you dont use your free will like the wise and ram your cars around...

Errr

oh so now he is not just designer of cars , drivers and free will but also a non paid amateur ' trainer '

and he has all the time to teach his kids---sometimes at cost of life of his child

what kind of trainer - father he is ?

must be pretty strict as well as gruesome father to subject his imbecile child through life wrecking teaching !!!


He sounds more like a masochist ...

 

[illusion8]

Think of it this way - the Muslim countries can oppress evolution and progress for only so long before they must submit to their inevitable progress. The wise ones will manage this transition peacefully. The stupid ones (in a majority) will undergo violent changes before they rise again in the proper direction.

I hope what you say comes true - but i only see the situation regressing in the wrong direction without a end or glimmer in sight. Agreed, there are a number of voices from among Muslims for reform and transformation - but all those voices are from behind the safety of non Muslims. Take a guess of whom the Saudi's have been beheading at the count of 2 a day? i would say that most are the reformists.

 

[Indo-guy]

Orr...

There is a word called Ignorance which the one who rams into everything is following very well and hence feels the need to blame someone or something so it def has to be the car or the inventor

why shouldn't one blame the ' grand designer ' who takes credit for everything but not the failure emanating from his creations ...

The driver must blame the car and the inventor if driver was in seat for namesake and everything is controlled ' remotely ' by inventor ...even if the driver has sense of ' autonomy ' of purported ' free will ' which is also if we accept Omniscience and omnipotence of great designer ....his creation !

 

[MarkovChain]

Hey, people get killed almost everyday in volatile places like Iraq and Afghanistan. Shows that it's got less to do with "moderate" (I hate that word) Muslims and more to do with the location.

Boko Haram has specifically targeted Muslim clerics who speak against them. Taliban has done the same. Stop living in denial.

 

[Hiptullha]

Boko Haram has specifically targeted Muslim clerics who speak against them. Taliban has done the same. Stop living in denial.

Living in denial? Just pointing out that they've killed more than "moderate" Muslims.

 

[DarkPrince]

Boko Haram has specifically targeted Muslim clerics who speak against them. Taliban has done the same. Stop living in denial.

because in the end people fight for themselves. my religion my rules my race my country

see the common thing ? its my or me

 

[jamahir]

@jamahir
come out of that worldwide govt. Thingy,,,smell some fresh ai,,,errr some fresh pdf threads,,,,like this one

this thread?? the five year olds have found a new reason to fight...

i have just two more replies to make in the worldwide thread after which i will ask the contributors to let that thread rest for a while.

ps- dont unleash all ur ideas at once,,,,one at a time,,give it time to settle,,otherwise be called a heretic

true... so i will now begin haunting the "jokes" and "stupid and funny" threads.

by the way, why can't pdf arrange "a-man ki asha" type of meetings?? will be good for world peace...

 

[Arabian Legend]

Islam has no problem whatsoever, you basically don't indict Islam based on acts of some individuals although some of these acts might in a sense be justifiable.

 

[VCheng]

Islam has no problem whatsoever, you basically don't indict Islam based on acts of some individuals although some of these acts might in a sense be justifiable.

Which acts by these people are justifiable in your view Sir? Please elaborate.

 

[The SC]

Oh Maulana! stop giving this non-sense logic... You are talking as if before Koran was written, there was no logic and evidence.. or Before Islam was founded there was no civilization.

much before Dharmic ppl of Arabia were worshiping al-aha (the moon God), China was well established civilization. Arostotle and Socrat were born much before Allah was introduced to Muslims. May be Islam borrowed some knowledge from east and propagate to west..

calling Muslim introduced logic and evidence is horse sh!t...

Maulana and Maulakom is Rasulo allah.
Evidence in science as a scientific proof , yes. before that it was philosophy, nothing more.
I have also said that Islam ideology goes back to Abraham...
Islam did not borrow , Muslims improved on every field of science and came up with many breakthroughs, never found before., they are too long to list here. You or anyone else can Google them anytime. Algebra, and algorithms will be a good start for your inquiries.

 

[Pride]

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By Alex Newman, a foreign correspondent for The New American, is currently based in Europe. He can be reached at

anewman@thenewamerican.com
. Follow him on Twitter @ALEXNEWMAN_JOU.

Obama Helped ISIS in Syria, Now Fights It in Iraq

"Indeed, as The New American reported in June, U.S. officials admit that many of the weapons being used by the Islamic State terrorists to butcher Christians, Shias, and other Iraqis were actually paid for by U.S. taxpayers before being seized by the rampaging barbarians. Before that, other American weapons now in the hands of those terrorists were acquired in Syria, where the Obama administration and its allies were fomenting and supporting “jihad” in a half-baked plan to overthrow the anti-ISIS Assad dictatorship. Some analysts even said Obama has "switched sides" in the terror war.

Worse still, according to Jordanian security officials cited by WND journalist Aaron Klein, the U.S. government actually trained some of those very same jihadists at a secret base in Jordan. “The officials said dozens of future ISIS members were trained at the time as part of covert aid to the insurgents targeting the regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad in Syria,” Klein reported. “The Jordanian officials said all ISIS members who received U.S. training to fight in Syria were first vetted for any links to extremist groups like al-Qaida.”

"Sen. Paul has also highlighted the troubling U.S. government role in the making of the Islamic State. “This administration, through bad decision-making that I specifically warned against, has already indirectly aided al Qaeda and ISIS in Syria — the very group some now propose to counter with U.S. troops,” he wrote, citing previous warnings about arming, funding, and training jihadist rebels in Syria. While neocons and Democrats were demanding more aid to the Islamists, Paul chastised them for supporting al-Qaeda. In retrospect, the warnings proved to be a troubling foreshadowing of what was to come."

You are just trying to define that ISIS is originated by US. Agreed! Taliban was also in the same boat but then their Ideologies made the things worse. ISIS is not "Fighting" any more but became a Islamic Propaganda tool. Don't you think that all OIC countries should go ahead and attack ISIS because it is ruining Islam's name? This is already tried and tested with Israel, isn't it?