27 Feb 19: PAF shot down two Indian aircrafts inside Pakistani airspace: DG ISPR

[Ultima Thule]

@seven0seven see another Israeli pilot moment.
It's not difficult to conjure of such wild stories.

Desperate people in awe of a foe 10 times bigger since ever and lot more helpless since August 5, have to live in make believe world. While Indian forces are calm as cucumber and only waiting for the next signal from Modi to cross LoC again.

And we are ready to embarrass you again, and what you achieves in 26/2/2019/ please tell me that

 

[Myth_buster_1]

@seven0seven see another Israeli pilot moment.
It's not difficult to conjure of such wild stories.

Desperate people in awe of a foe 10 times bigger since ever and lot more helpless since August 5, have to live in make believe world. While Indian forces are calm as cucumber and only waiting for the next signal from Modi to cross LoC again.

IAF FANBOYS: MODI G MODI G Pakistanis hamari G**D mar rahai hai 27th feb kay baad kuch karia naaaaa
MODI G:
Pakistanis:

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Its a very fun to see comments on this thread... Full of entertainment...

It always remind me 2017 championship trophy... People will enjoy many years and does not matter even they loose in world cup tournaments..

 

[SIPRA]

Leave them!

They will always trust and believe on ISPR statements and does not matter, its true or false claim.

And you would be trusting and believing that thug and criminal Cheewala, in the meanwhile.

 

[newb3e]

indians dont tire it seems!!

2 jahaz gira diye,pilot zaleel karwa dia! lakin mou keh fire khatam he nai ho rahay!!

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Its a very fun to see comments on this thread... Full of entertainment...

It always remind me 2017 championship trophy... People will enjoy many years and does not matter even they loose in world cup tournaments..

At the end of the day India has lost more matches to Pakistan

 

[Ultima Thule]

Its a very fun to see comments on this thread... Full of entertainment...

It always remind me 2017 championship trophy... People will enjoy many years and does not matter even they loose in world cup tournaments..

This is not a cricket match but battle/war

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

This is not a cricket match but battle/war

I don't see, Man!

Anything to be proud on a very small incident. Past 70 years, India had loose territory to only against China in 1962.

Apart of this lost, Indian army has only achieved but not loose anything.

That's all only matters at the end!

Its a fun reading to see the comments for a very small incident.

 

[Suriya]

A very Good read for those who are interested in knowing how Su-30s dodged AMRAAMs fired at them.

The idea of a 'valid' kill is essentially an assumption based upon some reasoning and evidences. A 'confirmed' kill is when there are eyewitnesses of the event, something that often occurred back in WW II when air combat were always within visual range. A 'valid' kill is when we declared that based upon A, B, and C, there is a greater than %X probability that the target did not survive. A 'valid' kill can be updated to 'confirmed' if later there are forensic proof that the target did not survive. These proofs can be something like debris or ops logs that said the pilot did not return.


Chaff can mislead a missile, even an AMRAAM or any claimed to be 'the best' missile out there. There are several related issues here.

When a missile is classified as 'fire and forget', it does not mean launch and leave. On the whole, we, meaning the entire military aviation community, did not have a good record of such a missile, even when we did designed and deployed such a missile. The 54 Phoenix was not only 'fire and forget' but actually 'launch and leave'. The Phoenix was not an 'integrated' weapon system precisely because of the 'launch and leave' design. Once launched, the pilot is free to leave the missile to its own devices. The missile carried its own active radar, discriminate its own target, select for home, and boresight on a target. The Phoenix's concept made the missile large, heavy, and time consuming for maintenance, especially for the electronics, which was not upgradable and
rapidly getting older as miniaturization progresses. So when the F-14 retired, the Phoenix system had to be retired as well.

So where does the phrase 'fire and forget' comes in?

Experience showed us that the longer the ranges the greater the odds of a failure to kill. The longer ranges requires the missile to have as much data as possible in order to do what the Phoenix was designed to do: active radar, discrimination, selection, home, and boresight. The more radar activities, the greater the odds of the target being aware of the missile threat, especially when the radar operation changes to boresight mode which produces intense and unique signal characteristics, which the target would confirm to itself that there is a missile threat. But if we reduce the range on when to launch the missile, we risks getting involved into a turning fight which despite the romanticism of WW II, no pilot want to get into such a fight in the first place.

The compromise is the somewhat arbitrary designation of 'mid range' which for the AIM-120 started from 50 km and now to 150 km which approaches the 190 km of the Phoenix. So much for 'mid range'.

To increase the odds of a kill, or given the range involved, at least a 'valid' kill, we have to sort of 'silence' the missile's own radar operations to the last possible moments. To do this, the AMRAAM's radar does not 'go active' until certain algorithmic solutions are satisfied, and these are secrets. Suffice to say for public discussion, that 'go active' point is generally the mid point between the launch location and the target's location.

For example, if the distance between launch and target is 100 km, the AMRAAM's radar will go active when it crosses the 40-50 km point. Less if the launch aircraft decides to continuously guide the missile instead of the missile using its own radar.

When the AMRAAM's radar is active is when the missile becomes a 'fire and forget' weapon because it is calculated that the target do not have sufficient time and distance to formulate any countermeasure, even if his radar warning receiver (RWR) alerted him to the missile threat.

This goes back to the statement that declared chaff cannot mislead the AMRAAM. Chaff can mislead the AMRAAM depends on when the missile was launched, when the parent aircraft severs its guidance, and when the AMRAAM's radar go active. The longer this distance, the greater the odds of success for chaff. If a pilot launched an AMRAAM at max or near max operational range and immediately abandons it, chaff WILL mislead this AMRAAM.

This is why modern air combat is no less mentally challenging than when pilots fought with guns at several hundred meters apart. The pilot must know his aircraft and weapons limits in order to create as ideal as possible the environment for the missile to succeed.


The AMRAAM have a proximity fusing system that detonates the warhead without the missile impacting the target. Proximity fusing increases the odds of a kill.

Most missiles have a self destruct operation when after a certain amount of time that the missile failed to acquire or reacquire the target. Whatever happened to the debris is a different issue.

 

[Ultima Thule]

I don't see, Man!

Anything to be proud on a very small incident. Past 70 years, India had loose territory to only against China in 1962.

Apart of this lost, Indian army has only achieved but not loose anything.

That's all only matters at the end!

Its a fun reading to see the comments for a very small incident.

Kill is kill, and why you jumping around about fake killing of your so Called 300 terrorist in balakot if it very small incident and claiming of fake shoot down of our F-16

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Kill is kill, and why you jumping around about fake killing of your so Called 300 terrorist in balakot if it very small incident and claiming of fake shoot down of our F-16

All governments make claims around the world.

It does not matter that actually, it's true or false. But, their people believed on the claims.

Same goes to Indian claim for shoot down a f16 and pak claim to shoot down a Su30mki.

 

[Ultima Thule]

All governments make claims around the world.

It does not matter that actually, it's true or false. But, their people believed on the claims.

Same goes to Indian claim for shoot down a f16 and pak claim to shoot down a Su30mki.

I am asking you that why are you jumping around if 26/27 was a very small incident??? take these arguments/advises of yours for your countrymen who is jumping around for killing and shoot down on 26/27

 

[TheTallGuy]

Our Indian friends are forgetting that AIM120C5 has home on jam mode as well.

what i cant understand is that our benevolent Indian posters cant find details of there own operations...zero...so they come along here and start asking questions or just for sake of it "troll". they cant tell you the Orbat in Engagement of 27th Feb. how many planes involved from which squadron. what happened afterwards.. did IAF send reinforcement in area of operation how many aircraft from where...None whatsoever...we have actually provided more info to them then they have gotten from there own air force or resources.

if they are asking question ...why cant they ask there own air force who was flying what ...they have no information...they are blind & deaf...they came here gains info go back discuss and find flaws in narrative and come back ask more info..

i feel pitty for them...

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Our Indian friends are forgetting that AIM120C5 has home on jam mode as well.

what i cant understand is that our benevolent Indian posters cant find details of there own operations...zero...so they come along here and start asking questions or just for sake of it "troll". they cant tell you the Orbat in Engagement of 27th Feb. how many planes involved from which squadron. what happened afterwards.. did IAF send reinforcement in area of operation how many aircraft from where...None whatsoever...we have actually provided more info to them then they have gotten from there own air force or resources.

if they are asking question ...why cant they ask there own air force who was flying what ...they have no information...they are blind & deaf...they came here gains info go back discuss and find flaws in narrative and come back ask more info..

i feel pitty for them...

You, actually have no clue...

I am asking you that why are you jumping around if 26/27 was a very small incident??? take these arguments/advises of yours for your countrymen who is jumping around for killing and shoot down on 26/27

I m not jumping but sometimes I feel bad that if people shows too much happiness on a fake claim. Otherwise, I don't brother actually... For us, its a very small incident and don't care... We lost a mig 21 but bigger lost was mi 17 helicopter with crew members (incidentally shoot down by IAF)

 

[Ultima Thule]

I m not jumping but sometimes I feel that if shows too much happiness on a fake claims

I not talking about but you whole country, what fakes claims we have now tell me, MKI shoot down, so you have F-16 claims, in other threads there is multiple clips From Youtube that something crashed in IOK (Near the LOC) by your media and on 27 FEB one news channel admit MKI was shot down