All Clear: India To Sign Deal For 36 Rafales This Month!!!!!!!!

[Abingdonboy]

It's a nightmare to see that.. 21s 27s gone
Mirages, jags, mkis and LCA... Some 29s..
LCA number unclear as its HAL production rate
MKI upgrade program unclear when will it start and what will it contain

Avg age of mkis would turn closer to 15 years as earlier mkis to latest MKI avg age calculus

Mirages and Jags will have some 8 years till 2030 to retire.. Use conservatively to ensure numbers don't fall further owing to either higher flying hours of the frame or higher risk of any damage beyond repair.

Couple with say approx 70-75% avg fleet availability for all jets together.

Sorry but this will lead to sleep deprivation for many who thinks honestly.

You are looking at war museum numbers here.. I am harsh but then policy planners got to get their act together.. Or else the number are ridiculous say 500-550 jets with 272 MKI makes it fit for a much smaller country in terms of geography and economy..
For India its outright disaster..

EXACTLY. And idiots are honestly proposing this (still questioning the Rafale purchase) for the (soon to be) most populous nation on earth, top 5 economy (by 2022, top 3 by 2030) and top 4 military spender (by 2022)? The only people honestly proposing this are either increidbly short-sighted OR working with interests other than india's national interests in mind.

Even 36 Rafales (again, what some people are delusionally expecting) won't address this. 100+ Rafales (total demand is closer to 200 though) in service ASAP is the ONLY logical way to go.


Nightmare scenerio doesn't even cover the magnitude of the joke that is about to be had at India's expense should anything less than 126-189 Rafales enter service. It's funny I see a lot of "nationalists" running around on PDF but most don't seem to remember that the universal mantra of nationalists is meant to be protecting national security first. The weakness they are ushering in will only put India on the back foot on a strategic level going into the future- the US, Russia and China all appreciate the significance of carrying "long stick" if you want to be a global power. Perhaps the intellectuals in the media and civil service are too caught up in their Nehruvian pacifism to be able to see this.

 

[Taygibay]

Perhaps , you can shed more light on this subject.

Sure! In 2010, France and the UK signed the Lancaster House treaties.
UK-France Defence Co-operation Treaty announced - Announcements - GOV.UK

Part of this series of agreements on closer military cooperation included the Future Combat Air System.
This exploratory work on an optionally manned platform was signed in 2014 at Brize-Norton.
The demonstration studies are to give way to a program this year ( 2016 ) as found here :
ANALYSIS: Anglo-French FCAS feasibility study kicks off

The whole thing is alive and kicking. On December 23rd, France awarded a contract for an "ETO",
a technico-operational study about :
Evaluating the survivability of a stealthy drone aircraft vs A-to-A menaces;
Evaluating the risks associated with a higher level of autonomy through AI;
Evaluating the global cost of ownership of such a system, highlighting major costs.
Boamp.fr | Avis n°15-190097

The Franco-European precursor nEUROn is doing its bomb dropping tests in Sweden after over a year
of primary and then navigation / mission testing in France and a campaign in Italy concerned with RCS
and infrared measurements.

Have a good day, Tay.

 

[dadeechi]

The case becomes even more murkier if we consider say NLCA deployment in an ACC versus say a Rafale M deployment in our ACC.

The range, the operations, the load, the scope, the reach, etc etc kind of hampers it multifold. If NLCA was say synonymous to a F18 the issue won't have arisen. But LCA is a light category, implying a naval variant seriously limits the capability of the ACC.

So the cost verus benefit aspect for Rafale under MII can be made only via a substantial number and subsequent localisation.

The cost part over time would serve out to be far economical for raffy anyday.. Just wait for say 10 15 years.. The figures will speak

My prediction:

Navy:

F-35Cs, RAFALE-Ms & MIG-29s to be the mainstay while NLCA would be an insurance.

AF:

FGFAs, RAFALEs & SU-30MKIs to be the mainstay while LCA Mk2 would be an insurance.

AMCA would wait until there is clarity on the ToT and MII components along with the Indian Partners identified for F-35C, FGFA and RAFALE.

@anant_s @Abingdonboy @PARIKRAMA @knight11

 

[帅的一匹]

Tagged at 250 millions each, How rich India is!

Can Rafale field against J20? I think the answer is no?

 

[dadeechi]

Tagged at 250 millions each, How rich India is!

Ever heard the expression "economies of scale" ?

Can Rafale field against J20? I think the answer is no?

Frankly India would be more worried about SU-35 vs RAFALE than J-20 vs RAFALE

That is the hard truth that Chinese would not be able to accept.

 

[Indiran Chandiran]

Tagged at 250 millions each, How rich India is!

Can Rafale field against J20? I think the answer is no?

We can always borrow from the Chinese .Think of it.All the interest you guys will earn.

Perhaps you can request your govt to sell us the J 20.

I assure you I will personally petition the Member of Parliament from my constituency to meet PM Modi & ask him to drop the Rafale deal.

Since my duty on the pot is over, I bid you a good day.Do message me tomm same time.

 

[帅的一匹]

Ever heard the expression "economies of scale" ?



Frankly India would be more worried about SU-35 vs RAFALE than J-20 vs RAFALE

That is the hard truth that Chinese would not be able to accept.

J20 is stealthy fighter man, Su35 is not.

We can always borrow from the Chinese .Think of it.All the interest you guys will earn.

Perhaps you can request your govt to sell us the J 20.

I assure you I will personally petition the Member of Parliament from my constituency to meet PM Modi & ask him to drop the Rafale deal.

Since my duty on the pot is over, I bid you a good day.Do message me tomm same time.

If China and India settle the border problem and sign peace pact. It might happen. Rafale is too expensive, why you guys sturbonly choose it rather than F35? You don't trust Yankees?

 

[HAIDER]

The all-clear is here, and there's no way to tell it but straight. Livefist can confirm that India and France are all set to sign a government-to-government deal this month for the supply of 36 Dassault Rafale fighter jets to the Indian Air Force. A crucial final meeting on Monday, Jan 18 of the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) will provide final approval, paving the way for contract signature. France's Defence Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, a man plenty familiar with India as a result of the meandering Rafale process, arrives in Delhi when the DAC meets, spurring reports that an agreement has already been reached -- with formalities pending.

All 36 jets will be supplied in flyaway form from Dassault's facility near the Bordeaux–Mérignac Airport. The deal will be signed on January 25 in the presence of Prime Minister Narendra Modi & French President François Hollande who will be in Delhi later this month as chief guest at India's Republic Day Parade.
Courtesy: Livefist
LIVEFIST: All Clear: India To Sign Deal For 36 Rafales This Month

And Shiv Aroor is a no nonsense, close to PMO , and an authentic defense Jurno unlike india tv and TOIlet....

Are you sure ?.....make sure Modi knows its final call, after that he is going to pay high penalty and don't add new conditions in last minute. French will only sell Chicken, no eggs, no cage, no feed and med aid.

 

[Hulk]

Source Based Info:

1. The deal is for 36+18
2. India has assured a minimum of 80+ flyaway in increments bought from Merignac plan
3. The 50% plan offset under DPP 2016 is the route for MII
4. The IN has requested MOD for IAC 1 modified type 2 more carriers and IAC2 type 2 carriers. IAC1 modified version will carry 2 squadrons of Rafale M. Coupled with land based training and needs is normally totalled 1.5 - 2 x the ACC birds so around 50 birds per IAC1 mod type is planned for purchase. This need implies 100 Rafale M straight forward and perhaps another 1-2 squads for shore based totalling 120-140 odd Rafale M for conventional carriers upto 2030.
5. MOD has not approved this plan as of now and has indicated a detailed meeting soon.
6. IAC 2 N propulsion plans may add either another 100-150 odd rafales at 3 squadrons per carrier with land based reserves all together totaling approx 8 squardrons. USA has offerred F35 for such numbers with customisations
7. IAC2 aircraft decision not yet taken and discussion for a suitable package underway negotiated with both Dassault and LM
8. IAF has defined SFC need 80+ Rafales and 6 squadrons for activities totaling close to 190

Awaiting more concrete information

@Abingdonboy @Vauban @SR-91 @anant_s
India may become a much larger user of Rafale as its evidently clear that 5th Gen program will come much closer to 2027-2030 timeline giving a opportunity of 12-15 years to upgrade every depletion of squadron strength.


In anticipation for order , Dassault has started working for Indian order from June 2015. The original order was suppose to happen in August 2015 end. This is as per Ex Dassault people in forums

Sorry but looks unrealistic. We are struggling money for many projects and even 126 was too costly. This seems likes someone has listed all possible projects as going to happen.

 

[dadeechi]

J20 is stealthy fighter man, Su35 is not.


If China and India settle the border problem and sign peace pact. It might happen. Rafale is too expensive, why you guys sturbonly choose it rather than F35? You don't trust Yankees?

India is buying RAFALEs as there is no other aircraft in India or on offer to India which is better than RAFALEs.

Do not worry India would procure F-35Cs too. We will not disappoint you.

Yes J-20 is stealth 5th gen fighter ready for production but yet China is procuring SU-35s as it has too much cash that it does not know what to do with it. That is Chinese logic. Too hard for an Indian to understand.

 

[帅的一匹]

India is buying RAFALEs as there is no other aircraft in India or on offer to India which is better than RAFALEs.

Do not worry India would procure F-35Cs too. We will not disappoint you.

Yes J-20 is stealth 5th gen fighter ready for production but yet China is procuring SU-35s as it has too much cash that it does not know what to do with it. That is Chinese logic. Too hard for an Indian to understand.

When it come to fighter jets crash, no one could stand any where nearby IAF. Sorry Su35 is for Japan, not India. As their pilotes will piss on their pant when they see Su series fighter.

It test their psychological enduring capacity.

It's a torture.

I'm not saying Rafale is not good, it triple the price we get Su35. Do you think Rafale can Hunt down Su35 bro?

 

[dadeechi]

When it come to fighter jets crash, no one could stand any where nearby IAF. Sorry Su35 is for Japan, not India. As their pilotes will piss on their pant when they see Su series fighter.

It test their psychological enduring capacity.

It's a torture.

I'm not saying Rafale is not good, it triple the price we get Su35. Do you think Rafale can Hunt down Su35 bro?

We already 200+ SU-30MKI which would be upgraded to Super Sukhois which would be equivalent or better than SU-35s. We do not need another new bird joining our forces. We already have too many to cope up with.

 

[帅的一匹]

We already 200+ SU-30MKI which would be upgraded to Super Sukhois which would be equivalent or better than SU-35s. We do not need another new bird joining our forces. We already have too many to cope up with.

I'm just saying Rafale is too expensive in its class.

 

[Viper0011.]

We already 200+ SU-30MKI which would be upgraded to Super Sukhois which would be equivalent or better than SU-35s. We do not need another new bird joining our forces. We already have too many to cope up with.

I know what the IAF has. I just wrote a light post, but good thing finally getting done to say the least

 

[dadeechi]

I'm just saying Rafale is too expensive in its class.

An Indian quote says "The quality of the bread is dependent on quality of the Dough."

RAFALE is expensive as it has worthy capabilities.

FINALLY . You guys wait for a few more years and the next top line jet "Javier" will be out. Then Rafale would look like a Mig-21 in-front of the "Javier" (by the way, the "J" of the name Javier is pronounced as the "H")!!

Man, this is good news. I was 10 when I started hearing about this jet called Rafale going to India. Then the Brits did the east India company, and then there were wars and then India became free from the Britts and like 70 years after, guess what??? The RAFALE is coming

Btw, I wrote the story with a light heart to make you guys smile. So SMILE. Good development, would love to this puppy being flown along with the SU-30's (and would like to know who's the real daddy in simulated combat)

Even most Indians have lost interest in following this deal.