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China will lose moral authority if it colludes with Pakistan: Air Chief

ome on, we both know that is a Fake propaganda picture.

China, the propaganda king "capture 5 Indian soldiers" and release the picture and NOT ONE of their face is clearly visible ? :lol:

Only ONE picture is released ? Not one name tag, not one rank. :lol:

Not one video ? not even half a video.

IT has FAKE written all over it. And you know it.
captured? They simply surrendered with smile, over 4000 of them,including your brigade commander John dalvi. :-)

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If that was true why are you still relying on 1962 pictures ? :lol:


China releases 10 Indian soldiers after border clash - report

Indian media report release came after high-level talks between the India army and the PLA
Sandeep Kaur and her brother Prabhjot Singh react after laying the wreaths of flowers on the coffin of their father and soldier Satnam Singh who was was killed in a recent clash with Chinese forces in the Galwan valley area
Relatives mourn the death of an Indian soldier in clashes with China. Indian media has reported China has released 10 Indian soldiers following this week’s border skirmish. Photograph: Narinder Nanu/AFP/Getty Images

Agence France-Presse
Thu 18 Jun 2020 20.01 EDT


China has freed 10 Indian soldiers seized in a high-altitude border clash in the Himalayas which left at least 20 Indian soldiers dead, media reports said on Friday.
The release follows several rounds of talks between the two sides in a bid to ease tensions after the battle on Monday, in which scores of troops from the two sides fought with nail-studded batons and hurled rocks at each other.

The 10 soldiers were freed late on Thursday, the Press Trust of India news agency and other media reported.


Indians call for boycott of Chinese goods after fatal border clashes
Read more

The Indian government made no comment but the army released a statement saying: “It is clarified that there are no Indian troops missing in action” after the fighting in the Galwan Valley area of Ladakh.
The Hindu newspaper said an agreement on the release was reached at major general-level talks between the Indian army and China’s People’s Liberation Army.
India and China have blamed each other for the most serious fighting in more than 50 years along their bitterly contested Himalayas border, where they fought a war in 1962.
Amid calls for a boycott of Chinese goods, thousands attended funerals on Thursday for many of the 20 Indian soldiers killed in the clash. Chinese flags and posters of China’s President Xi Jinping were burned in at least two cities.

Himalayan flashpoint could spiral out of control as India and China face off
Read more

The Indian military said 18 troops were still being treated for serious injuries. China has admitted that it suffered casualties but has not given figures.
The two sides have held a series of political and military talks in a bid to bring tensions down but warned each other in public statements.
India should “not underestimate China’s firm will to safeguard its territorial sovereignty,” China said after talks between its foreign minister Wang Yi and his Indian counterpart Subrahmanyam Jaishankar.
Jaishankar said in turn that China had launched a “pre-meditated” attack which would have a “serious impact” on relations between the world’s two most populous countries.

captured? They simply surrendered with smile, over 4000 of them,including your brigade commander John dalvi. :-)

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Tale of 3,000 Indian POWs in China

SourceChina Military OnlineEditorLi JiayaoTime2020-12-28 17:44:27
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Indian POWs bid farewell to the PLA officers before returning home.
By Sun Wenjing and Liang Jun
In 1962, the PLA military captured 3968 Indian prisoners of war (POWs) in the Counterattack in Self Defense on the China-India Border. What have they undergone in China back then?
"We were treated as guests"
At that time, the government under Nehru proclaimed that these India troops captured by the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLA) would end up being beheaded or acting as coolies just as those captured by the Japanese military in World War II. Therefore, once captured, the Indian service members often dared not lift their heads or immediately knelt down andsubmitted to arrest with folded arms.
However, they soon discovered that the Chinese were not demons: the PLA did not even tie the surrenders up, not to mention insulting and killing, but handed water and biscuits to the hungry and thirsty; meanwhile, the personnel belongings of the POWs were also returned after checking and registering. Brigadier John ParashuramDalvi, commander of the Indian 7th Brigade, a highest military officer of the Indian troops captured, recalled that he was surprised when the PLA soldiers never casted a look at his gold watch which he thought would be doomed to lose.
The PLA’s kindheartedness and justice dispelled the fear of Indian POWs. Some of them even took the initiative to help the PLA call on other Indian troops to surrender. In the end, thousands of Indian POWs were gathered in rear shelters such as Zayu, Longzi, Qiongjie, and so on for proper settlement.
Compared with the requirements of the Geneva Convention, Indian POWs enjoyed extra-standard humane treatment. In addition to being unable to enter and exit at will, they hardly had a sense of POWs, even could amuse themselves by participating in =cultural and sports activities, such as playing basketball, listening to the radio, and watching movies, and contacted their families. An Indian veteran,once a POW of the Japanese military in World War II, claimed that they were treated as guests there.
No aiming at China
The PLA attached importance to both guaranteeing the proper daily life of Indian POWs and imparting correct ideological education to help them understand the territorial issues along the China-India border. Twenty-seven Indian POWs were arranged to visit Beijing, Wuhan, Nanjing, Shanghai, and Hangzhou, and in particular, visited eight factories and a people’s commune. Senior officers among the captured personnel were also arranged to sit on the viewing standwhile watching the May Day celebrations and fireworks displays at invitation. In addition, the Chinese side also allowed some Indian POWs to go to the Indian Embassy in Beijing.
The captured Indian soldiers at the grassroots level felt personalistic equality and respect even more. Inheriting the British colonialism mantle, the Indian military features a strict internal hierarchy. They were accustomed to submissively accept their status, but the Chinese cadres resolutely put an end to this bad habit and demanded that both captive officers and soldiers of India work together. Meanwhile, the PLA cadres also set a good example and took the lead in undertaking dirty jobs.
Though the Indian POWs felt that it was just a publicity stunt by the Chinese at first, they realized over time that everyone in the PLA is indeed equal, with no distinction between lowliness nor nobleness. A PLA captain also took the initiative to deliver medicine to a sick corporal among the IndianPoWs, whosighed with emotion that "there are separated washrooms for soldiers and officers in the Indian military; it is incredible that the officers can deliver medicine to the soldiers in China!"
During the few months of capture, a majority of Indian military officers changed in thinking. When facing the indifferent and suspicious receiving representatives as they returned for handover, most Indian PoWs said to the PLA officers: "India and China were enemies once before, but we will never aim our guns at China afterwards!"
"I wish to be a POW in China forever"
The due diligence and sincerity of the Chinese military personnel have made a vast number of Indian POWs friends. At the end of spring and the beginning of summer in 1963, the first batch of Indian POWs released volunteered to send thank-you letters to the PLA officers before leaving, saying that "the friendship with Chinese friends will be maintained forever." Besides, some Indian POWs folded the paper money into garlands as presents of departing; an Indian POW sent a handkerchief embroidered with "Forgot me not" to the PLA officers,and some insisted on sending the ancestral rings or bracelets as souvenirs.
At the time of departing, many Indian POWs bid farewell to the PLA cadres with tears in their eyes, and some even cried and said that they did not want to leave. An Indian POW said directly, “I wish to be a PoW in China forever.”
During the handover, the Indian representatives repeatedly instigated the Indian POWs to "make troubles", hoping to save face to a certain degree. However, the Indian PoWs shouted “the Chinese and Indian people are brothers”, instead of "Long live India", and brought the Chinese souvenirs and books along with them to come home instead of throwing them away on the spot. One of the PoWs even brought up to 37 books back home.
(This article is originally published on Xinmin News Net, one of the biggest mainstream news networks based in Shanghai City. It is translated from Chinese into English and edited by the China Military Online. The information, ideas or opinions appearing in this article do not necessarily reflect the views of eng.chinamil.com.cn.)

 
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Defeatist mindset...literally india itself colluded with mukti bahni to fight an isloated army there with no support from west pakistan and talking about Moral authority..
 
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China would lose moral authority if it colluded with Pakistan to target India, said Chief of Air Staff Air Chief Marshal (ACM) R.K.S. Bhadauria on February 5 while stating he did not see China getting into a collusive kind of arrangement in a conflict situation to start with.

Every street cricket team has that one "Rondoo" kid who cries about other team bringing in "baray larkay" (big boys) to the match as an excuse for their own shitty performance lol
 
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The entire eastern command was 30-50,000 soldiers, when did that number triple?

Give it a few decades and this 73k number will go up to 730k and 10k vs 21 number at Saragarhi will go up to a million vs 21.
 
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So If you take his words seriously then the United States has lost its credibility because “ if you need another country to even threaten some country you have given away your weakness." Even Russians are openly saying India is a tool of US like Japan and other Asia Pacific regions to contain China :lol:
 
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claims" are not borders, they are just that. CLAIMS.
Borders are those that have been agreed by BOTH countries. Only certain sectors of the Indo China borderland have clearly demarcated "borders". Rest is only PERCEPTION backed by constant patrolling and no agression agreements .

-"claims" are not borders.
So what is India's current stance on China's 1959 Claim line?
Why was China's 1959 Claim Line militarily disputed in 1962 by a "forward policy" buildup?
Why wasn't there a "no aggression " agreement prior to 1962?

Why does the 5 point Moscow agreement between China and India refer to the Line of Actual Control or claim line as a "border"
See extract below. Four if the five articles mentions the boundary or LAC as border.

1. Both sides should take guidance from the consensus of the leaders on developing India-China relations, including not allowing differences to become disputes.

2. The current situation in the border areas is not in the interest of either side and therefore the border troops of both sides should continue their dialogue, quickly disengage, maintain proper distance and ease tensions.

3. The two sides shall abide by all the existing agreements and protocols on China-India boundary affairs and maintain peace and tranquillity in the border areas and avoid any action that could escalate matters.

4. The two sides will continue communications through the Special Representatives mechanism, and meetings of the Working Mechanism for Consultation and Coordination on border affairs will continue.

5. As the situation eases, the two sides should expedite work to conclude new confidence-building measures to maintain and enhance peace and tranquillity in the border areas.

Please explain the use of the word "border" above.


There are multiple agreements at various levels of government. All of them broadly talk about toning down aggression on the border land.

Agreements on "various levels" of government? Which exactly?
Don't government's usually have agreements signed by heads of state or foreign ministers?
What is defined as "aggression on the border land"? Aggression by whom and on which "border land"?


The day of the sword and the gun has almost come to an end. This is the age of information.
China has scrupulously kept to their side of the common Line of Control. It has only taken over our "claim line ". And we have taken over their "claim line" and then some (Kailash ridge).
So both armies have no reason to escalate unless china is prompted by "saving face".
If the age of the sword and gun has almost come to an end then why does China spend $261 billion and India $71 billion on defense?
Confused:
If China has taken over India's "claim line" ( assuming this happened first) then how could India take over China's "claim line" ( Kailash ridge whatever ) ? Does India control all the territory it shows in the map of Ladakh as shown in the official Government of India map?

Hitler INVADED Russia, China merely took over their side of the LAC without informing India. Hardly the same thing. Spiked club incident has been given a reply.

If China did not invade India or annex Indian territory what was the 1962 war all about?

US society, its capitalist model, its government model is all Predatory in Nature. Indian society which has never invaded any other nation for the last 5000 years is NOT. India has been the victim of predatory societies and ideologies for the last 1000 years at east.

Which India are you referring to? In 3000 B.C.E. ( roughly your time line of "last 5000 years" ) there was the Indus Valley Civilization portions of which are located in what is now Pakistan, Very little is known about the political structure of the government model of that era and if it was predatory or not. Last 1500 years would put us roughly in the Gupta empire of 450 C.E. which at the height of its power stretched from modern day Afghanistan to Assam and as far south as coastal Odisha.
The Gupta monarchs ( especially Chandragupta II "Vikramaditya" were totally predatory , fighting with rival kingdoms and massacring enemy populations.

"Relationships" between Predator and Prey never ends well. It does not matter how "willing" the predator is to accommodate the prey, in the end "Nature" wins.

The "Predator and Prey" relationship worked well for Ashoka who became Buddhist after massacring the people of Kalinga and it worked well for the Gupta Empire which lasted 200 years. So don't understand your term "Nature wins"

So long term engagement with the US will either turn India into a Predator or India will get eaten and digested. Both are not happy endings.

For now its an alliance of necessity. It is better to eliminate the "Need" than seek further alliance.

When has India eliminated the "Need" for an alliance? From 1840 onwards sections of India felt the "need" for an alliance with British Imperialism, and post 1947 till 1991 there was a "need" for an alliance with the Soviet Union. Now there is a "Need" for an alliance with the USA. Britain ate and digested parts of India for a 150 years and the ending wasn't so bad because that is why we are corresponding in English today instead of Prakrit or Sanskrit.

China is now facing a global alliance that is keen to end chinese expansionism. That is never a good thing.
Even chinese allies like pakistan recognize the unethical nature of chinese engagements and that honey moon seems to have ended. Probably the unhappy marriage would continue due to pakistan's internal politics.

Wasn't there a global alliance against China in 1962 ? Then China wasn't even a member of the United Nations. China was then facing an unfriendly Soviet Union and Warsaw Pact ( who supported India) as well as a hostile USA and NATO ( including Japan, Australia and New Zealand) . China didn't even fully control its coastline with Hong Kong and Macao under foreign occupation.
In 1962 there was no alliance between China and Pakistan. In fact shortly before 1962 Pakistan had appealed to India for a military alliance against China, because it has territory disputes as well. Later Pakistan solved its territorial issues with China .


China is nothing if not pragmatic and they must be looking forward to ending this self isolating stalemate. India will probably play ball.
There is NO Stalingrad.

China ended its self isolating stalemate at the end of 1971 when Henry Kissinger came to Pakistan and went to China secretly. China joined the UN and the UN Security Council membership in one giant step. This historical development effectively neutralized Soviet Union's spectacular support for India's intervention in the Pakistani Civil War.
The Pakistani China military alliance enabled China to break its geographical isolation through the Karakoram Highway ( now transforming into CPEC and the Gwadar links). The US China trade links enabled China's rise as an economic and military superpower that wrested territory from a collapsed Soviet Union. China also took back the territories of Hong Kong and Macao from the fading colonial powers Britain and Portugal.
China has risen to become the largest industrial power in Asia dwarfing Japan and all former European colonial powers that subjected it to a "century of humiliation" and brutal occupation.
Read China's history over the last hundred years then use terms such as "self isolating stalemate". A self isolating nation does not become the world second largest economy.
 
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This is what happened if a military Chief has to moonlight as country's top diplomat! The evidence of smaller paycheck, due to "1% increase on defense budget but 19% increase on 'capital procurement'".


 
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