Bernard Lewis, Iran in History

[Abii]

^^^
Get your medicine Apu, you're babbling your nonsense again.

There is 12000 years of documented history in the Iranian Plateu. You claim to have ancestors who came from Iran and that you're somehow superior for being a Zoroastrian. Well, before Zoroastrianism, there were other religions being practiced in Iran and before them there were even other ones. At one point Iranians became zoroastrian and many people who hadn't converted were saying the same things about Zoroastrians. Zoroastrians believe in the one god, in evil and good etc... The clergy is very similar to the monotheistic Abrahamic religions. In fact, there isn't any other religion more similar to the 3 abrahamic religions. Hardcore Zoroastrianism is quite backward compared to Islam actually.

wtf do you know about Iranian history anyway? Did you know that Iran under the Sassanids was a theocracy like Saudi Arabia? They were ruthless against the non believer and the whole empire was kept together through fear. That was partly why Iranians accepted Islam in the beginning.

btw, we're not "persians," we're Iranians. We were Iranian under the Achemenid Dynasty, the Sassanid Dynasty and we're Iranian today. If you knew anything about Iran you wouldn't be saying this drivel.

And how has India arisen? wtf has India done that's so amazing? The poorest shithole in Iran is still a first world nation compared to half of India. If you're so happy about being an Indian then why do you constantly try to associate yourself with us? Be proud of India. Your condescending attitude is unwarranted and quite comical.

 

[vsdoc]

^^^
Get your medicine Apu, you're babbling your nonsense again.

There is 12000 years of documented history in the Iranian Plateu. You claim to have ancestors who came from Iran and that you're somehow superior for being a Zoroastrian. Well, before Zoroastrianism, there were other religions being practiced in Iran and before them there were even other ones. At one point Iranians became zoroastrian and many people who hadn't converted were saying the same things about Zoroastrians. Zoroastrians believe in the one god, in evil and good etc... The clergy is very similar to the monotheistic Abrahamic religions. In fact, there isn't any other religion more similar to the 3 abrahamic religions. Hardcore Zoroastrianism is quite backward compared to Islam actually.

wtf do you know about Iranian history anyway? Did you know that Iran under the Sassanids was a theocracy like Saudi Arabia? They were ruthless against the non believer and the whole empire was kept together through fear. That was partly why Iranians accepted Islam in the beginning.

btw, we're not "persians," we're Iranians. We were Iranian under the Achemenid Dynasty, the Sassanid Dynasty and we're Iranian today. If you knew anything about Iran you wouldn't be saying this drivel.

And how has India arisen? wtf has India done that's so amazing? The poorest shithole in Iran is still a first world nation compared to half of India. If you're so happy about being an Indian then why do you constantly try to associate yourself with us? Be proud of India. Your condescending attitude is unwarranted and quite comical.

You speak the language of a slave.

An arab slave.

Associate with you? You are half breeds with nothing pure left of your once Persian roots.

Don't make me laugh Iranian mulla.

Just don't invoke Cyrus and the farohar everytime you feel like growing a set of balls.

 

[vsdoc]

Mullas go mental LOL

Monday, September 22, 2008

Iran: Parliament passes apostasy death bill

By Elizabeth Kendal
World Evangelical Alliance Religious Liberty Commission (WEA RLC)
Special to ASSIST News Service

AUSTRALIA (ANS) -- That apostasy (leaving Islam) is an enormously risky even deadly business in any Muslim country is not news to any apostate or to any serious religious liberty observer. That the United Nations High Commission on Refugees (UNHCR) does not always share this view however is news to many.

ISLAM RETURNS

Traditional Sharia Law mandates death for apostates based on the Hadith (saying of Muhammad) "Whoever changes his Islamic religion, kill him." (Sahih Al-Bukhari Vol. 9:57).

The decline of Islamic political power, particularly after World Wars 1 and 2, the subsequent rise of secular Arab nationalism, and leverage afforded to the USA due to its economic power led to this practice being largely abandoned at the state level. Whilst apostates were frequently murdered either out of religious hatred or for the sake of "honour", they were not executed by states that were under Western mandates, pursuing secularism and dependent on Western aid and trade.

But times have changed. An international revival of Sunni Wahhabism has been riding on the back of Saudi Arabian oil profits since the late 1970s. Furthermore, decades of brutal, repressive, corrupt dictatorships and declining living standards primed the Muslim masses for the "democracy" coming their way. Now, as soon as the opportunity presents, it appears that Muslims are ready to test the Muslim Brotherhood's assertion that "Islam is the solution".

Meanwhile, the Shi'ite revolutionaries of 1979, after being exhausted by the Iran-Iraq war and then constrained by a western bulwark (Saddam Hussein's Iraq), are now liberated, empowered, bursting with apocalyptic zeal and driven by the scent of Islamic leadership and ascendancy.

After centuries of decline and decades in the cupboard, Islam has returned!

Now Iran is in the process of legislating to make apostasy and promoting apostasy (including through the Internet) mandatory capital offences in the name of protecting the State's "mental security". This shows the degree to which the balance of power has shifted. Clearly the clerics in charge of the Iranian police state do not feel threatened by, nor do they care about, Western displeasure. In fact making the death sentence mandatory for apostasy and promoting apostasy is a very powerful way for ascendant Iran to make an offensive gesture to the USA, the rival power it is gradually replacing as hegemon in Iraq and the wider Middle East. It is a sign of supreme self-confidence.

Further to this, it is also a reactionary response to the reality that Iranian Muslims, fed up with and distressed by seemingly endless poverty and repression, are leaving Islam in increasing numbers. A recent sermon by an Iranian Shia Imam reveals how concerned the authorities are about the apostasy phenomenon and how determined they are to crush it. A Youtube clip shows a portion of a television broadcast of a sermon by an Iranian Shia mullah who is instructing the faithful not to worry about recruiting Sunnis, Christians and Zoroastrians into Shi'ism. For, he warns, he has travelled the country and the greatest danger is that of apostasy, especially young Iranian Shi'a youths converting to Zoroastrianism, the ancient religion of pre-Islamic Persia. "Don't let our Shi'a youth leave our faith", he thunders.

 

[vsdoc]

Iranians (NOT Persians) accepted Islam ...... riiiiight!!!!

From: The Shhanshh (The King of Kings), the King of Persia and Beyond, King of many Kingdoms, King of Aryans and Non Aryans, King of Persians and many other races as well as Tzis (Persian term for Arabs, meaning robin Hound Dogs), Shhanshh of Persian Empire, Yazdgird III of house of Ssn.

To: Umar Ibn Al-Khatab, Khalifat of Tazi

In the name of Ahura Mazda, creator of Life & Wisdom. You in your letter wrote that you want to direct us towards your God, Allah O Akbar, without having the true knowledge of who we are & what do we worship!

It is amazing that you occupy the position of Khalifat (Ruler) of Tazis, yet your knowledge is the same as a lowly Tazi rambler, roaming in deserts of Tazistan (Arabia), & same as a desert tribal man!

"Little Man", you offer me to worship a united & single God without knowing that it has been thousands of years that Persians worship the mono God & they pray to him Five Times a day! In this land of culture & art this has been the normal path of life for years. When we established the tradition of hospitality & good deeds in the world & we waved the flag of "Good Thoughts, Good Words, Good Deeds" in our hands, you & your ancestors were roaming the deserts, eating Lizards for you had nothing else to feed yourselves & burying your innocent daughters alive (an old Arab tradition, cause they preferred male children to female)!

Tazi people have no value for God's creatures! You behead God's children, even the Prisoners of War, Rape Women, bury your daughters alive, attack the Caravans, mass murder, kidnap people's wives & steal their property! Your hearts are made of stone, we condemn all these Evil which you do. How can you teach us Godly Ways when you commit these actions?

You tell me to stop my Fire Worship! We, Persians see the Love of Creator & power of inventor in the light of Sun & warmth of Fire. Lights & Warmth of the Sun & Fire makes us see the light of truth & warmness our hearts to the creator & to one another.

It helps us to be kind to one another, it enlightens us & makes us to keep Mazda's Flame, alive in our hearts. Our lord is Ahura Mazda & it is strange that you people also, just discovered him & named him Allah O Akbar! But we are not the same as you, we are not in the same level as you. We help other human being, we spread love among humanity, we spread Good throughout the Earth, we have been spreading our culture but in respect for other cultures throughout the whole world for thousands of years, yet you in the name of Allah invade other men's land! You mass murder the people, create famine, fear & poverty for others, you create Evil in the name of Allah. who is responsible for all this catastrophe?

Is it Allah who commands you to murder, pillage & to destroy? Is it you the followers of Allah who do this in his name? Or is it both?

You have risen from heat of the deserts & burnt out infertile lands with no resources, you want to teach people the love of God by your military campaigns & the power of your Swords! You are Desert Savages, yet you want to teach urban people like us who lived in the cities for thousands of years, the love of God! We have thousands of years of culture behind us, a powerful tool indeed! Tell us? With all your military campaigns, barbarianism, murder & pillage in the name of Allah O Akbar, what have you taught to this Muslim Army? What knowledge have you taught the Muslim that you also insist on teaching it to non Muslim? What culture have you learned from your Allah, now that you want to force-teach it to others?

Alas, Oh Alas...... that today our Persian Armies of Ahura have been defeated from your recently Allah Worshiping Armies; Now, our people have to worship the same God, the same Five times a day, but forced by the sword to call him Allah & pray to him in Arabic, cause your Allah only understands Arabic! I suggest, you & your gang of bandits pack up & move back to your deserts where they are used to live. Take them back where they used to the burning heat of the sun, tribal life, eating Lizards & drinking Camel Milk. I forbid you to let your band of thieves loose in our fertile lands, civilized cities & our glorious nation. Don't turn these "beasts with hearts of stone" loose, to mass murder our people, kidnap our women & children, rape our wives & send our daughters to Mecca as slaves! Don't let them do these crimes in the name of Allah O Akbar, put a stop to your criminal behavior.

Aryans are forgiving, warm, hospitable, & decent people and everywhere they went, they have spread seeds of friendship, love, knowledge & truth; therefore, they shall not punish you & your people for your pirate ways & criminal acts. I beg you to remain with your Allah O Akbar in your deserts & do not move close to our civilized cities, for your believes are "Much Fearful" & your behavior is "Most Barbaric"!

signed,

Emperor Yazdgird III of Sasanid

- The Original copy of this letter (632 AD - 651 AD) is in London Museum - -

 

[r3alist]

Odd, I don't think I've read any of his books.

Really? You might want to keep in mind that citizens of the ex-USSR and its former satellites honor Western historians like Robert Conquest for revealing to them their own history. Even though Conquest's books were forbidden in the Soviet Union their message got through and aided many peoples to rebuild their societies. A fresh eye can reveal things a tired one cannot.

So, what's your relevant point?

Everyone knows Bernard Lewis's inclination, and he serves a purpose for western purposes, big deal, none of this is new at all.

 

[Rafi]

--- not immensely relevant to the discussion - was just whiling time awaiting the return of Mulla Abii ---

Your'e an indian, what right do you have to castigate Iranians and their religion. Practice what you preach.

 

[r3alist]

An Indian Parsi, "exotic" person.

 

[SOHEIL]

Surenas is back. The Iranian who has never been to Iran with an exiled family living in Europe. It must be a miserable existence. I can't even imagine not being able to go back to Iran!!!!! I would also become a self-hating crazed lunatic like Surenas.

Now for those that read the drivel. Please sum it up in a sentence or less if you could. I don't wanna be bothered reading that crap. I'm too busy looking outside the window.

Troll is back

 

[Solomon2]

Yeah ,
and my candida lost against his opponent , an Eslahtalab !!!
don't try to changing subject !

I'm not. Which of us, exactly, has been "barking for his master sake"? We both know that participation was dismally low in the election. Truly, your culture is in its twilight, twilight.

 

[curioususer]

Two ancient civilizations, India and China, have re-risen and are re-capturing their annointed place in the world.

When will Persia rise again?

Will Persia rise again?

Does Persia want to rise again?

can't say which year but i can say with certainty that as long as iran is there persia wont rise.

 

[Banu Umayyah]

Iranians (NOT Persians) accepted Islam ...... riiiiight!!!!

From: The Shhanshh (The King of Kings), the King of Persia and Beyond, King of many Kingdoms, King of Aryans and Non Aryans, King of Persians and many other races as well as Tzis (Persian term for Arabs, meaning robin Hound Dogs), Shhanshh of Persian Empire, Yazdgird III of house of Ssn.

To: Umar Ibn Al-Khatab, Khalifat of Tazi

In the name of Ahura Mazda, creator of Life & Wisdom. You in your letter wrote that you want to direct us towards your God, Allah O Akbar, without having the true knowledge of who we are & what do we worship!

It is amazing that you occupy the position of Khalifat (Ruler) of Tazis, yet your knowledge is the same as a lowly Tazi rambler, roaming in deserts of Tazistan (Arabia), & same as a desert tribal man!

"Little Man", you offer me to worship a united & single God without knowing that it has been thousands of years that Persians worship the mono God & they pray to him Five Times a day! In this land of culture & art this has been the normal path of life for years. When we established the tradition of hospitality & good deeds in the world & we waved the flag of "Good Thoughts, Good Words, Good Deeds" in our hands, you & your ancestors were roaming the deserts, eating Lizards for you had nothing else to feed yourselves & burying your innocent daughters alive (an old Arab tradition, cause they preferred male children to female)!

Tazi people have no value for God's creatures! You behead God's children, even the Prisoners of War, Rape Women, bury your daughters alive, attack the Caravans, mass murder, kidnap people's wives & steal their property! Your hearts are made of stone, we condemn all these Evil which you do. How can you teach us Godly Ways when you commit these actions?

You tell me to stop my Fire Worship! We, Persians see the Love of Creator & power of inventor in the light of Sun & warmth of Fire. Lights & Warmth of the Sun & Fire makes us see the light of truth & warmness our hearts to the creator & to one another.

It helps us to be kind to one another, it enlightens us & makes us to keep Mazda's Flame, alive in our hearts. Our lord is Ahura Mazda & it is strange that you people also, just discovered him & named him Allah O Akbar! But we are not the same as you, we are not in the same level as you. We help other human being, we spread love among humanity, we spread Good throughout the Earth, we have been spreading our culture but in respect for other cultures throughout the whole world for thousands of years, yet you in the name of Allah invade other men's land! You mass murder the people, create famine, fear & poverty for others, you create Evil in the name of Allah. who is responsible for all this catastrophe?

Is it Allah who commands you to murder, pillage & to destroy? Is it you the followers of Allah who do this in his name? Or is it both?

You have risen from heat of the deserts & burnt out infertile lands with no resources, you want to teach people the love of God by your military campaigns & the power of your Swords! You are Desert Savages, yet you want to teach urban people like us who lived in the cities for thousands of years, the love of God! We have thousands of years of culture behind us, a powerful tool indeed! Tell us? With all your military campaigns, barbarianism, murder & pillage in the name of Allah O Akbar, what have you taught to this Muslim Army? What knowledge have you taught the Muslim that you also insist on teaching it to non Muslim? What culture have you learned from your Allah, now that you want to force-teach it to others?

Alas, Oh Alas...... that today our Persian Armies of Ahura have been defeated from your recently Allah Worshiping Armies; Now, our people have to worship the same God, the same Five times a day, but forced by the sword to call him Allah & pray to him in Arabic, cause your Allah only understands Arabic! I suggest, you & your gang of bandits pack up & move back to your deserts where they are used to live. Take them back where they used to the burning heat of the sun, tribal life, eating Lizards & drinking Camel Milk. I forbid you to let your band of thieves loose in our fertile lands, civilized cities & our glorious nation. Don't turn these "beasts with hearts of stone" loose, to mass murder our people, kidnap our women & children, rape our wives & send our daughters to Mecca as slaves! Don't let them do these crimes in the name of Allah O Akbar, put a stop to your criminal behavior.

Aryans are forgiving, warm, hospitable, & decent people and everywhere they went, they have spread seeds of friendship, love, knowledge & truth; therefore, they shall not punish you & your people for your pirate ways & criminal acts. I beg you to remain with your Allah O Akbar in your deserts & do not move close to our civilized cities, for your believes are "Much Fearful" & your behavior is "Most Barbaric"!

signed,

Emperor Yazdgird III of Sasanid

- The Original copy of this letter (632 AD - 651 AD) is in London Museum - -

Where is Mulla Abii?

I doubt the authenticity of this letter.
However, even if its true after all that nonsense, we killed him and enslaved his daughters

 

[Malik Alashter]

Odd, I don't think I've read any of his books.

Really? You might want to keep in mind that citizens of the ex-USSR and its former satellites honor Western historians like Robert Conquest for revealing to them their own history. Even though Conquest's books were forbidden in the Soviet Union their message got through and aided many peoples to rebuild their societies. A fresh eye can reveal things a tired one cannot.

That's really arrogance you think bunch of nations lost there history so they depend on some one else to show them there lost one.

 

[Redbull]

Quote letter:

The letter seems fake, using that many personal attacks against someone or a people is a late 20th century invention. When I read the bit about "go back to the desert to where you eat lizards and drink camels milk"- doesn't that sound like something a neo-nazi would say? And of course the letters shows "aryan" pride so it's consistent with thier ideologies. Please explain how it got to the london museum, I don't live too far I might go check it out.

 

[Solomon2]

That's really arrogance you think bunch of nations lost there history so they depend on some one else to show them there lost one.

Not really. America, too, have been enriched by the careful views and thoughtful analysis of outsiders. The Frenchman Tocqueville's Democracy in America is a classic taught in many American schools and the Swede Gunnar Myrdal's An American Dilemma: The Negro Problem and Modern Democracy was a milestone and key reference for the 1950s-1960s U.S. civil rights movement - even cited by the U.S. Supreme Court.

 

[Malik Alashter]

Iranians (NOT Persians) accepted Islam ...... riiiiight!!!!

From: The Shhanshh (The King of Kings), the King of Persia and Beyond, King of many Kingdoms, King of Aryans and Non Aryans, King of Persians and many other races as well as Tzis (Persian term for Arabs, meaning robin Hound Dogs), Shhanshh of Persian Empire, Yazdgird III of house of Ssn.

To: Umar Ibn Al-Khatab, Khalifat of Tazi

In the name of Ahura Mazda, creator of Life & Wisdom. You in your letter wrote that you want to direct us towards your God, Allah O Akbar, without having the true knowledge of who we are & what do we worship!

It is amazing that you occupy the position of Khalifat (Ruler) of Tazis, yet your knowledge is the same as a lowly Tazi rambler, roaming in deserts of Tazistan (Arabia), & same as a desert tribal man!

"Little Man", you offer me to worship a united & single God without knowing that it has been thousands of years that Persians worship the mono God & they pray to him Five Times a day! In this land of culture & art this has been the normal path of life for years. When we established the tradition of hospitality & good deeds in the world & we waved the flag of "Good Thoughts, Good Words, Good Deeds" in our hands, you & your ancestors were roaming the deserts, eating Lizards for you had nothing else to feed yourselves & burying your innocent daughters alive (an old Arab tradition, cause they preferred male children to female)!

Tazi people have no value for God's creatures! You behead God's children, even the Prisoners of War, Rape Women, bury your daughters alive, attack the Caravans, mass murder, kidnap people's wives & steal their property! Your hearts are made of stone, we condemn all these Evil which you do. How can you teach us Godly Ways when you commit these actions?

You tell me to stop my Fire Worship! We, Persians see the Love of Creator & power of inventor in the light of Sun & warmth of Fire. Lights & Warmth of the Sun & Fire makes us see the light of truth & warmness our hearts to the creator & to one another.

It helps us to be kind to one another, it enlightens us & makes us to keep Mazda's Flame, alive in our hearts. Our lord is Ahura Mazda & it is strange that you people also, just discovered him & named him Allah O Akbar! But we are not the same as you, we are not in the same level as you. We help other human being, we spread love among humanity, we spread Good throughout the Earth, we have been spreading our culture but in respect for other cultures throughout the whole world for thousands of years, yet you in the name of Allah invade other men's land! You mass murder the people, create famine, fear & poverty for others, you create Evil in the name of Allah. who is responsible for all this catastrophe?

Is it Allah who commands you to murder, pillage & to destroy? Is it you the followers of Allah who do this in his name? Or is it both?

You have risen from heat of the deserts & burnt out infertile lands with no resources, you want to teach people the love of God by your military campaigns & the power of your Swords! You are Desert Savages, yet you want to teach urban people like us who lived in the cities for thousands of years, the love of God! We have thousands of years of culture behind us, a powerful tool indeed! Tell us? With all your military campaigns, barbarianism, murder & pillage in the name of Allah O Akbar, what have you taught to this Muslim Army? What knowledge have you taught the Muslim that you also insist on teaching it to non Muslim? What culture have you learned from your Allah, now that you want to force-teach it to others?

Alas, Oh Alas...... that today our Persian Armies of Ahura have been defeated from your recently Allah Worshiping Armies; Now, our people have to worship the same God, the same Five times a day, but forced by the sword to call him Allah & pray to him in Arabic, cause your Allah only understands Arabic! I suggest, you & your gang of bandits pack up & move back to your deserts where they are used to live. Take them back where they used to the burning heat of the sun, tribal life, eating Lizards & drinking Camel Milk. I forbid you to let your band of thieves loose in our fertile lands, civilized cities & our glorious nation. Don't turn these "beasts with hearts of stone" loose, to mass murder our people, kidnap our women & children, rape our wives & send our daughters to Mecca as slaves! Don't let them do these crimes in the name of Allah O Akbar, put a stop to your criminal behavior.

Aryans are forgiving, warm, hospitable, & decent people and everywhere they went, they have spread seeds of friendship, love, knowledge & truth; therefore, they shall not punish you & your people for your pirate ways & criminal acts. I beg you to remain with your Allah O Akbar in your deserts & do not move close to our civilized cities, for your believes are "Much Fearful" & your behavior is "Most Barbaric"!

signed,

Emperor Yazdgird III of Sasanid

- The Original copy of this letter (632 AD - 651 AD) is in London Museum - -

Please play again, you failed this time. these people stupid enough and weak to show us how frustrated from Iran so they try hard wish-fulling they can bother with these funny documents what they really miss is that Islam so strong and reasonable to the Muslim people and non Muslims. the reality says that Islam is the must growing religion to the level many religious clerics from different religions working hard with all power they to stop it by any means and this guy comments and documents part of it.