27 million out of schools

[RiazHaq]

No but a lot of those illiterate adults have died in the past ten years, and replaced by literate youth. How else do you think that India's literacy rate has gone up from 64% in 2001 to 74% in 2011 ?

That's a lot of deaths.

It shows India has much higher pre-mature mortality rate than Pakistan.

Haq's Musings: World Health Day in Pakistan: Premature Death Rate Declines Amidst Rising Violence

 

[Roybot]

That's a lot of deaths.

Well yes in ten years that d be a lot of deaths.

Pakistan has a lower death rate, and lower enrollment rate than India, explains why Pakistan's literacy rate hasn't seen much improvement. Makes perfect sense.

 

[Yogi]

@<u><a href="http://www.defence.pk/forums/member.php?u=38719" target="_blank">FaujHistorian</a></u>

i saw this video a few days back n was really shocked to see the state of education in Pakistan. It covers all major statistics any of u might be wanting to know.

All i can say the New Govt better start doing some work as quickly as it can..

[video]m.youtube.com/watch?v=YCGIg0-URMM&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DYCGIg0-URMM[/video]

 

[INDIC]

@Argus Panoptes @FaujHistorian
Main reason is poverty and ignorance about the importance of education. In India, the free midday meal program came as an easy solution for such problem considerably increasing the number of kids going to school.

Here's a success story about how the continuous efforts by volunteers, acdemicians and policymakers have paid off and a 120 million children across India are going to school everyday. Enrollment rate increased by 15.3%.

Good News: India's mid day meal scheme successful - YouTube

 

[Leader]

A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan


A quiet and peaceful revolution is taking place in South Waziristan. Girls, with the support and protection of the tribal elders and the community, are going to school. The Chaghmalai Government Girls High School is about to open its doors to welcome its first 269 students.
After staying several years in internally displaced persons’ camps or with host families elsewhere, locals are returning to South Waziristan. Due to extensive destruction during the conflict, starting again has been tough, especially for the poorest and the most vulnerable. Despite these hardships, a positive development has emerged — communities are passionate to educate their children, both boys and girls.


A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan &#8211; The Express Tribune

 

[neehar]

This figure of 78% out-of-school children in Baluchistan is not a surprise given that these are pre-school children aged 3-5 years. Early childhood schooling don't really exist in most of the developing world including India. But most of these are very likely to enter primary school at the age of 5+.

An important point to note in Barro-Lee dataset (Barro & Lee are Harvard University researchers) is that Pakistan has been increasing enrollment of students in schools at a faster rate since 1990 than India. In 1990, there were 66.2% of Pakistanis vs 51.6% of Indians who had no schooling. In 2000, there were 60.2% Pakistanis vs 43% Indians with no schooling. In 2010, Pakistan reduced it to 38% vs India's 32.7%.

Haq's Musings: Educational Attainment in India & Pakistan

india decreased its "out of school" students by about 40 % from 2005 to 2009 thats just a span of 4 years alone..we spend about 12% of our total expenditure about $62 billions only on education.u can get the other details here

http://indiabudget.nic.in/es2012-13/echap-13.pdf

education is a fundamental right granted by the constitution india under article 21-A
heres few govt schemes to spread education in india
sarva siksha abhiyan
http://ssa.nic.in/
mid day meal scheme
http://mdm.nic.in/
rashtriya madhyamik siksha abhiyan
http://mhrd.gov.in/rashtriya_madhyamik_shiksha_abhiyan

and others
http://sednmp.nic.in/schemes.htm

 

[FaujHistorian]

I completely agree...expanding on your idea, one thing we forget is the folks who fail. They aren't complete numbskulls, they arent dunces, instead they alao have some ability.

What happens in our education system is that it doesn't cater to the need of the student. We just put a student who gets above 80 percent in Science group, others get into Arts etc. This isn't the way to go. Getting 80 percent doesn't mean you are a master in all things. A student who is very bright mentally might not be able to fit in the rote learning system we employ, hence he gets low grades and is regarded as a failure and slowly within 3 years or so he flunks out of school and gets into drugs or something like that.

His life gets ruined.

What needs to be done is cater to their specialties. For example, I have seen alot of children who are complete failures in school, they couldn't do a ratta on chemistry formulas or Maths equations or anything, but they are top level in computer stuff. Students who do not achieve in class should be adjusted somewhere.

If a student doesn't achieve, then after getting his guardian's consent, put him in some other program e.g a child who doesn't get maths or physics should instead be taught farming so he can help his father. The tag of educated or skilled will attach him and he will do something he knows due to his father. It's a win win situation.

Similarly, the son of a plumber should be taught plumbing if he doesn't achieve in Maths or physics...he would have a diploma to carry, will be a skilled guy with some knowledge etc.

NOt everybody is a complete idiot, everybody has some speciality, and that speciality need not be of Maths or Physics or a sin formula.

Absolutely.

This is one aspect that I didn't cover in my earlier post.


Bottom line:

-- Education is a process that nations use to prepare their youth to help with the need of workers.

-- If today we need more engineers than doctors, adjust the process
-- If today we need more doctors than engineers, adjust the process
-- If today we need more mechanics and auto-workers, adjust the process


An so on and so forth.

When it comes to schooling, we are so used to British style school system, that we tend to ignore the German style of school system (especially the system they had before 70s).


One reason Germany is doing so well in EU, is their long term education system. That their workers can complete with Chinese labor rates. How? German worker's quality products.


peace

A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan


A quiet and peaceful revolution is taking place in South Waziristan. Girls, with the support and protection of the tribal elders and the community, are going to school. The Chaghmalai Government Girls High School is about to open its doors to welcome its first 269 students.
After staying several years in internally displaced persons’ camps or with host families elsewhere, locals are returning to South Waziristan. Due to extensive destruction during the conflict, starting again has been tough, especially for the poorest and the most vulnerable. Despite these hardships, a positive development has emerged — communities are passionate to educate their children, both boys and girls.


A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan – The Express Tribune

Brought tears to my eyes.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[neehar]

So you think India has a massive adult education program that has educated most of the 270 million illiterate adults since 2004?

Just think about it!!

Please also note that the percentage of 3-5 yr old children expected to enter school is much higher in Pakistan than in India.

litereacy rate in india is 74% and thats 2011 stats..Literacy Rate for India Population Census 2011

and yes we have massive education programmes one of the largest in the world.we spend about $62 billions only on education.for other details u can see #post 66

 

[FaujHistorian]

@Argus Panoptes @FaujHistorian
Main reason is poverty and ignorance about the importance of education. In India, the free midday meal program came as an easy solution for such problem considerably increasing the number of kids going to school.



Good News: India's mid day meal scheme successful - YouTube[url]

Good for India.

Although in Pakistan, the level of hunger among children is slightly lower than what is in India.

Nothing to boast about.

Just that there is lot more food available.

However this Hunger level can change drastically for the worse, in case of major calamities like flood or earth quake.

One of the things that doesn't show up in the GDP stats is the fact that school education system is Pakistan has gone private in huge numbers.


And that's OK.


People don't want to tax to the government to run schools. Guess what. They pay directly to the schools.


So many of these numbers spewed around are largely incorrect.


Not that we don't have problem. We do,.


But our solutions are going to be different from the ones in India.


Our culture is different and so are the budgets and related approaches.


But I kid you not, we have ways to keep our percentage of students etc. close to that of India. Sure in some cases there is a gap of 10-15 years.

But then in history like ours. What's with 20 years here and there. They go by as if they are minutes.


So I hope Indian posters would now calm down,

take a deep breath

and stop jumping up and down pointing to the "lowly" untouchables across the border. because we are not.


peace

 

[INDIC]

Good for India.

Although in Pakistan, the level of hunger among children is slightly lower than what is in India.

Nothing to boast about.

Just that there is lot more food available.

However this Hunger level can change drastically for the worse, in case of major calamities like flood or earth quake.

One of the things that doesn't show up in the GDP stats is the fact that school education system is Pakistan has gone private in huge numbers.


And that's OK.


People don't want to tax to the government to run schools. Guess what. They pay directly to the schools.


So many of these numbers spewed around are largely incorrect.


Not that we don't have problem. We do,.


But our solutions are going to be different from the ones in India.


Our culture is different and so are the budgets and related approaches.


But I kid you not, we have ways to keep our percentage of students etc. close to that of India. Sure in some cases there is a gap of 10-15 years.

But then in history like ours. What's with 20 years here and there. They go by as if they are minutes.


So I hope Indian posters would now calm down,

take a deep breath

and stop jumping up and down pointing to the "lowly" untouchables across the border. because we are not.


peace

What sort of different solution.

 

[FaujHistorian]

What sort of different solution.

Local solutions.

Where school is "owned" by the locals, run by the locals.

In the next phase we should allow them to have a small set of compulsory courses, and then allow them to pick and choose the rest.


If a school is dominated by farming area people, we need to make sure that students learn different kinds of soil, planting, harvesting. Instead of rote learning, they should be given school credits for working in the field.

Same thing is true with other areas dominated by whatever.


It is time we allowed local solutions to come up, instead of imposing big brother big budget methods from the top.


peace

 

[Leader]

A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan


A quiet and peaceful revolution is taking place in South Waziristan. Girls, with the support and protection of the tribal elders and the community, are going to school. The Chaghmalai Government Girls High School is about to open its doors to welcome its first 269 students.
After staying several years in internally displaced persons’ camps or with host families elsewhere, locals are returning to South Waziristan. Due to extensive destruction during the conflict, starting again has been tough, especially for the poorest and the most vulnerable. Despite these hardships, a positive development has emerged — communities are passionate to educate their children, both boys and girls.


A peaceful revolution in South Waziristan &#8211; The Express Tribune

 

[jha]

These "Brahmins from British style education" tend to look down at anyone who works with his own two hands.

Sort of a throw back to the good old Shudra class treatment for anyone who does the "low-class" jobs of being a car-mechanic, carpenter, black smith, etc.

This mentality prevails all over the world. Blue collar jobs are not a favourite any where. Any person given a chance will grab a white collar job over these. Simply because it pays more and does not involve much physical work.

And quit using term " Brahmin" as a pariah. Whole society was responsible for creation of untouchable class.

OT 78% in balochistan and 65 % in KPK is alarming. I guess FATA's condition would be anywhere between these two.
GoP should invest madly in education sector in these areas. There is no alternative to education. We have seen this in naxal affected areas.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Is the % for real??? I honestly do not now whats the % for India, but I sure do hope its not as abysmal.

 

[RiazHaq]

india decreased its "out of school" students by about 40 % from 2005 to 2009 thats just a span of 4 years alone..we spend about 12% of our total expenditure about $62 billions only on education.u can get the other details here

http://indiabudget.nic.in/es2012-13/echap-13.pdf

education is a fundamental right granted by the constitution india under article 21-A
heres few govt schemes to spread education in india
sarva siksha abhiyan
Portal &mdash; Portal
mid day meal scheme
Mid Day Meal Scheme
rashtriya madhyamik siksha abhiyan
Home: Department of School Education & Literacy - Ministry of Human Resource Development, Government of India

and others
Schemes Running Under School Education Department

You are comparing apples and oranges. The out-of-school figures in your link are for 6-14 years age group while the figures in the Express Tribune article are for 3-5 years age group.

An important point to note in Harvard's Barro-Lee dataset is that Pakistan has been increasing enrollment of students in schools at a faster rate since 1990 than India. In 1990, there were 66.2% of Pakistanis vs 51.6% of Indians who had no schooling. In 2000, there were 60.2% Pakistanis vs 43% Indians with no schooling. In 2010, Pakistan reduced it to 38% vs India's 32.7%.

Haq's Musings: Educational Attainment in India & Pakistan