Wikileaks : India accused of torture and HR violations in Kashmir

[ajtr]

That is because these number is still small compared to the population of minorities living in the country .India has more than 150 million muslims and 25 million Christians. people from minority communities have been represented well in all fields in the country. But everyone cannot be satisfied or appeased and there is no need for it either.

How well they are represented we know dont we.say even sachar committee lies in report.do u?

 

[ajtr]

You have some radical, extremist views. I won't be surprised if you have some terrorist connections. I hope you get to your senses soon.

han han...having views opposite to establishment views is sure an act of terror but not the act of establishment sponsored terror attacks on its own people.

 

[Nalwa]

These leaks brought out what we Indians already knew but were ready to brush it under the carpet or ignore it as 'collateral damage'. The problem with our internal security establishment is that we realize too late that might doesn't always guarantee victory. The Center believed that it could replicate the military solution to the Punjab problem in Kashmir but 20 years later it doesn't seem like thats working out. What we need is a political approach in parallel to the military one.

 

[para-site]

han han...having views opposite to establishment views is sure an act of terror but not the act of establishment sponsored terror attacks on its own people.

Who prevents you from being part of establishment......why dont u do something about it rather than crying foul.......

 

[ajtr]

Who prevents you from being part of establishment......why dont u do something about it rather than crying foul.......

why should i be a part of establishment which has its hands soaked in the bloods of millions oppressed indians.

 

[jayron]

han han...having views opposite to establishment views is sure an act of terror but not the act of establishment sponsored terror attacks on its own people.

Having opposite views is certainly not bad but sympathizing with terrorists and glorifying their acts is worrying. Not to mention the obvious hate for "the others".

 

[jayron]

How well they are represented we know dont we.say even sachar committee lies in report.do u?

I can see that in my every day life. I don't need a report to suggest that except for a few incidents, India has been a harmonious society and some fascist bigots cannot change it.

 

[Iqbal_Brar]

lolll.. how is this even surprising?? Kashmir is actually a lot more improved situation.. in 1980s indian army.. or more likely Punjab police would go to Punjabi villages where they only suspected terrorists/freedom fighters (take your pick) were hiding.. didnt even know for sure.. nd would kill any male over 12 years of age.. some villages near pakistani border (all terrorists/freedom fighters used to cross border for weapons training and cross over from border) have pretty much wiped out male populations they have lot more ladies than guys in a state where overall there are more guys than girls.. its sad reality.. Kashmir Indian forces have been verrryyy nice and rosey... Punjab militancy was killed because the police didn't think for second before pulling trigger or killing innocent people.. human rights violations.. nothing new.. punjab saw far worse.. india indulged in far worse.. pakistan is same also enough human rights violations just look at pakistani army beating up old pashtun villagers in recent operations.. or shelling balochi villages with artillery... and america.. loll.. yeh right.. i think everyone forgot guantanamo bay.. orr maybe forget all the secret CIA prisons which america had all over world especially to torture people they captured.. same with afghanistan.. you think afghan army nd police don't use torture? they torture people everyday.. right in front of americans.. its world reality... not a surprise.. i could have told you.. indian army and police use torture routinely.. (but i think everybooddyyyy already knows dat.. we don't need US cables to tell us that lol)

 

[EjazR]

Well I think everyone would understand that HR violations would have occurred in Kashmir. Infact, the 1990s was the worst. In conflict situation it happens. Just like we have reports of HR violations in the Swat valley in 2008-2009 by Pakistani Army.

What is good to note is that ICRC notes that improvements are being made as noted in parts of the cable

GOI Points to Improvements

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6. (S) XXXXXXXXXXXX reported that during recent ICRC interactions with the GOI, officials have maintained that the human rights situation in Kashmir is "much better than it was in the 1990s," a view he also agreed with. Security forces no longer roused entire villages in the middle of the night and detained inhabitants indiscriminately, as they had as recently as the late 1990s. There is "more openness from medical doctors and the police," who have conceded that 95 percent of the information on particular cases is accurate. Ten years ago, there were some 300 detention centers; now there are "a lot fewer," he stated.
.
.
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Bright Spot

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10. (S) XXXXXXXXXXXX said the one bright spot in ICRC activities was with the security forces. Staff have conducted more than 300 sessions with SF on IHL in Kashmir and elsewhere, which have touched an estimated 20,000 junior grade officers in one way or another. Discussions are underway for further sessions with officers at the headquarters of the Southern Command in Pune (Maharashtra) and Northern Command in Udhampur (J&K).

COAS: Velvet Glove, Iron Fist

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11. (C) In a separate but related development, the media reported that COAS LTG JJ Singh made military discipline issues the centerpoint of a conference for army commanders April 5, following reports that Defense Minister Mukherjee was disturbed by continued reports of human rights violations by the security forces. Addressing the conference, Mukherkee observed that "we must realize that while dealing with insurgents, we are operating within our own territory and allegations of human rights violations will not only sully the image of the army, but also reduce our effectiveness in tackling militancy." As part of his "velvet glove, iron fist" approach, Singh has repeatedly stipulated that his officers should use "minimum force" and avoid "collateral damage" in their units in order to reverse declining standards in discipline.

Also there are plans to pass a torture bill through in the next session. That should also help in curtailing the practice of torture.

The Telegraph - Calcutta (Kolkata) | Nation | Death for death in torture bill

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

There is a difference between the Swat/Gitmo cases and these reported atrocities in IaK in that the other incidents were widely discussed in the media and the Governments and/or other concerned authorities (military primarily) publicly condemned, investigated and acted to address the situation.

Also, barring isolated cases, the US and Pakistan have primarily had issues with abuse of terrorists arrested from the battlefield (extrajudicial killings of terrorists and abuse in prisons), and the lack of proper process to deal with their cases. The Indians are accused of 'systematic abuses and torture', largely on civilians and innocent people.

What I find duplicitous in the case of the Kashmir atrocities, is that we heard nothing about 'widespread, systematic abuse, torture and atrocities' in the media at the level of the lesser US and Pakistani abuse allegations.

In fact, were it not for wikileaks, we still would not know about it, and I'll be very surprised if the US/West 'expresses concerns' over such reports and has 'concerns over the impact on US-India defence cooperation, per US law', as was indicated in the case of the alleged Pakistani extra-judicial killings, despite these being far more serious reports of systematic atrocities by Indian security forces.

 

[Spring Onion]

Question is what are the consequences of this.

India should be told you have no moral, ethical logical face to dream for UNSC with your state terrorism

 

[ares]

yes they did.check out the reports of enquiry ordered by Gen. kiyani.

Initial reaction ..complete denial of the entire incident claiming it is conspiracy by its enemies.

When human right organisation increase pressure..ordering court of inquiry to save face.

Now a few month later, whats the latest you have hear on the inquiry ordered.

 

[KALKI]

India should be told you have no moral, ethical logical face to dream for UNSC with your state terrorism

Ok! UNSC nahin dena toh mat do. India has already said that it won't bend backwards for UNSC seat.

It's not worth it. Plain and simple.

Bottomline: Kashmir stays with us.

P.S. BTW who will tell India that? Pakistan?

On Topic: None in this whole wide world has got the right to accuse India of any human rights violations. Who is righteous enough to do that?

 

[ares]

India should be told you have no moral, ethical logical face to dream for UNSC with your state terrorism

Though would be a dream come true for you..but unfortunately for you Pakistan is not at helm of things.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Though would be a dream come true for you..but unfortunately for you Pakistan is not at helm of things.

That is not a refutation of the point made by her.