Wikileaks : India accused of torture and HR violations in Kashmir

[ares]

That is not a refutation of the point made by her.

We live in a real world and not an ideal one...but truth remains if human rights abuses are brought into consideration some of the present UNSC members will be disqualified from their positions privileged club...and if and when such happens..I would gladly support her.

 

[Spring Onion]

Well I think everyone would understand that HR violations would have occurred in Kashmir. Infact, the 1990s was the worst. In conflict situation it happens. Just like we have reports of HR violations in the Swat valley in 2008-2009 by Pakistani Army.



]

BS comparison.

more than occasional human rights violation its matter of Indian State atrocities in an occupied country whereas if at all you want to compare Swat then you can compare it with Maoist, Naxals areas besides Manipur in India.

 

[GentlemanObserver]

Ok! UNSC nahin dena toh mat do. India has already said that it won't bend backwards for UNSC seat.

It's not worth it. Plain and simple.

Bottomline: Kashmir stays with us.

P.S. BTW who will tell India that? Pakistan?

On Topic: None in this whole wide world has got the right to accuse India of any human rights violations. Who is righteous enough to do that?

It's not worth it. Plain and simple.

Grape are Sour?

Bottomline: Kashmir stays with us.

This map would beg to differ...

None in this whole wide world has got the right to accuse India of any human rights violations. Who is righteous enough to do that?

Double standards much... Your lot can't stop playing violins for every tom dick and harry in Baluchistan and now you say people are not "righteous"enough to say India is alleged to have committed human rights abuses by non other then the ICRC?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

We live in a real world and not an ideal one...but truth remains if human rights abuses are brought into consideration some of the present UNSC members will be disqualified from their positions privileged club...and if and when such happens..I would gladly support her.

Why should we replicate past mistakes?

There is a glaring double standard here though, as I pointed out - while the West will continuously harp on the human rights violations in China and other Muslim countries, there has been almost nothing mentioned about these atrocities committed by Indian security forces.

At the very least we need a far more open and honest discussion about India's flaws, the occupation of Kashmir and the atrocities being committed in Kashmir and elsewhere in India, much like we have about China and other nations, while considering India's membership in the UNSC.

 

[KALKI]

Either way good luck with your endeavours...

Thank you very much, sir.

 

[ares]

Why should we replicate past mistakes?

There is a glaring double standard here though, as I pointed out - while the West will continuously harp on the human rights violations in China and other Muslim countries, there has been almost nothing mentioned about these atrocities committed by Indian security forces.

At the very least we need a far more open and honest discussion about India's flaws, the occupation of Kashmir and the atrocities being committed in Kashmir and elsewhere in India, much like we have about China and other nations, while considering India's membership in the UNSC.

There is a very basic flaw in your argument.
that is preservation human rights is not solely the responsibility of UNSC members or aspirants.
Any country which is a signatory of UN charter on preservation of human rights(ie all UN members) are suppose to preserve human rights.
So by this logic any country where human rights abuses takes place(including Pakistan) should kicked out of UN itself ??

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

There is a very basic flaw in your argument.
that is preservation human rights is not solely the responsibility of UNSC members or aspirants.
Any country which is a signatory of UN charter on preservation of human rights(ie all UN members) are suppose to preserve human rights.
So by this logic any country where abuse of human rights takes place(including Pakistan) should kicked out of UN itself ??

You are constructing a strawman - at not point did I argue that nations should be 'kicked out of the UN' - that is an argument you constructed, called a flaw, and then attributed to me.

What I did point out was that just as there is open discussion about the flaws of China and other nations in the UN, specifically with respect to Human Rights abuses, there needs to be open and honest discussion about the atrocities committed by India in Kashmir and elsewhere, while its candidature for the UNSC is being considered.

Now whether such an open and frank discussion will impact India's candidature or not, whether it will result in pressure on India to change or not, that is for the world community to decide. My only point is that we need an honest and frank discussion on the issue, much like we do about the flaws of China and even Russia for example.

 

[ares]

You are constructing a strawman - at not point did I argue that nations should be 'kicked out of the UN', that is an argument you constructed, called a flaw, and then attributed to me.

yes you are right you did not but Jana did wrt UNSC memebership criteria.

What I did point out was that just as there is open discussion about the flaws of China and other nations in the UN, specifically with respect to Human Rights abuses, there needs to be open and honest discussion about the atrocities committed by India in Kashmir and elsewhere, while its candidature for the UNSC is being considered.

Come on now, you and I both know that is all talk and no walk ever... even wrt to China and countries which are in USA's favor(eg India or pakistan) there is no talk.

Now whether such an open and frank discussion will impact India's candidature or not, whether it will result in pressure on India to change or not, that is for the world community to decide. My only point is that we need an honest and frank discussion on the issue, much like we do about the flaws of China and even Russia for example.

I support open and frank discussion but same standards should apply to all ..there are skeletons in everyone's closet..let them be all out in open, before we start passing judgments.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I support open and frank discussion but same standards should apply to all ..there are skeletons in everyone's closet..let them be all out in open, before we start passing judgments.

An that is indeed an argument India could make in its defence, but one cannot defend a position if it is not even up for discussion - and that is the primary issue here, the blatant double standards and hypocrisy in the West with respect to Indian atrocities and HR abuses vs those by China and other nations.

On a related note, can you now understand why Pakistanis do not trust the West and believe that there is a concerted campaign, based on double standards, to malign Pakistan in the Western media. How may years were US officials aware of these reports from the ICRC and just sat on them. They reacted to the reports from Swat within weeks!

How did a few incidents in Swat make it to the headlines, but systematic atrocities against a large population documented by the ICRC were nowhere to be seen for years until wikileaks brings them out?

 

[ares]

An that is indeed an argument India could make in its defence, but one cannot defend a position if it is not even up for discussion - and that is the primary issue here, the blatant double standards and hypocrisy in the West with respect to Indian atrocities and HR abuses vs those by China and other nations.

On a related note, can you now understand why Pakistanis do not trust the West and believe that there is a concerted campaign, based on double standards, to malign Pakistan in the Western media. How may years were US officials aware of these reports from the ICRC and just sat on them. They reacted to the reports from Swat within weeks!

How did a few incidents in Swat make it to the headlines, but systematic atrocities against a large population documented by the ICRC were nowhere to be seen for years until wikileaks brings them out?

These double standards(of the west) you are complaining about now..are you forgetting you are the biggest beneficiaries of them ..even before recent SWAT killings ..west never criticized you for your excesses or have we forgotten East Pakistan genocide and the famous blood telegram which followed.

Fact is west has no moral authority on human right with the kind of stuff thats been going on in their off shore prisons...they do what they think is best for them as we should all.

 

[amigo]

Every country in this world which is fighting for its soverginity & unity is accused of such things. nothing new for india.

P.S- if someone wants to pose danger to nation's unity, what should be expected- "showering flowers at them??????????

 

[ares]

BS comparison.

more than occasional human rights violation its matter of Indian State atrocities in an occupied country whereas if at all you want to compare Swat then you can compare it with Maoist, Naxals areas besides Manipur in India.

BS logic ....are human rights different for humans living in occupied and sovereign territories??

 

[SEAL]

Where is V k Singh he talked about 45 training camps but forget that he is running 200 torture cells in IOK.

 

[Mabs]

Guys, if i may add here that it would be insane to compare SWAT with IoK. The Kashmir conflict has been going on since 1947 while the SWAT refugees are already back in their homes - resettled and relieved.

I am glad that some of my Indian friends showed the courage to call a spade a spade, but at the same time please do not give yourself fake comfort by saying that everyone else does it too, so we are not alone.

The first step in the problem solving process is to ADMIT that there is something wrong,only then you are able to AMEND it.

A rising power should also raise its morality to keep rising.

 

[Hindustani]

You guys do know that police, security etc in J&K are Kashmiris right?