Era of wars over, ready to resolve all issues with India: Pakistan

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Operation Blustar took place because Khalistani nationalist militants were taking refuge in golden temple....so yes, the assasination had a lot to do with Khalistan


i for one sure wont shed a drop of tear over the demise of that deprived, miserable woman

 

[Abhishek_]

Operation Blustar took place because Khalistani nationalist militants were taking refuge in golden temple....so yes, the assasination had a lot to do with Khalistan
i for one sure wont shed a drop of tear over the demise of that deprived, miserable woman

easy there AZ. some here like the lady for what she accomplished.
your dislike is understandable though.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

easy there AZ. some here like the lady for what she accomplished.
your dislike is understandable though.

This is a Pakistan Defence Forum so you'll be pretty hard-pressed to find a Pakistani (the people that actually MATTER on this forum) that would agree with you on that.

but anyways, im not in the mood to delve into pointless off topic - so chuck it

 

[Abingdonboy]

And that was? An act of insurgency! He obviously sided with the insurgent's agenda and by doing so he acted on their designs. I'd say he was an insurgent and a successful one!

No, there were TWO of them and they sided with Sikhs, they saw the actions taken in Op Bluestar as an attack on Sikhism as a whole as the Golden temple is the holiest temple in Sikhi. They were not insurgents, they served the PM up and till she committed this crime against their community. They weren't asking for Khalistan but were taking revenge.

They weren't insurgents-fact.

 

[Amolthebest]

We are all hypocrites here. We will comment here , being warmongers and then go to wrestling thread and will comment their about who is hottest women wrestler. We should think about man who lives in slum and a orphan who is nutritiousness before talking about war. We are guys who are eating in access and drink black lable. I am also part of this jingoism and I admit it.

 

[DV RULES]

We are all hypocrites here. We will comment here , being warmongers and then go to wrestling thread and will comment their about who is hottest women wrestler. We should think about man who lives in slum and a orphan who is nutritiousness before talking about war. We are guys who are eating in access and drink black lable. I am also part of this jingoism and I admit it.

Will not comment on Black label community but it is true that both nations has to bring mind in issue. There is always solution but now important who have courage to take step from both sides. Both government should sincerely make attempt to convince their nations that now only peace is they way of stability.

 

[Abhishek_]

Will not comment on Black label community but it is true that both nations has to bring mind in issue. There is always solution but now important who have courage to take step from both sides. Both government should sincerely make attempt to convince their nations that now only peace is they way of stability.

glad to see moderates on both sides are increasingly vocal

 

[Icarus]

No, there were TWO of them and they sided with Sikhs, they saw the actions taken in Op Bluestar as an attack on Sikhism as a whole as the Golden temple is the holiest temple in Sikhi. They were not insurgents, they served the PM up and till she committed this crime against their community. They weren't asking for Khalistan but were taking revenge.

They weren't insurgents-fact.

Whatever the motivation, the point in focus is whose interests they served. I'll give you an example, we call all factions resisting the ISAF and ANA in Afghanistan as terrorists, Taliban, Insurgents, Tangos, etc. However, there are diverse groups that have never overlapped yet they are generalized into a broad category of insurgents because the interests they serve are convergent. For example, the Taliban fight for their seat of power, the Haqqanis fight simply because they say that the US attacked them first. Then there is Hikmatyar Gulbadin's group, they fight for the expulsion of Americans but they are fine with a non-Taliban govt in power. However, they are all dubbed insurgents because they serve the same greater purpose. I hope I have been able to make my point clear.

 

[Amolthebest]

Will not comment on Black label community but it is true that both nations has to bring mind in issue. There is always solution but now important who have courage to take step from both sides. Both government should sincerely make attempt to convince their nations that now only peace is they way of stability.

Sorry if you feel I am biased but Atalbihari Vajpayee had started good initiative by visiting Pakistan and start peace procedure but Kargil conflict ruined everything. No point in gloating in past but i believe we lost a good opportunity.

 

[Icarus]

Sorry if you feel I am biased but Atalbihari Vajpayee had started good initiative by visiting Pakistan and start peace procedure but Kargil conflict ruined everything. No point in gloating in past but i believe we lost a good opportunity.

Agreed, we came pretty close to a breakthrough in 2006-07 as well, even Kassuri announced that the end to Indo-Pak rivalry was within sight. However, the change of government deferred the plans and 26/11 consigned them to the dustbin with the the No-War Pact and the Joint Defence Pact.

 

[Tamizhan]

Agreed, we came pretty close to a breakthrough in 2006-07 as well, even Kassuri announced that the end to Indo-Pak rivalry was within sight. However, the change of government deferred the plans and 26/11 consigned them to the dustbin with the the No-War Pact and the Joint Defence Pact.

Joint defence pact...

 

[Amolthebest]

Agreed, we came pretty close to a breakthrough in 2006-07 as well, even Kassuri announced that the end to Indo-Pak rivalry was within sight. However, the change of government deferred the plans and 26/11 consigned them to the dustbin with the the No-War Pact and the Joint Defence Pact.

For starters both nation should top so emotional and egoistic about each other. lets come out of delusion of Gazwa e hind or Akhand Bharat and lets create strong economic relations. My 2 cents.

 

[Icarus]

Joint defence pact...

In 1954, Liaquat Ali Khan proposed the Joint Defence Pact in response to Nehru's offer of a no war pact. In accordance with the pact, Pakistan and India would have a combined central military force under the command of a joint command system. However, Nehru set a condition that the No War Pact would only be brought into effect if Pakistan withdrew it's claim on Kashmir, Liaquat Ali Khan responded by tying the success of the Joint Defence Pact to a UN supervised plebiscite to be held in Kashmir. Neither side displayed flexibility and that's how we became enemies.

For starters both nation should top so emotional and egoistic about each other. lets come out of delusion of Gazwa e hind or Akhand Bharat and lets create strong economic relations. My 2 cents.

Agreed, there is need to increase people to people contact. The campaign of dehumanization of the other that our regimes have followed have lead to the establishment of deeply rooted stereotypes.
Indians believe that all Pakistanis are bearded extremists who attend madrassahs for education and are indoctrinated with an ideology of hate and violence.
Pakistanis believe that Indians despise the muslims for ruling India and will not leave any stone unturned to try and harm muslims in any possible way.

We need to get over these stereotypes and the only way of doing that is by increasing people to people contact. As far as my experience goes, Sikhs have the greatest respect for Pakistanis because they visit Pakistan for pilgrimage on a regular basis, get to interact with us and learn that we aren't half as bad as we were made out to be, same goes for why Pakistanis like the Sikhs so much, even though they were at the forefront of anti-muslim hostilities at the time of partition. They are the only Indians that Pakistanis regularly interact with and think that "These guys aren't as bad as we thought they would be".

 

[Tamizhan]

In 1954, Liaquat Ali Khan proposed the Joint Defence Pact in response to Nehru's offer of a no war pact. In accordance with the pact, Pakistan and India would have a combined central military force under the command of a joint command system. However, Nehru set a condition that the No War Pact would only be brought into effect if Pakistan withdrew it's claim on Kashmir, Liaquat Ali Khan responded by tying the success of the Joint Defence Pact to a UN supervised plebiscite to be held in Kashmir. Neither side displayed flexibility and that's how we became enemies.

Oh okay...that would have been a perfect example of an unworking,idealogically divided military with divergent loyalities.

What could have been proposed is a NATO like system with distinct militaries and command structures and a joint command existing in parallel in case of attack on either nation by a third nation.

But then no use in talking about it now, as there will be snowfall in hell before it happens now.

Indians believe that all Pakistanis are bearded extremists who attend madrassahs for education and are indoctrinated with an ideology of hate and violencee.

Again I repeat, if the Pakistan stops meddling in Kashmir and cracks down on non-state (and some rogue state) actors acting out of its territory and targeting India, Indians dont have any reason to be mindful of Pakistan. The madarsahs, beards..we dont have any reason to worry about anything. That is your internal matter.

Indian dislike for Pakistan is not ideological, but political and security related while I cant say the same for a section of Pakistanisto whom the hate of India is idealogical and no amount of political solutions can heal that.

 

[Icarus]

Oh okay...that would have been a perfect example of an unworking,idealogically divided military with divergent loyalities.

What could have been proposed is a NATO like system with distinct militaries and command structures and a joint command existing in parallel in case of attack on either nation by a third nation.

But then no use in talking about it now, as there will be snowfall in hell before it happens now.

Not really, the ideological differences had not set in yet and the Quaid never meant for India and Pakistan to be poles apart, it was possible at the time and would have gone off without much of a hitch, most of the units had been shuffled and Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims had all once been platoon mates. Oxford's 'A History of Pakistan Army' details a story from the 1948 war. A concert was being held for Pakistani troops near Srinagar and the singer started singing 'Dastan' a Punjabi Folk song, Pakistani troops were soon surprised to find a weeping Sikh Indian soldier in their midst whom had been drawn in by the music from nearby post. The soldiers had dinner with him and he was returned to his post with a healthy serving of 'Kheer' for himself and others manning the post.